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granatelli
Toucan
Joined: Apr 01, 2009
Posts: 273
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 Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:55 pm Post subject: Am I hoping for too much? Aspie parenting issue. |
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I am an NT male. My wife is a recently dxd aspie. Mid 40's. I have two children from a previous marriage that live wth us part time. My wife has recently started taking meds & that has been very helpful to calm her anixiety & irritation levels. I stress, very helpful. She is functioning much better and not nearly as cranky as she used to be. In fact, she's almost like a new woman.
The problem is though she is still, IMO, very cold & businesslike with the younger child. She seems to be irritated by the kid all the time. Very loveless. And look, I don't expect her to love my kid the way I do, but I would like for her to occasionally at least pretend that she likes her. She says, "Why pretend? I lot of the time I don't like her. She's an irritating little kid. She talks too much and crinkles paper and jumps around the house making noise for no reason". All of which is true, but hey, she's a kid. a work in progress.
I tell her "It's not what you say but it's how you say it". I understand if she needs the kid to change her behaviour sometimes, I just wish she could be a little more diplomatic about it. She asks me "Why not just be honest?". For her everything is just so black & white, right or wrong.
Can an aspie ever learn to the art of diplomacy? Or will she forever be just blunt & straight to the point w/little understanding for the small nuances that make up family life? |
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OregonBecky
Phoenix
Joined: Oct 01, 2007
Age: 56
Posts: 1031
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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I never liked kids because I thought they were boring. I wondered why every other woman in the world seemed to go nuts over babies. What do babies do that's so interesting? I wondered about this because I loved animals a lot. Why not kids? My husband wanted kids. I figured that maybe I'd get some motherly instincts if I gave birth, like some motherly hormones would kick in. I guess they did. I was a devoted mother when they were babies but as they became little kids, they drove me crazy.
I knew something was still wrong with how I felt about kids, even as a mother, when I'd go to the park with another mother to watch our kids play and be bored to death. One thing, though was, I noticed, kids loved talking to me. I realized it was because I thought they were boring that I'd think up questions and subjects that I thought would make them more interesting to me. Maybe they liked having their brains tweaked. My son's friends loved talking to me but, alas, I still had a short attention span so I'd try to escape without hurting feelings.
As the kids got older, I found them much more interesting. My kids are adults now. We're all very close. My sons say they're very lucky to have me as a mom. I don't get it.
I remember when my best friend had a kid long before I had kids. She expected me to adore him. I tried but failed. He deserved better from me.
I'm trying to think of any advice for you and all I can think of is, when kids get older they get more interesting, at least from my experience. I also think a lot of my boredom and moodiness with the kids came from constant low level anxiety. Maybe as the kids got older, they did a better job of distracting me from my anxiety.
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CleverKitten
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 07, 2008
Age: 19
Posts: 929
Location: Norfolk, Virginia, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:38 pm Post subject: |
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As long as your wife is effective and consistent in teaching your kid what's right and what's wrong, and helping to turn your child into a well-behaved and productive citizen, why should it matter whether she does it "lovingly" or "business-like"?
In my experience, as a child, I enjoyed when people treated me like an adult (i.e. speaking to me using advance vocabulary, using normal tone of voice, normal facial expressions) rather than making googly faces at me and talking baby talk.
But then again... I was an autistic child. Maybe normal children would enjoy the exact opposite of what I enjoyed.
Anyway, I am now very well-behaved and much more mature than many of my peers. This was because I was treated like a mature person and expected to act mature from a young age.
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"Life is demanding without understanding."
- Ace of Base
"I have an obscene thirst for pointless trivia and other bullsh*t."
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DonkeyBuster
Phoenix
Joined: May 12, 2009
Age: 52
Posts: 916
Location: New Mexico, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | She talks too much and crinkles paper and jumps around the house making noise for no reason" |
Looks to me like part of the difficulty is the noise is probably PAINFUL for your wife... that sensory overload part of being Aspie. It's hard to be civil, kind, or diplomatic when you're in pain... this is a major contributor to why I don't like kids.
So, with that info, maybe there's a work-around?
Believe me, the pain is very, very real. If you take it seriously and don't blow it off, I think the two of you may be able to find a creative way of reducing your wife's pain and helping her be a little more comfortable with your daughter.
