"I resign my roles at Autism Speaks" John Robison

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Uhm... actually, I am pretty clueless here. Me being "very smart" doesn't change the fact that I am socially oblivious even online, even with other autistics. I often forget who said what; I respond to ideas rather than people.

When I said, "Just because a person talks on WP doesn't mean that's all they're doing," all I was thinking was, "Hey, wait a minute; that's not a very logical statement. People posting on WP doesn't imply anything about whether or not they are autism advocates offline."

wozeree wrote:

Well, this comment is sure to elicit a response and here it is:

I wrote a message yesterday addressing the comments of Vernandi, who quoted Tuttle's comments to me regarding sorting and grading, and made some comments herself, but unfortunately deleted it by mistake and then had to leave for my jam. I will try to answer those messages soon, but since this one if fresh on the queue:

I take some responsibility for thinking Tuttle and Vernandi and some others, you possibly being one of them, would easily understand what I mean by sorting and grading, especially since as I have explained it so many times.

Sorting and grading is just another way of saying "thinking." Everybody does sorting and grading most of the time.. It is not possible to function without sorting and grading, but sorting and grading is subjective, based on factors such as individual and cultural context and general understanding of the function of named objects..

Yes, we are all the same, too, but, sorting and grading is required to see the similarities and/or differences. You could not even write the above without sorting and grading. So, from this perspectivr, a Hitler is not the same as, say, a Martin Luther King.

I run into a conundrum with your comment, as with the message from Vernandi with the quote from Martin Luther King on my Autistic Encapsulation thread. I am inclined to believe that you are pretending not to understand for perhaps the purpose of promoting enquiry.

The point that people are all the same is actually a key point. In a generalized sense they are basically the same. If a madman is about to slaughter your entire family and you are able to grab a gun. you can kill him without being angry with him and even feel compassion as you are killing him. You would obviously not let him kill your family because "we are all the same."

Great message. Thanks:-)

Hmmm, well sorry about that.There was a discussion about how much Aghogday likes to debate. It was just there in plain print and I assumed that everyone read it, so therfore you were defending him as well as making the point you were making, so killing two birds with one stone, and no, I am not implying that anyone is actually a bird or should be killed with a stone...

And this is a point that needs to be made over and over again because of disparaging comments made about people who do post here.

Yeah, you do have a point there.

Vicky made a disparaging comment which she apologized for, and I apologized to Callista for my wrong perception, though I still don't see how anyone could have missed that Vicky was referring to Aghogday, but maybe that is because of my own limited theory of mind...Anyway, imo, you need get off the negative pot. Maybe this is not or will not be the case with you. but I used to be on this same kind of pot and it made me physically ill with life threatening migraines (the strain on my heart from throwing up water on an empty stomach) and all kinds of muscular disorders such as fibromyalgia, sciatica, restless leg syndrome (a horrible thing, but the least of all of these) and severe lower back pain---I could not even put my own shoes on..

In my opinion..the leadership has great difficulty with cognitive empathy per my personal experiences with them..

But yeah..that is the autism spectrum and to be expected i guess.

But that is why different minds including people on the spectrum and off the spectrum are almost required to make the best efforts for an autism spectrum organization..even if they are only off and on the broader autism spectrum phenotype..

It reminds me of my job when I was working..as my style of thinking was listening with very little verbal response..until an hour in to a discussion after I had analyzed every detail..and finally got the whatever it was that allowed me to speak then..that comes freely now finally after 53 years...

Well..one of my bosses children..had a grandchild on the spectrum..who won a statewide poetry contest in Nebraska..

He too (my boss)...had a mind much like mine..and who knows..may have adapted like i did..as he was 16 years older than me at that time..in the 2000's..

The only reason I got diagnosed with autism is because of autism spectrum burnout...

I would have never likely known if I had not burnout and effectively regressed to the point where I could not speak at all..and a mocking bird sounded like a freight train...and dancing with the stars..was like the light from a nuclear explosion..

I got lots of cognitive empathy per the full scope of what I personally see as the spectrum..

At least for me..with the heightened sensory experiences..before IT got painful..the experience of Autism is a wonderfully pleasurable thing..

But on the other hand..it was the worse hell i could imagine when my senses quit working..after my stress response became broken..

There is actual research that shows that unrelenting stress impacting the adrenal response..can lead to sensory integration problems..

And yes..anxiety is the main source of stress....

My biggest problems were also associate with perfectionism..I felt i could not afford to make any mistake..or no one would accept me anymore..

