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NeantHumain Phoenix

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Joined: Jun 25, 2004 Posts: 3723 Location: St. Louis, Missouri
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2005 7:27 pm Post subject: Character Flaws and Asperger's Syndrome |
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The psychiatric literature refers to them as personality disorders: character flaws. Everyone has a few of them, but I am wondering whether AS exacerbates inherited personality traits (i.e., temperament), leading to a higher likelihood of developing a personality trait outside the normal range (e.g., either too much or too little extraversion). Asperger's syndrome and the autistic spectrum more generally probably carry with them a few personality tendencies (e.g., preference for routine).
I have read some research that indicates children with ADHD are more likely to develop a personality disorder (especially the Cluster B personality disorders), and I'm wondering if AS is the same.
These character flaws in AS probably come in two styles: those innate to autism and the exacerbation of other genetically inherited temperamental traits.
I noticed that, in my young-adults-with Asperger's-syndrome support group, everyone (including me) showed some strong signs of personality disorder. Maybe adults with AS who need support and therapy most are those with comorbid personality disorder. Among NTs, on the other hand, I have noticed the majority of them have personalities that tend towards one style or another, but most of them are still fairly flexible, cooperative, and aware of other people's sometimes conflicting needs and desires.
It would be wrong of me to mention other people's character flaws here—since everyone has them—but I have no problem mentioning my own vices (I believe it is best to share your best attributes as well as your weaknesses with others; it is dishonest to give anyone a false, overidealized impression of yourself, in my opinion).
- I am too self-indulgent. When I really want something, I can't get my mind off it until I have it. I desire immediate pleasure maybe a little bit too much. I am almost addicted to sweets and good-tasting food in general. I tend to binge-eat when bored.
- When I am convinced I am right, I rarely back down even if there is little to be gained from the disagreement. In this sense, I am quite strong willed and stubborn. I am not intimidated away from my beliefs.
- I am usually a little too passive and agreeable. In contrast to the previously mentioned strength of will, I am usually helpful to the point of masochism, nearly. I very rarely express much disagreement unless it's a strong principle I am firm in. I generally am not very willing to speak up for myself; I'm very shy. I sometimes put things too "diplomatically."
- I am very lazy. I do things at a leisurely pace usually, but I do get assignments finished on time almost always. I might half-ass the work, though, if I feel it is a waste of my time and rather not be doing it, especially if it's probably not going to be checked thoroughly. I rarely go beyond the requirements unless I am genuinely interested in it.
- I can be pedantic when I know a subject very well and am interested in it.
- I cannot handle uncertainty. I must know definitively whether someone likes me or not, when something is supposed to happen, etc. I tend to ask questions about these things obsessively until my mind has a handle on the future; this annoys people who prefer to go with the flow. I essentially must know every facet of something or someone I am concerned with.
- I become bored very easily. When I become bored, I tend to become either depressed or frustrated. I don't derive much pleasure from doing things on my own and might even "stir the cauldron" to bring things to a higher level of excitement when my "boredom quotient" is too high for me to do things like work well.
- When I am tired, hungry, bored, etc., I tend to be a little less pleasant to be around or more self-centered. These immediate concerns are the one thing I can think of, and so I must take of those above all else. An extreme example of this is when I lost my wallet at Wal-Mart, panicked, and went off on my dad after he threatened me.
- I am too inconsistent and sporadic. I do things when I feel like it; when an idea catches my interest, I do it; but I often don't come back to it for a while, if at all, after the initial enthusiasm has worn out.
- I am too oblivious to what's happening around me. My reactions to external events seem to be mostly guided by the thoughts swirling around in my head at the time. If I am feeling depressed, I will sense every interaction as negative. My tendency to overanalyze things leads me to conclusions that are artificial. In some sense, I am well aware of what's going on (the concrete events); but, at another level, I am away "in my own world." My analysis leads me astray. This detachment has sometimes led me to act outright bizarrely. For example, last spring at my old college, I began to ruminate on my failures and felt like I was a lost individual. I had to triumph over conformity in small ways; I chased after a stray cat a few times just to pick it up and hold it. Of course, other people probably just saw this as freaky; I believed I was putting my individuality over other people's standards of proper conduct. I usually only realize just how out of whack these things are well afterwards.
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Litguy Phoenix


Joined: Aug 18, 2005 Posts: 669 Location: New Jersey
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2005 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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| I stress myself out over things over which I have no control. I often take it out on others. |
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julieme Pileated woodpecker


Joined: Jun 13, 2005 Posts: 184 Location: Wisconsin
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2005 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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According to the Big Book a character defect is something that gets in the way of my usefulness to myself and others.
In that sense fear in all it's forms is probably my worst defect. Not offering help because I'm afraid of how someone will react. Not trying because I'm afraid to fail...
I work on that alot. Today I say fear is false evidence appearing real |
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nirrti_rachelle Go Tigers!