Good luck. |
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Zsazsa
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 20, 2007
Posts: 1030
Location: Upstate New York, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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Children are incomplete persons...they are growing, developing and changing every minute of each day. Children also, do not
understand things the way adults do as their brains are still in development. What your wife believes as honesty and bluntness
in her "business-like attitude"can be miscontrued as child abuse. A child is not a Corporate Executive. Children need patience,
understanding, tolerance and allowances for mistakes as they grow and develop. Life is a learning experience for them.
I hope your wife is receiving counseling in addition to medication. |
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CelticGoddess
Lost in a song
Joined: Feb 07, 2006
Age: 35
Posts: 2957
Location: Toronto, ON
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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I can see both sides here. As an Aspie mum myself I understand her logic and black and white thinking. But at the same time, I would be mortified if someone treated my child like that. I can't be anything but loving around children, whether they're mine or someone elses. But, I chose to be a Mum. Some Aspies really don't like younger children and find it very difficult to be around them. How old is your youngest? Could you intervene more to lessen the blow of her bluntness? Sometimes you have to take a situation and break it down in sections. This is what happened, this how you reacted, here are some alternatives. That might help. 
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"You spent 10 years not rockin the boat and look where it got you? Tip the f***ing boat and swim for shore"
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Postperson
The Daughter of Indifference
Joined: Jul 10, 2004
Age: 52
Posts: 4314
Location: Uz
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:40 pm Post subject: |
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Some children are ok with that 'businesslike' treatment, especially from a step parent. They may resent a more emotional approach in that 'you're not my REAL mother!' way. And the biological mother may resent a more affectionate approach too. I think you want her to be more affectionate with the child for your sake, not the child's, so maybe you need to explain the subtlety of that to her.
Last edited by Postperson on Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:47 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ViperaAspis
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 27, 2009
Age: 41
Posts: 929
Location: Portland, OR
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Can an aspie ever learn to the art of diplomacy? |
Yes and no, sir. Yes and no. I have been quite successful in the art of "fifteen minute diplomacy". This came after long-fought-for mastery of "ten minute diplomacy" and "five minute diplomacy", of course. I use it on the job when dealing with organics directly. I'm trying to learn how to apply it here in a digital arena both because my email tone needs polish and because I have never ventured into an online forum before WP. I'm learning. It's a process.
The "no" part of this answer comes when I am required to use diplomacy on a 24/7 basis. I inevitably crumble, because diplomacy is quite difficult to maintain. It is one of many masks I wear to integrate better with society as a whole. Can she learn diplomacy with school officials? Probably.* Can she learn diplomacy when dealing (infrequently) with co-workers? Probably.* But the chances of her maintaining this while dealing with children or with you on an ongoing basis is next to impossible. It's like asking an OregonBecky to change her spots. You'll have to meet her halfway at best. Perhaps even 3/4 of the way, because you're talking about changing her very nature. Maybe during pickup or drop-off of the kids, she can learn to be diplomatic for five minutes with your ex before she needs to bow out, for example.
Another thing working strongly against you is that your visitation is not long-term enough for the kids to become a part of her pattern. Patterns and sameness are our manna. If your kids were on a visitation schedule where they come for 1/2 year on and 1/2 year off you'd have a good shot at her adapting much better and possibly even missing them being around (sameness, remember!). Donkeybuster raises an excellent point about sensory overload as well. If she's fresh off the Dx, she may not even know about this trait or how to minimize it.
But most of all, remember the positives here. Your kids aren't going away with cigarette burns on their arms or being deprived of food for a weekend. There are far worse mothers out there.
-- Vip
*The dark gift manifests itself differently in all of us; she may or not be able to do this after study and practice. Yes, study, like it's a school subject or something, because to us it is
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granatelli
Toucan
Joined: Apr 01, 2009
Posts: 273
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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Thank you all for the thoughtful advise. She really is a good person and means well but sometimes she just doesn't "get" the subtle things that make all the difference in the world.
In any case, it's a work in progress! Cheers! |
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granatelli
Toucan
Joined: Apr 01, 2009
Posts: 273
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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I get that part of it and to some degree I don't disagree with you but remember, it's an 8 year old child. Not a recruit in the Marine Corp. : )
| CleverKitten wrote: | As long as your wife is effective and consistent in teaching your kid what's right and what's wrong, and helping to turn your child into a well-behaved and productive citizen, why should it matter whether she does it "lovingly" or "business-like"?