As the history I had in school..was one where most everyone indicated to me in very clear terms I did not deserve to exist..unless i met their standards of what it means to be a human being..

Well...now I freely spin around in stores..walk in reverse..dance naked in my backyard..with my ear buds in listening to music with an actual ballerina style of dancing...

I am free..I am autistic..and I am human too...

I love life..and would like everyone to love it as much as i do..and enjoy it as such..if there was anyway i could make that happen...

i came out of literal hell..in abyss..to literal heaven..simply.. bliss..

I never thought that could be possible at the bottom of my hell..and abyss...

But I know for sure now that anything in this life is possible..as long as someone never loses hope..even if they cannot feel it or anything else in life but real non-ending pain.....

It's all a matter of finding a path that will work for each unique individual..something I do might help someone feel better..but everything I do is likely only for me...

As we are all unique and view our universes..differently..per the current science of the human mind..experience..and even dreams..my friend....

I like you..you play on your own team..and you are your best friend..

I too..learned that from you..friend..

As now I am my own best friend too..

So yeah..love to you too...

I do not have any training in debate.. i speak from my heart is all...

Other people have called it voracious debating before..but it is simply how
i learned to adapt to communicate..as all I could do before is technical writing for the government..for the most part...

I am permanently disabled with at least 17 diagnosed disorders...

I had all this time to talk on this site..simply because THAT IS all I could LITERALLY DO..type..I could not even use my eyes or ears effectively for over 5 years..with THE WORST PAIN DOCUMENTED ON RECORD IN MEDICAL LITERATURE...TRIGEMINAL NEURALGIA...

AND NAH..NOT JUST THE ACUTE KIND OF TRIGEMINAL NEURALGIA..AN ATYPICAL EXTREMELY RARE FORM..THAT WAS CHRONIC AND NEVER ENDED UNLESS I WAS IN SLEEP MODE..WITH UP TO 4MG OF ATIVAN TO MAKE THAT EVEN POSSIBLE...

JUST SO YOU KNOW..that is all...

AND YEAH..I DO FEEL GREAT NOW..AND CELEBRATE EVERY MICROSECOND OF IT..

THAT IS ALL 2....

Oh..and yeah..NO..I DO NOT THINK MY OPINION IS ANYMORE VALID THAN ANYONE ELSE HERE..

I HAVE NEVER STATED I WAS RIGHT OR ANYONE ELSE IS WRONG..

IT IS NO WHERE IN THE RECORD ON THIS SITE..AND THERE ARE LITERALLY MILLIONS OF WORDS..WRITTEN IN MY RECORD HERE ON THIS SITE..ALONE..AND MILLIONS ELSEWHERE ON THE INTERNET..WHERE I ALSO HAVE NEVER DONE THAT..

I LEARN SOMETHING FROM EVERYONE I MEET IN LIFE..NO MATTER HOW THEY MAY THINK OR ACT..OR IF I DISAGREE....AND MATTER OF FACT..I LEARN MORE FROM PEOPLE WHO DISAGREE WITH ME THAN THOSE WHO AGREE...

SO I GREATLY LIKE VERDANDI..NO MATTER WHAT SHE THINKS OF ME...

EVEN..But I do not have a 'personally' judgmental bone in my body..

As I HAVE BEEN TO HELL IN MORE WAYS THAN YOU CAN likely IMAGINE....

YEAH IN ALL ACTUALITY AM A MASTER QUESTIONER..NOT A MASTER DEBATER..THAT IS ALL..FOR THE PART....

I SEEK THE TRUTH..IN ALL MATTERS THAT EXIST...

THAT IS ALL3.....

I am a member of grasp, which has good support groups in big cities, and I attended regularly the one in san diego until I moved to LA.

There was a lot of practical advice at these support groups, and if grasp had a practical things branch, it could definitely create some good practical resources for adults, as this population is focus of grasp.

I am a member too..

But unfortunately my area is too small to do anything with it in real life..

There are usually less than 10 people that show up in the one Asperger's support group in my area of several hundred thousand people..per the total metropolitan area..

It seems with dropping the Asperger's diagnosis..that it may be even harder..for some people to ever gain the ability to be part of a support group..outside of online...

In my opinion..that's a difficult thing..as meeting face to face..can be very interesting.if a person can handle all of that...

It can be a real problem per the actual diversity of the spectrum for someone on the spectrum to really find someone who can relate to their differences in thinking.. IN 'REAL LIFE'..as they can be so very very 'berry' different among any two people on the spectrum....

