why are feminist obsessed with Nice guys(TM)

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ArrantPariah
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17 Mar 2014, 7:39 am

sonofghandi wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
She said Hillary was a real ball buster.


I have always found it amusing that a man who is a ballbuster is usually seen as a powerful leader who makes sure things get done and get done right, whereas a woman who is a ballbuster is usually seen as some kind of unacceptable monster (or just a "b*tch" to a lot of people).


Nah. They're both annoying.



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17 Mar 2014, 7:40 am

Misslizard wrote:
They are too busy polishing their gun barrels to be interested in talk about sex. :D


We just have different ways of getting our dopamine rush.



AngelRho
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17 Mar 2014, 8:27 am

sonofghandi wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
She said Hillary was a real ball buster.


I have always found it amusing that a man who is a ballbuster is usually seen as a powerful leader who makes sure things get done and get done right, whereas a woman who is a ballbuster is usually seen as some kind of unacceptable monster (or just a "b*tch" to a lot of people).

I was just referring to heavy-handed tactics against other women specifically. Gennifer Flowers, for example. And then there was Lewinsky…



aghogday
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17 Mar 2014, 9:20 am

Well..let's face it..many feminist leaning folks..have let's just say ...a few more androgens..than their sister brethren..

Made fun of by the pretty gals in middle school..but still strong enough to get by..without getting beat up by the more feminine variety of the species...

And well..with higher androgens..comes a little more dominant stance on life and sex and all of that...

i know..as i used to be a beta male..and the feminist gals were all over me then..

yeah..i'm oldER now..many years ago and all of that...

But interesting now..as i present as alpha male in real life..finally at age 53...

The feminine girls are attracting to me now..at again oh my GOD AGE 53...(did not expect that in my wildest dreams when i was younger)!

Well i'm married in real life..so when they chase me down..seriously yes..! they chase me down when i'm dancing in stores and such as that...i say hey! come over here! and meet my wife..cause she is beautiful too....

Anyway.. human nature is so fun to explore freely..when ya have been a beta male and alpha male too...

But haha..i will always be a beta male at heart..and nerd and all of that...

Even if i do sorta look like a Bond character in real life..NOW..;)

At least that's what folks tell me tHere..
in REAL LIFE..NOW....;)

And once again..as mentioned in another thread..and such as that...

An excellent opportunity for me as anthropologist..to be a participant observer..

And really have some...

FUN..:)

Here ..'right'..NOW!

As a real life philosopher..free verse poet..scientist ..and all of that...!2

FREE IS KOOL....!


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Last edited by aghogday on 17 Mar 2014, 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

sonofghandi
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17 Mar 2014, 9:26 am

AngelRho wrote:
sonofghandi wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
She said Hillary was a real ball buster.


I have always found it amusing that a man who is a ballbuster is usually seen as a powerful leader who makes sure things get done and get done right, whereas a woman who is a ballbuster is usually seen as some kind of unacceptable monster (or just a "b*tch" to a lot of people).

I was just referring to heavy-handed tactics against other women specifically. Gennifer Flowers, for example. And then there was Lewinsky…


As opposed to the current DC political climate in which any hint of compromise or empathy is considered weakness? Heavy handed tactics are essentially required. How many times have I had to listen to a load of garbage about how weak Obama is for not wanting to launch an immediate, full scale offensive in Crimea? Ballbusting is considered a virtue, unless it is used to describe a woman.

It is part of the ingrained culture. Men are strong. Women are weak. Anyone who that does not fit that mould is generally subject to disdain, especially when in the spotlight.


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17 Mar 2014, 9:50 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
sonofghandi wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
She said Hillary was a real ball buster.


I have always found it amusing that a man who is a ballbuster is usually seen as a powerful leader who makes sure things get done and get done right, whereas a woman who is a ballbuster is usually seen as some kind of unacceptable monster (or just a "b*tch" to a lot of people).


Nah. They're both annoying.

Male boss gets called an as*hole,female a b***h,as AP said,neither are pleasant to work for.
Some people are just hateful to the employes.


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AngelRho
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17 Mar 2014, 10:04 am

sonofghandi wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
sonofghandi wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
She said Hillary was a real ball buster.


I have always found it amusing that a man who is a ballbuster is usually seen as a powerful leader who makes sure things get done and get done right, whereas a woman who is a ballbuster is usually seen as some kind of unacceptable monster (or just a "b*tch" to a lot of people).

I was just referring to heavy-handed tactics against other women specifically. Gennifer Flowers, for example. And then there was Lewinsky…


As opposed to the current DC political climate in which any hint of compromise or empathy is considered weakness? Heavy handed tactics are essentially required. How many times have I had to listen to a load of garbage about how weak Obama is for not wanting to launch an immediate, full scale offensive in Crimea? Ballbusting is considered a virtue, unless it is used to describe a woman.

It is part of the ingrained culture. Men are strong. Women are weak. Anyone who that does not fit that mould is generally subject to disdain, especially when in the spotlight.

