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Tequila
Trust the people!
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 26045
Location: Lancashire, UK
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 Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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It's a much bigger problem in Europe than in the U.S. - perhaps it's because Americans simply won't tolerate the nonsense that Muslims with entitlement a mile-wide will pull here.
The problem is that in the UK, that integration has actually gone backwards rather than forwards. The younger generation are more backward than the original immigrants who came here forty years ago. All they read about is jihad and their resentment towards the evil West, because many never really integrated properly. Their women walk round in veils, either because they are instructed (or forced) into doing so by their community or they deliberately want to separate and isolate themselves from wider society by making a deliberately provocative political statement.
I think you should come to Europe for a while. I think it would open your eyes quite a bit. We do have a problem with racists on the 'white' side, most definitely - some of the members of the far-right and the EDL are very nasty indeed. But I think half the problem is that the newspapers are constantly going over this bogeyman of the BNP and the EDL. The BNP are a tiny party and are in freefall - the party structure is coming loose at the seams, so I'm told, due to infighting. They're an incompetent bunch of thugs in suits. The EDL are violent, drunken thugs who like lager and fighting and haven't the first clue about anything.
If it makes you feel any better, I'd much, much rather have a nice chap who happened to be Muslim living next door to me than one of the EDL mob, as with the EDL there is a big problem with hooligans and violence. |
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Joker
Sinn Fein
Joined: Mar 20, 2011
Age: 24
Posts: 7593
Location: North Carolina The Tar Heel State :)
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Yes Europe has a big problem with the Muslim faith with out a dought and when it gets bad in America then we both will be in the same boat. |
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Magdalena
Sea Gull
Joined: Feb 07, 2012
Posts: 205
Location: United States
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| Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Tequila wrote: | | Magdalena wrote: | | The definitions of leftism and progressivism rely hugely on this. |
Who the hell decides what is 'progressive'? |
A lot of the same people who decide what all words mean. Partially "average" citizens, partially intellectuals and elites.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressivism
_________________
Male-bodied pansexual and panromantic.
Your Aspie score: 130 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 90 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie
EQ Score: 37/100 ("low empathy") |
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AstroGeek
Phoenix
Joined: Jan 29, 2011
Age: 19
Posts: 1477
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| Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Magdalena wrote: | | Tequila wrote: | | Magdalena wrote: | | The definitions of leftism and progressivism rely hugely on this. |
Who the hell decides what is 'progressive'? |
A lot of the same people who decide what all words mean. Partially "average" citizens, partially intellectuals and elites.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressivism |
In India "progressive" refers to a free-market approach. In Canada our Liberal Party considers progressive ideas to be ones similar to the Third Way. The NDP (our social democrats) refers to progressivism as more traditional Keynesian social democracy. The Liberals call the NDP dinosaurs. We used to have a federal party (and still have many provincial parties) called the Progressive Conservatives.
Progressive is a term used to mean whatever the user wants. |
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Kraichgauer
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 13, 2010
Age: 47
Posts: 12769
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| Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| AstroGeek wrote: | | Magdalena wrote: | | Tequila wrote: | | Magdalena wrote: | | The definitions of leftism and progressivism rely hugely on this. |
Who the hell decides what is 'progressive'? |
A lot of the same people who decide what all words mean. Partially "average" citizens, partially intellectuals and elites.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressivism |
In India "progressive" refers to a free-market approach. In Canada our Liberal Party considers progressive ideas to be ones similar to the Third Way. The NDP (our social democrats) refers to progressivism as more traditional Keynesian social democracy. The Liberals call the NDP dinosaurs. We used to have a federal party (and still have many provincial parties) called the Progressive Conservatives.
Progressive is a term used to mean whatever the user wants. |
I always took it to mean the kind of liberalism that is always striving forward for the greater good. Intellectual, but also populist.
But that's just me.
