I can only agree.
Before learning about AS I sometimes wondered if I am sociopathic because I felt like everyone else was different and I could watch myself manipulating people like Nicole described - but I am not indifferent or without remorse or fixated on my own gain so that left me at a loss.
I don't think any psychological diagnosis ever fits all stereotypical symptoms, especially if does not have an associated phenotype, like down syndrome, for instance.
Unlike physical afflictions it issually it is more a diagnosis of best fit - and for me, at least, it fits rather well; not perfectly, but better than anything else and good enough to make sense to me.
Before learning about AS I sometimes wondered if I am sociopathic because I felt like everyone else was different and I could watch myself manipulating people like Nicole described - but I am not indifferent or without remorse or fixated on my own gain so that left me at a loss.
Because of how how verbally attacking this woman was calling me a sociopath, I couldn't help but start my research there. The remorse was what stood out as a glaring red flag that I couldn't be sociopathic. I've since learned that my emotions run hot or cold, and when they are cold it's very similar to alexithymia, so I can logically understand feeling indifferent (isn't that an oxymoron - 'feeling indifferent'?), but I do still care and quite deeply.
I wouldn't be surprised if there is a high correlation (not to be confused with causation) between sociopathy and alexithymia and autism. I'd really like to get the courage to send a message to Mr. Fallon here asking if he could test that theory.
Yes, I assume as much, might be interesting to look for an association there - I'm still looking for a BSc thesis topic and I want to do something about AS but I'd probably have difficulties finding sociopathic participants... Maybe as a PhD, sometime... I think the mechanisms used for "learning" social interactions might well be the same ones in AS/HFA/Sociopathy. Just the motivation can be quite different for the latter making it more"destructive" for social environments.
The hot and cold feelings are a really good description. Maybe most people around me have more hot running feelings so when I try to describe mine they categorise that as "no feelings". I have yet to find a way to describe how I truly care about someone so they understand it as "caring" and not as "using them to make myself feel better"...
Yes, I assume as much, might be interesting to look for an association there - I'm still looking for a BSc thesis topic and I want to do something about AS but I'd probably have difficulties finding sociopathic participants... Maybe as a PhD, sometime... I think the mechanisms used for "learning" social interactions might well be the same ones in AS/HFA/Sociopathy. Just the motivation can be quite different for the latter making it more"destructive" for social environments.
The big difference I see is that I tend to figure out how I want to act ahead of time, and then when the emotions turn on it confuses me. A lot of other people seem to act on their base emotional instincts in the moment and then rationalize their behaviors after the fact. In this manner, you could say there's learning by deciding and learning by doing. Learning by deciding is more difficult and takes more time and is very less instinctual, and the addition of emotions confounds it. Almost everything in my life that I learned I CHOSE to learn. I chose how to be outgoing. I chose how interact with this group or that group. I chose how I wanted to walk and how to poise myself and what personality I wanted to exude in this moment and that and what I wanted my handwriting to look like. I choose every day I walk into the grocery store if I'm in the mood to smile at the other patrons or not, but it's still based on some level of emotion, including feeling bad if I'm not smiling. If a true sociopath is indeed disconnected from their feelings, then they have no emotions confusing that process. Feeling bad about not smiling would not affect a sociopath. Knowing that not smiling might not net a certain reward is what the sociopath will focus on. At least, that's how I look at it.
Khyrean wrote:
The hot and cold feelings are a really good description. Maybe most people around me have more hot running feelings so when I try to describe mine they categorise that as "no feelings". I have yet to find a way to describe how I truly care about someone so they understand it as "caring" and not as "using them to make myself feel better"...
"I have never understood why it should be necessary to become irrational in order to prove that you care, or indeed why it should be necessary to prove it at all."
And, yeah, that's what I meant with the different motivations.
I would choose to smile because I know it makes group interaction smoother and the other people wouldn't change their behaviour towards me because they think I'm weird - which would mean additional (emotional) stress for me. But I still switch it off and on based on what I know about the situation and the effects of smiling vs. non-smiling. (and sometimes I notice, I forget to switch it off again when I meet someone I know and go on smiling at the next few people walking past me until I realise I still have a smile on my face... XD )
If I was sociopathic I would choose to smile because when those people like me I will get what I want from them more easily. If they didn't have anything I wanted, I wouldn't smile. Probably...
Still, would be interesting to conduct a comparative personality/neuropsychological study...
As an aside, JanuaryMan, I love your icon. The colors in it are quite awesome. Is that a picture you made?
A picture I stole
Reminds me of Silent Hill 2. Looks like James in the elevator in the hospital. If it is, then I just scored 10 points to my geek cred. (All my housemates and I are gamers, so I can't help but keep a look out.)
Still, would be interesting to conduct a comparative personality/neuropsychological study...
If you can do that, that would be awesome. I like coming up with ideas and creating tests for stuff like that, but actually running participants bored me to tears (I think that's the whole purpose for having undergrads to work with). All of my cognitive psychology lab work dealt with either dyslexia (because that was the post-grad's interest whom I was working under) or neural imaging during false memory tests. My interest, though, is in judgment and decision making as well as child development - as it relates to A.I. I'm not too horribly interested in cognitive dysfunction except for how it interplays with the above. I do find interest in the exceptions, though, because seeing how things break gives glimpses into how things are supposed to work.
Joined: Jan 02, 2012 Age: 28 Posts: 2623 Location: Hants, UK
Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 11:22 am Post subject:
NicoleG wrote:
JanuaryMan wrote:
NicoleG wrote:
As an aside, JanuaryMan, I love your icon. The colors in it are quite awesome. Is that a picture you made?
A picture I stole
Reminds me of Silent Hill 2. Looks like James in the elevator in the hospital. If it is, then I just scored 10 points to my geek cred. (All my housemates and I are gamers, so I can't help but keep a look out.)
You just earned 10 points, lady! Bonus points +5 _________________ "A man is but the product of his thoughts - what he thinks, he becomes." - Mahatma Gandhi
Woot! I really want to get this painting as a huge Giclee print for my wall. I've drooled over that thing ever since I first saw it in game. Your icon would make a pretty nice print as well.
Joined: Jan 02, 2012 Age: 28 Posts: 2623 Location: Hants, UK
Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 12:53 pm Post subject:
I think it's very possible for Asperger's to be successful and lead completely "normal" lives.
It all depends on their determination and interests. _________________ "A man is but the product of his thoughts - what he thinks, he becomes." - Mahatma Gandhi
Joined: Feb 13, 2010 Posts: 18778 Location: the island of loveable toy humans
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 8:18 am Post subject:
JanuaryMan wrote:
I think it's very possible for Asperger's to be successful and lead completely "normal" lives.
It all depends on their determination and interests.
as well as a generous dollop of good luck, good acquaintances and better timing. and anybody who would callously say "you make your own luck" has some learning to do.
Joined: Jan 02, 2012 Age: 28 Posts: 2623 Location: Hants, UK
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 9:18 am Post subject:
I guess I've had some good fortune.
Luck can be late though so it's not all about having luck by a certain age, too. _________________ "A man is but the product of his thoughts - what he thinks, he becomes." - Mahatma Gandhi
I guess I've had some good fortune.
Luck can be late though so it's not all about having luck by a certain age, too.
That's a good point to keep in mind. I can get depressed thinking about how much better things could have been had things been different in childhood and about how it's just too late for me now, bla, bla, bla.
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