That may be true, but that's not what I'm concerned about here. It's the idea that women, especially those who purport to support or promote women's rights or women's equality, are apt to the same glass-ceiling tactics (in business) that men are accused of. It's one thing to go all-out in the courtroom to defend someone. It's entirely another to completely ruin someone by attacking them in other contexts. Later on it came out that Bill DID have an affair with Flowers and the allegations concerning Lewinsky turned out to be true and practically impossible to counter.

How about this study...
http://psycnet.apa.org/psycinfo/2011-16723-011/
…that shows women will turn on each other to gain a competitive edge?

Or this article in the NYTimes…
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/11/jobs/11pre.html
…about women preferring infighting with other women, as opposed to men who will bully pretty much anyone regardless of sex?

Personally, I don't look at the culture. I look at who I work best with. I've always tended to work better with women with men and am more comfortable around women than men. But I'd choose a "strong" man over a "weak" woman any day. I'd choose a "strong" woman over a "weak" man any day. "Strength" vs. "weakness" the way I'd define it refers to personal effectiveness--not necessarily ability to do a job, but a balance between ability to do work and an aptitude for synergy. I can train anybody if ability is the issue. I can't magically transform you into a synergistic person. I find that I can more easily form synergistic relationships with women than men. If I had to look at culture, or if following culture defined my actions, I'd be screwed.

Strangely enough, btw, my freelance work tends to put me in those situations working with more women than men. My most consistent supporter for my freelance work is a women-run non-profit. I also get calls from time-to-time from wedding planners, which is a predominantly women-run business. It's not a discrimination thing against men, it's just the way it is. And it's not me trying to be an advocate for women. It's strictly a business thing. In my teaching business, it's typically mothers who take care of arranging extracurricular activities and bringing their kids to my studio, and men typically don't enjoy arranging those kinds of things. So when teaching kids I'm usually in more contact with moms than dads. I don't OBJECT to dealing with men despite how awkwardly I feel internally about it, but it remains a de facto thing. I've had plenty of male adult piano students, and I'm the father of two boys that I'm perfectly comfortable around.

So it's another one of those things in which I don't have a dog in the fight, and that's also why I don't linger in any lengthy feminist-oriented arguments. What I find astounding is that reports such as those I cited earlier come out, which indicates tremendous hypocrisy in the women community. I'm not making any arguments or defending any position here…I simply find it remarkable.



aghogday
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17 Mar 2014, 10:18 am

AngelRho wrote:
sonofghandi wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
sonofghandi wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
She said Hillary was a real ball buster.


I have always found it amusing that a man who is a ballbuster is usually seen as a powerful leader who makes sure things get done and get done right, whereas a woman who is a ballbuster is usually seen as some kind of unacceptable monster (or just a "b*tch" to a lot of people).

I was just referring to heavy-handed tactics against other women specifically. Gennifer Flowers, for example. And then there was Lewinsky…


As opposed to the current DC political climate in which any hint of compromise or empathy is considered weakness? Heavy handed tactics are essentially required. How many times have I had to listen to a load of garbage about how weak Obama is for not wanting to launch an immediate, full scale offensive in Crimea? Ballbusting is considered a virtue, unless it is used to describe a woman.

It is part of the ingrained culture. Men are strong. Women are weak. Anyone who that does not fit that mould is generally subject to disdain, especially when in the spotlight.

That may be true, but that's not what I'm concerned about here. It's the idea that women, especially those who purport to support or promote women's rights or women's equality, are apt to the same glass-ceiling tactics (in business) that men are accused of. It's one thing to go all-out in the courtroom to defend someone. It's entirely another to completely ruin someone by attacking them in other contexts. Later on it came out that Bill DID have an affair with Flowers and the allegations concerning Lewinsky turned out to be true and practically impossible to counter.

How about this study...
http://psycnet.apa.org/psycinfo/2011-16723-011/
…that shows women will turn on each other to gain a competitive edge?

Or this article in the NYTimes…
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/11/jobs/11pre.html
…about women preferring infighting with other women, as opposed to men who will bully pretty much anyone regardless of sex?

Personally, I don't look at the culture. I look at who I work best with. I've always tended to work better with women with men and am more comfortable around women than men. But I'd choose a "strong" man over a "weak" woman any day. I'd choose a "strong" woman over a "weak" man any day. "Strength" vs. "weakness" the way I'd define it refers to personal effectiveness--not necessarily ability to do a job, but a balance between ability to do work and an aptitude for synergy. I can train anybody if ability is the issue. I can't magically transform you into a synergistic person. I find that I can more easily form synergistic relationships with women than men. If I had to look at culture, or if following culture defined my actions, I'd be screwed.