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer |
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ruveyn
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 22, 2008
Age: 76
Posts: 29317
Location: New Jersey
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| Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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| AstroGeek wrote: |
Progressive is a term used to mean whatever the user wants. |
Progressive is what socialists call themselves when they don't want to use the term socialist.
ruveyn |
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Magdalena
Sea Gull
Joined: Feb 07, 2012
Posts: 205
Location: United States
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| Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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| AstroGeek wrote: | | Magdalena wrote: | | Tequila wrote: | | Magdalena wrote: | | The definitions of leftism and progressivism rely hugely on this. |
Who the hell decides what is 'progressive'? |
A lot of the same people who decide what all words mean. Partially "average" citizens, partially intellectuals and elites.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressivism |
In India "progressive" refers to a free-market approach. In Canada our Liberal Party considers progressive ideas to be ones similar to the Third Way. The NDP (our social democrats) refers to progressivism as more traditional Keynesian social democracy. The Liberals call the NDP dinosaurs. We used to have a federal party (and still have many provincial parties) called the Progressive Conservatives.
Progressive is a term used to mean whatever the user wants. |
The term "progressive," used in the way that I was using it (and used in the way that most people in the U.S. use it), refers to human progress such as that for which people like FDR fought. Like any word, "progressive" can be used in a way that is not true to that definition. I never disputed this. The way I (and most people in the U.S.) was using the term "progressive," as is indicated in the first sentence on that Wikipedia page to which I linked, does not refer to conservative or reactionary ideologies.
Any narrow-minded group, such as various conservative groups, can take the word "progressive" and apply it narrowly, such as in the sentence, "I'm a millionaire, and I think that giving these massive tax cuts to millionaires would be a very progressive move, because it furthers our interests and their interests!" So any action that furthers the interests of a group or person, or helps realize their vision, can be said by that group or person as being "progressive" in that light. But when I said "the definitions of leftism and progressivism rely hugely on [committing oneself wholly to human progress]," I was using the term "progressivism" in its broadest sense as it was relevant to what I was talking about- human progress.
So, it is wrong of you (and Tequila, and anyone else who did so) to assume that I was using it in a way other than what is suggested by the remarks in my posts.
_________________
Male-bodied pansexual and panromantic.
Your Aspie score: 130 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 90 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie
EQ Score: 37/100 ("low empathy") |
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AstroGeek
Phoenix
Joined: Jan 29, 2011
Age: 19
Posts: 1477
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| Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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| ruveyn wrote: | | AstroGeek wrote: |
Progressive is a term used to mean whatever the user wants. |
Progressive is what socialists call themselves when they don't want to use the term socialist.
ruveyn |
Please read the entire post before commenting. Socialist parties often do call themselves progressive, but I specifically pointed out that Progressivism refers to a free market approach in India. And that the Liberal Party of Canada (most assuredly not a socialist party, except by Republican standards) views itself as more progressive than the more left-wing NDP. |
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AstroGeek
Phoenix
Joined: Jan 29, 2011
Age: 19
Posts: 1477
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| Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Magdalena wrote: | | So, it is wrong of you (and Tequila, and anyone else who did so) to assume that I was using it in a way other than what is suggested by the remarks in my posts. |
I knew how you were using it. I'm just pointing out that you have to be careful with what words you use. They can be quite ill defined. |
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webcam
Velociraptor
Joined: Feb 09, 2012
Posts: 427
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 12:47 am Post subject: |
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| Racism would die, we if we left it behind us and stopped talking about haters in the media. Really to end hate means to end all hate. When all hate is gone and no one is allowed to say something to anyone that amounts to hate for any reason whatsoever, hate will die. It is only by teaching people that it's okay and that people actually do it that one can allow themselves to do it. Allow there to be examples of hatred and violence and it will proliferate. Remove it and it goes away. |
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Magdalena
Sea Gull
Joined: Feb 07, 2012
Posts: 205
Location: United States
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| Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:40 am Post subject: |
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| AstroGeek wrote: | | Magdalena wrote: | | So, it is wrong of you (and Tequila, and anyone else who did so) to assume that I was using it in a way other than what is suggested by the remarks in my posts. |
I knew how you were using it. I'm just pointing out that you have to be careful with what words you use. They can be quite ill defined. |
Thanks for your concern.
_________________
Male-bodied pansexual and panromantic.
Your Aspie score: 130 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 90 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie
EQ Score: 37/100 ("low empathy") |
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Raptor
Phoenix
Joined: Mar 09, 2007
Posts: 4501
Location: Southeast U.S.A.
