Russian army has invaded the Crimea

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What? That she was scapegoated? Her arrest was entirely political. At worst being the gas princess put her at above-normal risk for a conflict of interest. But I'm not sure exactly what could have been done differently.

She's hard-hitting. I respect that.

So I just found out that a draft bill was submitted to the Russian parliament that would designate Crimea a legal gambling zone. This is the most recent Crimea thread I could track down.

Turn the Crimea into the Vegas or Atlantic City of eastern Europe, huh?

Probably to attract more tourists or something. There are quite a few other Casino paradises in the region (as far as I know) Monaco, Montenegro (at least since they split off, not sure before that), Malta, Gibraltar. And I'm fairly confident they have booze in Crimea as well.

While it was the Russians who stepped in for the cleanup, Chernoble is West Ukiraine.

Ukraine has fifteen reactors, and I am sure it was their technitions who blew one up.

They were built and fueled by the Russians, but became Ukraine State Property.

Stories about a test gone wrong do not hold water, or radioactive material.

As the first patch is cracking up, it was done quickly under harsh conditions, Russia was going to add another layer.

Whoever wins West Ukraine, gets the job. The EU would never offer membership to Ukraine.

No free trade, travel, and the 15 billion loan was just to make payments on the 150 billion debt to the IMF.

Ukraine economics are much worse then Greece, and they have a meltdown to deal with, for the next few thousand years.

John Kerry, who denounced the Russians for a $50 jew tax, is now claiming Russian troops are in east Ukraine,

It may play in the westen media, but in Ukraine, the few gunmen who the self appointed government had, Rights Sector, a new National Guard made up of street fighters, criminals, want nothing to do with Russian Special Forces.

If the Russians were there, they could take no prisoners, leave no witnesses, and the bodies would vanish. The whole countryside is against anti russian forces, their bases are barricaded, they would be easy to remove.

That was the only force Kiev had. The police and army ignor them. Now they are trying to hire back the riot police they just fired. Kiev has less defenses than the eastern cities.

I disagree. Everything points to Russia being prepared well beforehand this thing started. The whole Crimean 'uprising/independence' movement was too well coreographed and 'gunmen/local militias' formed up too quickly, were too well prepared logistically and training-wise for this to have been something that dissatisfied citizens could have come up with in such a short period of time.

This is not to say all gunmen/militia are russian soldiers... that's not how specforces work. They organize, train and equip and lead the locals. All this could not have been accomplished in ...what? the 1month or less the entire debacle took place in.

When Crimea 'voted' to join Russia they received almost the very next day huge shipments of Rubles to pay the gov. workers in and stock the banks with the new currency. Brand new bills. There is no way or form such a huge amount of paper money and coins could have been minted, accumulated, transported and delivered without all the logistics for it having been planned months in advance.

The 'vote' itself was pushed by long time pro-Russian politicians that have reeked of corruption for a very long time. Corruption and political puppetry are common in all ex-soviet countries and Russia has used that puppetry to rule them as satellite protectorates for a long time.

Thing is, the Ukraine was to be the very first such satellite to come close to leaving Russian control and worse yet, try for EU partnership with aims of future membership. That could simply not be allowed. It makes all the sense in the world to destabilize, divide and conquer/absorb the Ukraine to prevent it and show the other satellite nations what happens should they get similar ideas.

Ukraine was not the first, Georgia was in 2008 or so. Those provinces of Georgia are still occupied by Russia and no one has done anything about it. Also, the Soviet satellite states were countries like Poland and Hungary, while countries like Ukraine, Georgia and the Baltic states were actually part of the Soviet Union. The EU messed this one up big time.

First of all, Crimea was part of Russia prior to the establishment of the USSR and up to Nikita Khrushchev who gave it to the Ukraine as a "gift". This talk about some vast conspiracy on the part of Russia is unsupported by actual evidence. Now I dont' entirely support Russia annexing the whole Ukraine but in terms of the Crimean invasion, I say GO RUSSIA!! !! ! I don't support many of Vladimir Putin's policies but a strong Russia that is able to throw its weight around is a useful counterweight against Western Hegemony.


And furthermore, this talk of a nuclear armed Ukraine is an empty counterfactual. Ukraine gave them up cuz it was too poor and disorderly to afford the security and technical expertise to maintain and assert control over the leftover Soviet warheads. Russia could very well have seized them by force as it had the means to do so. Giving a nuclear weapon to Ukraine will most certainly provoke a nuclear war(and perhaps rightfully so)against the west. So Crimea is now part of Russia. Deal with it.