Joined: Jul 22, 2005 Age: 33 Posts: 1187 Location: The Dirty South
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2005 9:26 pm Post subject: Re: Character Flaws and Asperger's Syndrome |
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| NeantHumain wrote: | The psychiatric literature refers to them as personality disorders: character flaws. Everyone has a few of them, but I am wondering whether AS exacerbates inherited personality traits (i.e., temperament), leading to a higher likelihood of developing a personality trait outside the normal range (e.g., either too much or too little extraversion). Asperger's syndrome and the autistic spectrum more generally probably carry with them a few personality tendencies (e.g., preference for routine).
I have read some research that indicates children with ADHD are more likely to develop a personality disorder (especially the Cluster B personality disorders), and I'm wondering if AS is the same.
These character flaws in AS probably come in two styles: those innate to autism and the exacerbation of other genetically inherited temperamental traits.
I noticed that, in my young-adults-with Asperger's-syndrome support group, everyone (including me) showed some strong signs of personality disorder. Maybe adults with AS who need support and therapy most are those with comorbid personality disorder. Among NTs, on the other hand, I have noticed the majority of them have personalities that tend towards one style or another, but most of them are still fairly flexible, cooperative, and aware of other people's sometimes conflicting needs and desires.
It would be wrong of me to mention other people's character flaws here—since everyone has them—but I have no problem mentioning my own vices (I believe it is best to share your best attributes as well as your weaknesses with others; it is dishonest to give anyone a false, overidealized impression of yourself, in my opinion).
- I am too self-indulgent. When I really want something, I can't get my mind off it until I have it. I desire immediate pleasure maybe a little bit too much. I am almost addicted to sweets and good-tasting food in general. I tend to binge-eat when bored.
- When I am convinced I am right, I rarely back down even if there is little to be gained from the disagreement. In this sense, I am quite strong willed and stubborn. I am not intimidated away from my beliefs.
- I am usually a little too passive and agreeable. In contrast to the previously mentioned strength of will, I am usually helpful to the point of masochism, nearly. I very rarely express much disagreement unless it's a strong principle I am firm in. I generally am not very willing to speak up for myself; I'm very shy. I sometimes put things too "diplomatically."
- I am very lazy. I do things at a leisurely pace usually, but I do get assignments finished on time almost always. I might half-ass the work, though, if I feel it is a waste of my time and rather not be doing it, especially if it's probably not going to be checked thoroughly. I rarely go beyond the requirements unless I am genuinely interested in it.
- I can be pedantic when I know a subject very well and am interested in it.
- I cannot handle uncertainty. I must know definitively whether someone likes me or not, when something is supposed to happen, etc. I tend to ask questions about these things obsessively until my mind has a handle on the future; this annoys people who prefer to go with the flow. I essentially must know every facet of something or someone I am concerned with.
- I become bored very easily. When I become bored, I tend to become either depressed or frustrated. I don't derive much pleasure from doing things on my own and might even "stir the cauldron" to bring things to a higher level of excitement when my "boredom quotient" is too high for me to do things like work well.
- When I am tired, hungry, bored, etc., I tend to be a little less pleasant to be around or more self-centered. These immediate concerns are the one thing I can think of, and so I must take of those above all else. An extreme example of this is when I lost my wallet at Wal-Mart, panicked, and went off on my dad after he threatened me.
- I am too inconsistent and sporadic. I do things when I feel like it; when an idea catches my interest, I do it; but I often don't come back to it for a while, if at all, after the initial enthusiasm has worn out.
- I am too oblivious to what's happening around me. My reactions to external events seem to be mostly guided by the thoughts swirling around in my head at the time. If I am feeling depressed, I will sense every interaction as negative. My tendency to overanalyze things leads me to conclusions that are artificial. In some sense, I am well aware of what's going on (the concrete events); but, at another level, I am away "in my own world." My analysis leads me astray. This detachment has sometimes led me to act outright bizarrely. For example, last spring at my old college, I began to ruminate on my failures and felt like I was a lost individual. I had to triumph over conformity in small ways; I chased after a stray cat a few times just to pick it up and hold it. Of course, other people probably just saw this as freaky; I believed I was putting my individuality over other people's standards of proper conduct. I usually only realize just how out of whack these things are well afterwards.
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These aren't unique to people with AS at all. In fact, from what I've experienced, these traits are more extreme in NTs than they are in aspies. It's just that whenever we have them, they're viewed from the standpoint of pathology because of our AS. _________________ "There is difference and there is power. And who holds the power decides the meaning of the difference." --June Jordan |
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Sarcastic_Name Don't look.