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| Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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| webcam wrote: | | Racism would die, we if we left it behind us and stopped talking about haters in the media. Really to end hate means to end all hate. When all hate is gone and no one is allowed to say something to anyone that amounts to hate for any reason whatsoever, hate will die. It is only by teaching people that it's okay and that people actually do it that one can allow themselves to do it. Allow there to be examples of hatred and violence and it will proliferate. Remove it and it goes away. |
Hate is an emotion, not a crime in itself. |
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Chipshorter
Velociraptor
Joined: Jan 17, 2012
Age: 34
Posts: 477
Location: The Georgian Quarter of The Pool of Life, The Centre of The Creative Universe
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| Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:42 pm Post subject: |
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Tequila you point the problem of Islamophobia in the UK, it a modern problem compared to the problems of Cymrophobia, Scotophobia, Hibernophobia, and Anglophobia which have there roots in the middle ages.
I was taken a back by a thread in PPR on Saint David's day of the revival of an old Cymrophobic practise of having an Anglo-Saxon countercelebration (Samuel Pepys noted of one of those celebrations in his diaries). That act was an offence to the Welsh people and own ancestry on own national day of all days (my father is Welsh so therefore I am Welsh by descent)!
Merseyside has strong cultural, ethnical and geographical links with Wales, My home city of Liverpool has been referred to in the past as "the Capital of North Wales". I am aware that the province of Alberta also has strong ethnical and cultural links with Wales.
Ignorance is no excuse of racist behaviour, CYMROPHOBIA IS NOT COOL!!!
The Canadian Queen of Mean, the Anne Robinson of Edmonton you are "The Weakest Link" for your Dydd Gwyl Dewi behaviour.
Am looking forward to receiving your apology in the Welsh language.  |
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Vigilans
Orgasm Donor
Joined: Jun 20, 2008
Age: 24
Posts: 12092
Location: La belle province
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| Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Chipshorter wrote: | Tequila you point the problem of Islamophobia in the UK, it a modern problem compared to the problems of Cymrophobia, Scotophobia, Hibernophobia, and Anglophobia which have there roots in the middle ages.
I was taken a back by a thread in PPR on Saint David's day of the revival of an old Cymrophobic practise of having an Anglo-Saxon countercelebration (Samuel Pepys noted of one of those celebrations in his diaries). That act was an offence to the Welsh people and own ancestry on own national day of all days (my father is Welsh so therefore I am Welsh by descent)!
Merseyside has strong cultural, ethnical and geographical links with Wales, My home city of Liverpool has been referred to in the past as "the Capital of North Wales". I am aware that the province of Alberta also has strong ethnical and cultural links with Wales.
Ignorance is no excuse of racist behaviour, CYMROPHOBIA IS NOT COOL!!!
The Canadian Queen of Mean, the Anne Robinson of Edmonton you are "The Weakest Link" for your Dydd Gwyl Dewi behaviour.
Am looking forward to receiving your apology in the Welsh language. |
INSULTING MY COUNTRY IS WRONG AND MAKES YOU IGNORANT BUT I HAVE NO PROBLEM DOING IT TO OTHERS RARARARARARA  massive hypocrite
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Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do |
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redrobin62
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 03, 2012
Age: 50
Posts: 3840
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 2:38 am Post subject: |
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I'm black and Chinese. Once I drove from Nashville to Seattle. It took about 3 days. One morning, around 6am, I pulled into a truckstop in southern Minnesota. In the bathroom there was graffiti on the walls- some things about the ill treatment of natives. In the dining area I sat at the counter. I'd ordered a bagel & cream cheese. It seems like the waitress had never heard of cream cheese so I told her butter was fine. Two white men were sitting near me. One of them said, in a loud voice, "If a nigger sat near me I'd shoot him." I thought I was hallucinating so I ignored it while waiting for my bagel with butter. Seconds later, the same man extolled, "If a nigger sat near me I'd shoot him!"
Needless to say, the waitress couldn't bring me the bagel fast enough. I just grabbed some money from my wallet, laid it on the counter and hauled ass. Man, I was just hoping none of these racist mf's were waiting for me in the parking lot as I sprinted to my car and took off.
All of this happened just a few years ago. Boys and girls, some parts of America - and the world - is just as racist as its ever been. Nothing you do about it but be careful and carry a big stick.
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