They are not Russian, but they were when they fought in Afganistan, two wars with Islamic terrorists, and when they mustered out they were still reserves, and kept their gear. Their camo is old and various patterns, The police and public officials join them, and the people know them.

Look at the pictures, men from forty to fifty. The VFW.

Kiev's troops are Right Sector, no training, and the Ukraine army are kids of eighteen,

Everyone born before 1991 has CCCP on their birth certificate, and this is Ukraine's third revolution since 1991.

Experience counts, a few men captured a line of tanks before the kids driving them could react.

These are, "The jungle came alive and took him", fighters who lived when 13,000 died in Afganistan.

Afganis are not easy to ambush. These are the men that lived. They also killed a million Afganis.

CIA was all over Afganistan, Americans killed a lot of Russians, and now they are moving on the homeland.

The Russian vote elected the last President, and will elect the next.

Now if you would like to contest the majority who are hardened fighters, defending home ground, with thugs who fought in the streets with clubs, it will be a short and bloody war.

First, half the army is Russian from the south and east, The Police have told Kiev they are trained to write parking tickets and write reports on stolen goods. They are Civil Servents who are barred from political action.

Two thirds of the troops in Crimea joined the Russians. All of the Police joined the Russians. 87% of the people voted to join the Russians.

Russia does not want part of Ukraine, they want all of it, An election would be the clean way, Having the army take over and provide for peace and secure elections would work. before allowing a civil war, Russia will invade.

The 12,000 member Rights Sector/National Guard, is taking on millions of people far from Kiev. All of their bases and movements are known. They got a uniform and gun this month, they will be slaughtered.

Kiev is several billion behind on the gas bill. They owe payments of $25 billion on bonds. They are broke.

The only reason they are still standing is because they are on the CIA payroll, and the bag man, Joe Biden, just flew in a load of cash. It will not last long.

As Putin said, it is not really a country.

F*ck the EU cost a lot, the EU told Russia that the most important thing was they were a relieable supplier of energy, Putin assured them that all problems had answers, and gas could be routed around Ukraine.

No one, except the CIA, wants a Syria, Libya, Iraq, Afganistan, in eastern Europe.

^100% false


^100% false


^100% true


^100% false. It isn't about the economics; it is about additional buffer between Russia and the rest of Europe


^true, and untrue.
There economic infrastructure is in shambles, but their debt to GDP is significantly lower, as is their unemployment.


There are at least a few there who have openly admitted such, although I think that there are just a few that are stirring up trouble amongst the old vets of previous USSR actions.



The barricades would only be easy to remove if no one cared about massive loss of human life.


^100% false


^100% true

After more reading, it was the Russians running the reactor running a test when it blew up.

Now there is street fighting in Kiev between the right and the democratic groups.

Ukraine does not have a legal or functioning government.

Their last ditch Rights Sector/National Guard anti terror move in the east has bogged down.

A few vets with AKs have stopped them at the first city. Farther in are larger cities, warned and waiting, and closer to the Russian border.

Using tanks against civilians is a war crime, a crime against humanity, and Russia stepped in in Georgia when they started shelling cities.

Russia would have no problem supplying money to two million in Crimea. Most was in exchange for Ukraine money, still good.

Most industrial jobs in east Ukraine have Russia for a customer. They are defending their homes, jobs, language and culture. They make things for the Russian Army, there is no other market.

Crimea has peace and prosperity.

In west Ukraine they are celibrating when they joined the SS and fought Russia.

Well, what do you folks now think about Russia's annexation of Crimea? Should sanctions remain in place until Russia returns Crimea to Ukraine? Or, is it more like



By the way, it does appear that Wrong Planet was infiltrated by Russian operatives years ago.

Don't know if they're Russian agents, but right is so enamored with Trump these days that they'll swallow the most preposterous things he says, such as Russia is our friend.

On a side note, it does look as if Wrong Planet had a lot more members, and livelier discussions, a very long time ago.

I wonder if some of those Russian trolls could have been assassins as well.

Well, if I turn up dead, don't believe the official story!

Well, this is interesting. Three years ago, the paid Russian trolls were very active in supporting Russia's aggression against Ukraine.

http://www.stopfake.org/en/tag/pro-russian-trolls/

Now, bring up Ukraine, and not so much as a nibble any more. They've all been assigned to support the Kremlin's official views on Trump.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 57641.html

I suppose, from Putin's perspective, the Trump scandal has at least diverted public attention away from Ukraine.