Strangely enough, btw, my freelance work tends to put me in those situations working with more women than men. My most consistent supporter for my freelance work is a women-run non-profit. I also get calls from time-to-time from wedding planners, which is a predominantly women-run business. It's not a discrimination thing against men, it's just the way it is. And it's not me trying to be an advocate for women. It's strictly a business thing. In my teaching business, it's typically mothers who take care of arranging extracurricular activities and bringing their kids to my studio, and men typically don't enjoy arranging those kinds of things. So when teaching kids I'm usually in more contact with moms than dads. I don't OBJECT to dealing with men despite how awkwardly I feel internally about it, but it remains a de facto thing. I've had plenty of male adult piano students, and I'm the father of two boys that I'm perfectly comfortable around.

So it's another one of those things in which I don't have a dog in the fight, and that's also why I don't linger in any lengthy feminist-oriented arguments. What I find astounding is that reports such as those I cited earlier come out, which indicates tremendous hypocrisy in the women community. I'm not making any arguments or defending any position here…I simply find it remarkable.


In my regularly scheduled work years..i felt the similar...

The issue IS the stronger women are more willing to demonstrate real life empathy for other folks..while the stronger men are not...generally speaking..

It is impossible to have HUMAN syNERGY without DEMONSTRATING human EMPATHY for other folks.. in general...

And so far.. women are inherently better at this..and now that they are gaining courage to set themselves free..if men do not decompress..the repression of culture that keeps emotions of empathy in prison..women will continue to gain..and win in MOST all areas of life...

Strength in cognition..mechanical cognition that gets the job done..along with strength in social.. empathic cognition..that makes folks work together well..creating and producing..IS wHere IT reALLY IS AT..to make life synergisticAlly work..for the entire human race...

But again..those who do not adapt..will simply be...

left behind..with not much to gain..or offer...in a new age..of FREEDOM..OF EXPRESSION..AND WHEREVER A PERSON WANTS TO WORK..with the lesser chains of having to work for an employer for health care etc....ETC..etc...

Freedom is ringing..NOW..greater that ever..if one has ears..

And Hears IT
NOW!

but again.. those who don't..
will simply
be..
..........left..
........be
hind....

...

.


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Last edited by aghogday on 17 Mar 2014, 10:24 am, edited 2 times in total.

ArrantPariah
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17 Mar 2014, 10:18 am

Misslizard wrote:
Male boss gets called an as*hole,female a b***h,as AP said,neither are pleasant to work for.
Some people are just hateful to the employes.


If you say anything to the female variety, though, she will invariably respond with "you're just annoyed with me because I'm a woman", and then turn the spitefulness up, more than a few notches.



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17 Mar 2014, 10:34 am

It's sure possible that some will say that.Consider how many males make jokes like "what's a little lady like you know about business,etc......",that bad male behavior gets projected onto all males.Men should police other men,stand up and tell them not to make comments like that.I think some women are over defensive because of remarks like that.My ex like to jokingly say,"what do you know,you're just a woman."But he didn't mean it as a joke,he really believes women are less than men.We are all bad drivers,gold diggers,evil ,sluts.etc.... in his mind.So if women have to put up with men like this,they may be cranky.


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17 Mar 2014, 10:59 am

Seething anger and resentment on the part of a supervisor is not a good thing.



Misslizard
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17 Mar 2014, 11:04 am

Men are just as likely to seethe.If they cheat on wifey,she divorces him, she has a better lawyer,then the males are likely to seethe.Maybe the secretary pool no longer will give him BJ's,now he's seething and festering.A bad combo for employees.


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aghogday
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17 Mar 2014, 11:26 am

Argh..yeah..i've had some supervisors like that ..no fun at all..

But on the other hand..after supervising 31 to 130 employees..that ain't no fun either..

I always wanted to serve..but i served so good 'they' put me in charge...

That part really sucked..as my nature is not policing the behavior and work ethics of other folks...

i rather get the job done..
my
self..with a little help
from
my
friends...co-workers or whatever ..
but hell NO! i do not want to dominate others...

It also kinda sucks when folks are extra nice to ya cause they feel like they have to be...

IN supervisor-employee relationship...

The top dog ..gets no REAL FRIENDS...USUALLY....overall...

I'd rather be helping the pack..free lance..lone wolf..maverick.. and all of that....


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17 Mar 2014, 1:37 pm

Misslizard wrote:
Men are just as likely to seethe.If they cheat on wifey,she divorces him, she has a better lawyer,then the males are likely to seethe.Maybe the secretary pool no longer will give him BJ's,now he's seething and festering.A bad combo for employees.


Well, yes, but a woman in that position can yell "Sexual Harassment" or "Sexual Discrimination" or "Sexual Objectification" and make a stink.

A man has considerably less recourse.



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17 Mar 2014, 1:52 pm

What if it's male on male?What if your boss who is considerably bigger physically than you,wants you to work late*hint hint*,he is seething,festering and Republican!!Would you be comfortable being alone with him??What if you thought you'd lose your job if you didn't stay with him??


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ArrantPariah
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17 Mar 2014, 2:31 pm

Well, I'm just glad that my working days are over.