What we are finding in research is lots of variation within the high functioning autism spectrum individuals, but also little clusters amongst the limited size study samples, so I am verry merry berry interested in subgroups of autism now. For functioning labels, I take moderate approach that is neither strict application of the labels or strictly individuals, because I find subgroups useful to understand instead of unbersmand autistic behaviors/cognition/brrrainzzz, and subgroups can be verry merry berry useful for developing practical applications in educational/developmental/therapeutic areas.

I experience a lot of pain and other issues, but they're not caused by my so-called "negativity." The idea that people cause themselves to experience these things by being "negative" or "angry" or whatever is simply more ableism. A means to blame people for the disabilities they have.

My migraines are caused mostly by food, not eating, or being out in daylight without sunglasses. My fibromyalgia is constant, although it becomes more or less intense based on many things, such as the weather, other issues I'm experiencing, excess physical exertion, but so far I have not observed a flare or a migraine caused by arguing on the internet.

I am also not relentlessly "negative" if that is how you perceive my interactions on these threads. I respond negatively to certain kinds of ableist commentary (and really, everyone should, so they don't take root) that has been fairly consistent on this forum fairly recently - I mean it's always present, but it has been more present recently.

To put it as bluntly as possible, I don't hate myself enough to agree with several of the comments you've made about autism and how people should relate to autism. Or what we should talk about on the basis of what allegedly causes "human suffering." Talking about these things, being honest about them, does not cause human suffering. Ignoring them, pretending they don't exist, or pretending that they can be overcome with just a bit of pain can and does cause or at least encourage suffering.

As far as the comment goes, I was agreeing because of several disparaging comments made specifically about people posting here instead of doing things in "the real world." Aghogday and yourself have both made such comments (your most egregious example being the instruction to drop everything completely and do nothing but agitate to close down JRC to prove being against torture because speaking against it doesn't count or causes human suffering or some other such nonsense).

Did I really say these things? Sounds like misquotes verging on slander. Why not just stick to ideas?---and I do not mean just repeating them, but actually thinking about things in a new way, trying to understand other people;s differing views and maybe learn something new. This does not mean you have to agree with everything.You will surely turn people against you and your agenda by continuing with this kind of vituperative tactics, and I believe you already have, .It is not real communication.

I didn't know you got migraines.That is new to me. In any case, people have many ideas about why they have what, and even the medical communities is shifting and changing in its perspective. One thing for sure, I am a healer, and I have verified for myself that held in grief and anger makes people really sick, and a vituperative mindset is even worse, which is why I will stick to speaking about my own experience. I do consider your posting style comes across to me as having an underlying agenda which seems to be lurking beneath the surface motivation which I do feeel is sincere., and you are using very broad generalizations and misquotes and false attributions to make what to me seems like a subtle form of slander that is intended to be that, which is sad.

Re what I said about people quitting their jobs and activating full time, I already explained that I did not expect people to literally do that. It was a rhetorical way of saying something that you apparently completely missed. But it is important to you to have a scapegoat, so it serves your purpose better if you pretend you did not read my explanation.

As vexing as you are, you really do touch my heart, and I am not kidding.

Another issue that I have with current asan-style advocacy is the hyperemotional single-perspective nature of the messages, which is good for appealing to in-group who already subscribe to group idears, but mild to severe turnoff for others, including me as autistic person who is not part of particular group.

Generally, I respond well to rational messages that state multiple perspectives on topic and talk about concrete things rather than emotional messages pushing a certain perspective as the correct one and others as incorrect and also lacking concrete things that I understand well.

I think that new kind of autism organization is needed.

Er, ASAN is pretty far from hyperemotional, nor are their messages irrational.

Also, slander is spoken, libel is written. However, it is neither libel nor slander to say that someone actually did what they really actually did:

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp5753725.html#5753725

That is a terrible thing to instruct people to do, and is significantly less effective than using existing communication networks with potentially global penetration to spread the word. Plus, such methods do not actually require people to abandon their support systems and homes, which is an added bonus.

This kind of argument is often used to shut down discussion about injustice. That whatever one is doing about injustice, it is the wrong thing to do, that it is not enough, and that to really count it has to meet someone else's standards - typically someone who is not particularly invested in the issue (and saying that calling it torture increases human suffering shows a pretty extreme lack of investment in the issue - you are more concerned with how people frame the message than you are with the fact that this is really happening).