Master_Pedant
Rocky Anderson for President!
Joined: Mar 15, 2009
Posts: 4707
|
 Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:17 am Post subject: Why's the Urban-Rural split so enduring? |
 |
|
Okay, based on my reading of political history, there seems to be quite an enduring urban-rural split. Whether it be US elections in the last few decades, Canadian elections (including, quite prominently the 2011 Manitoba General Election), or even the French Revolution, the left does well in more urban areas and the right in the rural areas, with suburbs as a toss up.
I mean, a lot of support for the Jacobins in the French Revolution came from the urban working class of Paris, with rural Peasants (similarly in the "Third Estate"), more royalist or Girondins.
The "labour-farmer" coalitions of the Canadian prairies and - to a lesser extent Upper Midwestern US - are the few exceptions I know to this trend (uh, and the genocidal monstrosity of Mao's "down to the Countryside Movement" might count - though I don't know exactly how "popular support" for Mao - if he had any during the middle of his reign - tallied up, as I haven't researched it as much as I'd like).
What, then, is the reason for the overall trend as well as the exceptions?
_________________
http://www.voterocky.org/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
ruveyn
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 22, 2008
Age: 76
Posts: 29336
Location: New Jersey
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 10:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
In the United States fewer than 3 percent of the working force is engaged in agriculture, cattle raising or primary food production and distribution. In short 3 percent feed 100 percent. What rural?
ruveyn |
|
| Back to top |
|
Oldout
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 10, 2012
Posts: 1539
Location: Reading, PA
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 10:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I think rural means small town. Small towns are to some extent more cooperative as a community than urban areas, that is, everyone knows everyone's business and when someone has a problem there usually friends, neighbors, or relatives to assist them. The urban settings are different and thus assistance is usually sought elsewhere. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Lord_Gareth
Velociraptor
Joined: Feb 21, 2012
Posts: 440
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 10:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
I honestly think the big difference is that tradition tends to be emphasized in rural or small-town areas, often for the sake of tradition itself. That naturally kinda slots into a conservative mindset; after all, they're already resistant to change, so why not make it official?
_________________
Et in Arcadia ego. - "Even in Arcadia, there am I." |
|
| Back to top |
|
Vigilans
Orgasm Donor
Joined: Jun 20, 2008
Age: 24
Posts: 12095
Location: La belle province
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 10:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
Small towns make small minds. Small minds are considered prime examples of the lofty "Git'r Done" mindset in most Conservative vernacular
_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do |
|
| Back to top |
|
Kjas
Onçinha
Joined: Feb 27, 2012
Age: 23
Posts: 4914
Location: the place I'm from doesn't exist anymore
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 10:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
From study it seems that all urban areas exploit rural areas to their own advantage - this trend seems to happen worldwide.
When you're constantly providing necessities and people keep dismissing you or your opinion as a group as useless or not worthy or somehow "less than", naturally people who can are going to take advantage of that in their own attempts to gain power. It's the perfect way to use peoples (often valid) discontent to somebody else's advantage (although whether they are valid is another story entirely).
_________________
Diagnostic Tools and Resources for Women with AS: http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt211004.html |
|
| Back to top |
|
VIDEODROME
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 21, 2008
Age: 36
Posts: 1700
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 10:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
Maybe rural people feel more self sufficient.
Or they have doubts about receiving as much help from bigger government as larger urban populations.
So why would they like to see bigger government and their taxes going up when it mostly benefits the city folks? |
|
| Back to top |
|
ruveyn
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 22, 2008
Age: 76
Posts: 29336
Location: New Jersey
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Oldout wrote: | | I think rural means small town. Small towns are to some extent more cooperative as a community than urban areas, that is, everyone knows everyone's business and when someone has a problem there usually friends, neighbors, or relatives to assist them. The urban settings are different and thus assistance is usually sought elsewhere. |
Rural means out in the country. As opposed to urban and sub-urban. Most small towns are suburbs of some larger city. And the population of isolated small towns in the U.S. is a small fraction of the population. The U.S. is very urbanized. What rural?
ruveyn |
|
| Back to top |
|
Oldout
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 10, 2012
Posts: 1539
Location: Reading, PA
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ruveyn -- I agree that today most of US is "urban", but there are still many people who were raised in small towns alive today. |
|
| Back to top |
|
ruveyn
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 22, 2008
Age: 76
Posts: 29336
Location: New Jersey
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:17 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Oldout wrote: | | ruveyn -- I agree that today most of US is "urban", but there are still many people who were raised in small towns alive today. |
Between the end of WW2 and 1970, rural went away in the U.S. That is over 40 years ago.
ruveyn |
|
| Back to top |
|
TalksToCats
Toucan
Joined: Jun 02, 2012
Posts: 255
Location: UK
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:20 am Post subject: |
|
|
Interesting question this.