Joined: Mar 27, 2005 Age: 20 Posts: 3582
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Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2005 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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I procrastenate like no one you've ever met. And yet I feel guilty about doing homework at any place but home unless given permission otherwise. I almost never do homework, especially work in which I'm "practicing" something I 've mastered in minutes. This is why my Algebra grade was a C, I never did homework but aced tests.
I'm somewhat of a pack rat. I have issues with throwing away boxes and papers. I have a 3 year old bank statement from an account I stopped using 3 months ago.
I manipulate for pleasure, especially my little brother. When he does something that even slighlt annoys me or makes a false statement, I push his buttons and which him explode. Oh, the fun I have when I'm forced into his presence.
I don't like work I see as pointless or as busywork, and usually don't do it. Unless of course I enjoy it.
I am in constant solitude the second school gets out, unless I go to work.
I'm ego-centric. I naturally think about myself before others, mostly because I have a general disliking for most of humanity.
I get bored trying to teach myself something new, I almost always need a teacher.
I forget words I don't use or hear often, especially sexual slang.
I can rant forever about negative things such as pointing out all my negative traits.
I'm a pessi-realist, but I see this as a positive thing. _________________ (Currently undergoing personality reboot) |
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thatrsdude Proud owner of a custom title


Joined: Jul 15, 2005 Posts: 1176 Location: SA, Australia
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Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:19 am Post subject: |
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None. I'm perfect.  _________________ 255 characters max. Type your signature with HTML coding |
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DrizzleMan Phoenix


Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 814
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Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2005 5:59 am Post subject: |
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My main character flaw is that however much I analyse my character flaws, I don't do enough about them.
Hmm ... the one flaw to rule them all. _________________ -to the best of my knowledge I am NA/NT, INTP/j-
Signature quote: "I apologise in advance for the cliches." |
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PhoenixKitten Vivi's Familiar


Joined: Jun 14, 2005 Age: 22 Posts: 1609 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2005 6:26 am Post subject: |
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I'm too good to have character flaws!
(Note the joke...)  _________________ ...though fire may burn & flames envelop me, I will arise from the ashes... |
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Serissa Ex-Moderator
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Joined: Jul 11, 2005 Posts: 4570 Location: A DEN OF INIQUITY!!!
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Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2005 8:55 am Post subject: |
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| nirrti_rachelle wrote: |
These aren't unique to people with AS at all. In fact, from what I've experienced, these traits are more extreme in NTs than they are in aspies. It's just that whenever we have them, they're viewed from the standpoint of pathology because of our AS. |
Excellent point. In my abnromal psychology textbook from last year, the only mental illness chapter that started with a disclaimer against first-year medical student syndrome was the personality disorders chapter. It said pretty much everyone shows signs of these; it's just the severity of the symptoms which would indicate a personality disorder or not. For example, (someone mentioned procrastination so we'll go with that, easy) do you tend to procrastinate for a few days before doing things, or a few weeks? |
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NeantHumain Phoenix

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Joined: Jun 25, 2004 Posts: 3723 Location: St. Louis, Missouri
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Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2005 10:13 am Post subject: |
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| DrizzleMan wrote: | My main character flaw is that however much I analyse my character flaws, I don't do enough about them.
Hmm ... the one flaw to rule them all. |
Laughing, out loud!  |
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Sophist Professor of Pedantry


Joined: Apr 24, 2005 Posts: 6170 Location: St. Louie
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Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2005 10:59 am Post subject: |
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| Serissa wrote: | | nirrti_rachelle wrote: |
These aren't unique to people with AS at all. In fact, from what I've experienced, these traits are more extreme in NTs than they are in aspies. It's just that whenever we have them, they're viewed from the standpoint of pathology because of our AS. |
Excellent point. In my abnromal psychology textbook from last year, the only mental illness chapter that started with a disclaimer against first-year medical student syndrome was the personality disorders chapter. It said pretty much everyone shows signs of these; it's just the severity of the symptoms which would indicate a personality disorder or not. For example, (someone mentioned procrastination so we'll go with that, easy) do you tend to procrastinate for a few days before doing things, or a few weeks? |
Yes, for every Personality, there are Personality Styles and Personality Disorders. It just depends on how much your personality disrupts your life. If it is a real problem, it would be considered a disorder. Though, it is true, the lines are often blurred and it is difficult to tell. It could be a severe problem in one situation like work or home and then not so much in another. This would likely be a borderline area. _________________ Autism Speaks: The Walmart of the 501c's.
GESTALT: An Autism and Psychology Discussion Forum
http://asdgestalt.com
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