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granatelli
Toucan
Joined: Apr 01, 2009
Posts: 273
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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The child is 8. If I try to intervene it often takes a turn for the worse as she feels I'm undermining her. I agree with much of her basic parent philosophy. It's just that her delivery is rather blunt sometimes. That & she has a very hard time being able to make small adjustments and accomodations if needed. "No, that's not the way we agreed to do it. That's against the rules". Well sure, that's great in principal. But you know kids. And you know how life is. It's always throwing you little curve balls you need to make adjustments for.
| CelticGoddess wrote: | | I can see both sides here. As an Aspie mum myself I understand her logic and black and white thinking. But at the same time, I would be mortified if someone treated my child like that. I can't be anything but loving around children, whether they're mine or someone elses. But, I chose to be a Mum. Some Aspies really don't like younger children and find it very difficult to be around them. How old is your youngest? Could you intervene more to lessen the blow of her bluntness? Sometimes you have to take a situation and break it down in sections. This is what happened, this how you reacted, here are some alternatives. That might help. |
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Saja
Raven
Joined: May 12, 2009
Posts: 103
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| Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 2:25 am Post subject: |
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Well, I love my children intensely (they're 10, 8, and 1), and even so, I often act like the evil witch mother from h*ll. As DonkeyBuster and ViperaAspis said, the noise and the irregularity may be making this very hard for her.
As well as just not being a "kid person," as OregonBecky describes. Kids do nothing for me. I'm great and infinitely patient with babies, but have never felt much affection for kids not my own. And, past the toddler stage, even my own kids don't call up massive motherly feelings in me. Couple that with your wife's Aspie honesty, and it's unlikely she will ever be a warm, cookie-baking, tell-me-about-your-day kind of stepmom. Though I know that isn't what you're asking for--you're just asking her to be a little more sensitive to an eight-year-old girl's needs, and I do think that's reasonable. As long as you aren't also subconsciously expecting your wife to bond with your daughter and for them to have a super-close relationship. It could happen, but it's very unlikely, and not even required--your daughter has her own mom. In fact, as long as your wife is being civil to your daughter and your daughter doesn't feel like your wife hates her or anything like that, your daughter may be really pleased that your wife is acting like your wife and not her new mother.
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Much madness is divinest sense, to a discerning eye; much sense, the starkest madness. --Emily Dickinson |
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DonkeyBuster
Phoenix
Joined: May 12, 2009
Age: 52
Posts: 916
Location: New Mexico, USA
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| Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 9:42 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | That & she has a very hard time being able to make small adjustments and accomodations if needed. "No, that's not the way we agreed to do it. That's against the rules". Well sure, that's great in principal. But you know kids. And you know how life is. |
Ah. The flexibility issue... and the NT view of it. To expect your wife to be flexible and fluid is probably unrealistic, at least at this point. Depending on the extensiveness of the AS, it may never be attainable.
I think that perhaps you personally might benefit from a little counseling on what being an Aspie means in terms of how life is experienced... it's very different from your experience. It will help you formulate realistic expectations of what your wife is capable of and what she simply doesn't have the wiring for.
My NT partner benefitted enormously from a couple of educational counseling sessions. We have a much more realistic understanding of what is possible, how to strategize around various limitations (NT and AS), and how to cope with sensory overload, meltdowns, exhaustion, emotional neediness, social neediness, and very different processing styles.
Imposing NT expectations on your AS wife will ultimately do harm... |
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ViperaAspis
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 27, 2009
Age: 41
Posts: 929
Location: Portland, OR
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| Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I think that perhaps you personally might benefit from a little counseling on what being an Aspie means in terms of how life is experienced... it's very different from your experience. It will help you formulate realistic expectations of what your wife is capable of and what she simply doesn't have the wiring for. |
Now that's some sage advice right there. It could even improve or save your marriage down the road. It's not her issue so much as both of your issue now.
<-- Puts on avuncular NT mask, grabs your shoulder with paw and looks sternly into your eyes, speaks:
You're going to need some internal strength for this whole situation, friend.
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Who am I? This guy! http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt97863.html |
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DonkeyBuster
Phoenix
Joined: May 12, 2009
Age: 52
Posts: 916
Location: New Mexico, USA
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| Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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Vip Asp... thanks.
Still love the kitty.  |
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