Very very crudely defining rural as any settlement with a population of 100,000 or more and everything else as suburbs / rural I would conjecture the following...
In the UK at least traditionally the left (Labour) is the party of the worker (the man or woman who works for someone else) the right (Conservative) is the party of the boss (the manager or business owner or self-employed). The right is often seen as the party of the more affluent and the left the party of the less affluent...this may be somewhat different to other countries in particular the US.
It's obviously a lot more complicated than this but I think these basic assumptions may apply in a simplistic way at least for Labour and Conservative voters who still in the majority in England at least. {As an example of complexity the Liberal Democrats sit somewhere in the middle, the Greens tend towards the left. It gets even more complicated in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland - for example in Scotland I would just describe the left-right position of the Scottish National Party as quite simply complicated and variable...}
Anyway taking the basic left = worker and right = boss, in recent times (1870s onwards- maybe a bit earlier, maybe a bit later) 'the worker' has tended to live in the city, in the urban area closer to where the employment is, and 'the boss' has tended to live in the suburbs or the countryside - the rural. So on this basis the urban areas tends to vote left and the rural right.
Secondly you are more likely to get large areas of concentrated poverty in urban areas (poverty definately does exist in rural areas but you don't tend to get as many poor people concentrated in the same area - at least not in the UK) thus the left as the party of the less affluent gets more votes in the urban areas, and the right as the party of the more affluent gets more votes in rural areas.
I'm not sure this conjecture would work at all for the US though - as I understand some rural areas can have quite high poverty levels? Also I'm not sure the same kind of left = worker and right = boss distinction exists in the US either... |
|
| Back to top |
|
Oldout
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 10, 2012
Posts: 1539
Location: Reading, PA
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:20 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ruveyn -- I'm 62 and was raised in a small PA Dutch town, then for most of my life I lived in urban areas (Washington, DC & greater Philsdelphia). |
|
| Back to top |
|
ruveyn
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 22, 2008
Age: 76
Posts: 29336
Location: New Jersey
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Oldout wrote: | | ruveyn -- I'm 62 and was raised in a small PA Dutch town, then for most of my life I lived in urban areas (Washington, DC & greater Philsdelphia). |
Like I said, less than 3 percent of the population of the U.S. is "rural". Times change and so does the country.
The U.S. has not been rural for nearly 50 years. That is more than half a life time.
ruveyn |
|
| Back to top |
|
simon_says
Phoenix
Joined: Jan 21, 2011
Posts: 2443
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
The attitudes are interesting. My impression is that there is more passion on one side of the equation. Obviously there are people who flee the city for country living, and vice versa. Some will have negative things to say about what they left behind. Given the discrepancy in population density, and resulting lack of diversity of opinion, resentful attitudes may have an outsized effect on country views of the city.
It reminds me a little of the effect you get in smaller nations that border a larger nation where both share a similar culture. Ive listened to the "You Americans' speech from Canadians several times. It would never occur to me to lecture a Canadian or to be particularly interested in his business. My impression has been that Norweigans have stronger opinions of Swedes than vice versa. New Zealanders of Australians, than vice versa. Canadians of Americans, than vice versa. (using the term American alone will irritate some). I think of it as younger brother syndrome but maybe it's also sightly related to the outsized effects of individual opinion on a smaller population. Or to resentment over cultural flow.
Ive known one anti-urban person who fled to the deep country and who couldnt say enough negative about the rat race. Did he go out there and reinforce his neighbors views with his tales? If his neighbor fled to the city and denigrated country living, would it have the same impact? Does a smaller group naturally feel more defensive when culturally opposed by a larger group? Do they feel oppressed by a larger entity that has more bandwidth to broadcast it's culture? |
|
| Back to top |
|
VIDEODROME
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 21, 2008
Age: 36
Posts: 1700
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Well I'm in a rural area now and would like to get back to the city.
I mean yeah there is a very small town here but it doesn't even have a traffic light. Maybe you could call it suburban.
But I'm not in town I'm out in the country and we even have Amish living here. |
|
| Back to top |
|
