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paolo
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 1095
Location: Italy
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 Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 4:01 pm Post subject: Some form of immortality? |
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This is very pretentious. But, years ago I happened to listen to a lecture on the subject by the renown sociologist Zygmunt Bauman and since then I never ceased to think of Bauman's treatment and of the things he said. Of course we know well that all our contemporary culture is based on a strategy of systematic elusion of the theme. But still I think that a great number of people try in some way to face the problem by various means. Even if they often don’t know that what they do is motivated by some desire of immortality. The first thing that comes to mind here, and has a lot of weight, is to rear children. Not that they think crassly “children equal immortality”, but, even unconsciously, the idea is there.
The more you live alone, the more you think of death. And, after all, there is some sense the solution of child rearing. Even if they don’t know anything about genetics and DNA it’s true that communality of DNA is part of their attachment to their offspring. Even without children, you can find some form of durable legacy in any form of attachment and generosity toward others. You are less alone.
For us in the ASD the problem oh annihilation is a source of more anguish than for anyone else. We rarely have children, we are alone most of our life. We have sometimes the chance to produce art or literature or poetry. That was the solution for Emily Dickinson, or Kafka, or Lewis Carroll. But what was the quality of their life? And how many in the ASD have this outlet, outlet of cultural creativity, at their disposal?
_________________
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.
--Samuel Beckett |
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dtoxic
Deinonychus
Joined: Jun 23, 2008
Age: 38
Posts: 311
Location: Boston MA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:29 am Post subject: |
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First real interesting thread in a while...ignored for ten hours, so I am likely to be the final poster.
I don't try to hide it, I seek to make a dent in reality through my art in a way that will outlive me. I still aspire to make music that gets broadcast on a radio transmitter at some point. Radio waves are a form of electromagnetic energy and travel essentially forever through space once broadcast, so everything ever broadcast on the radio is traveling out into the universe at light speed, and could reach alien life forms smart enough to be able to receive and decode the transmissions. This was a plot device in Carl Sagan's novel Contact. I wonder how many musicians are aware of this little brand of immortality. |
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tahloola
Deinonychus
Joined: Jul 02, 2008
Age: 52
Posts: 322
Location: Southern Ontario (not too far from the blueberries)
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:24 am Post subject: |
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I know this is very deep and profound....
so profound - that probably only two to three will respond....
(so I wanted to be part of the elite)....
the
elite-profound-in-the-know-people....
except...
I am going to have to give this more thought....
(al lot more thought)
but....
I couldn't resist....being an "early-bird"....
you know...
(like they do....in - Bingo....)
I might - just win a prize....
an..
intellectual prize....
or maybe....
immortality....
_________________
The “time-lord” thundered….”you’re late!”…..the wise old woman replied…."but I looked to the sun and the moon and the stars!”…..he glared at her….ready to throw a thunderbolt….she laughed…and said..”child…take your watch off”… |
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paolo
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 1095
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 2:37 am Post subject: |
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I see “things” this way.
(generally I don’t like quotation marks, but here I will be obliged to use the as form of caveat).
“We” are provisional and “relatively” unsubstantial. “We” are part of a larger enterprise (life?) and our task is not that of surviving in this unsubstantial “weness” but to guard our entrusted bodies as long as we can, to give birth to new bodies, not in a form of self love, but in a form of connectedness and of generosity towards the larger enterprise. This generosity should not so much be confined to having an offspring and care for that offspring, but also to be of help in various ways to others, may be offering self sacrifice if need be, or simply “witnessing”, by way of a poem, or a work of art or something else, not just “grabbing” things for “ourselves” if possible. I see this more or less as the task of all animals and trees and living things, even if they don’t possess that excruciating phenomenon of consciousness which belongs in the most complicated and acute form to our astray species. Astray just for this form of consciousness they have to administer together with their body. The body is relatively easy to administer. Consciousness, which after all is part of the body, is much harder to administer.
_________________
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.
--Samuel Beckett |
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Dasha
Blue Jay
Joined: Jan 09, 2008
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 2:44 am Post subject: |
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I did once read an article that those with out friends or close family died younger.
but i think that has more to do with no one is there being their advocate, dragging them to the hospital, and demanding tests for things they aren't clearheaded enough to ask for on their own than any actual emotional support |
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tahloola
Deinonychus
Joined: Jul 02, 2008
Age: 52
Posts: 322
Location: Southern Ontario (not too far from the blueberries)
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 2:48 am Post subject: |
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Wow
I am amazed at your "complete unselfishness" as an organism that has consciousness and form and maybe......even an "ego"??? (excuse the quotes)....can't be helped.....grammer and all....
but ....
how can you be so "unselfish"???
I .......personally....have a very hard time considering sacrificing myself to this NT society....
I say...
let them go to he*ll in a handbasket....
so that I can bask in the sun....
(have you ever asked yourself why....you want to "cast your pearls before swine"?....
I doubt ...
they wil appreciate it.
I say:
enjoy - whatever freedom we are afforded in this life.....
_________________
The “time-lord” thundered….”you’re late!”…..the wise old woman replied…."but I looked to the sun and the moon and the stars!”…..he glared at her….ready to throw a thunderbolt….she laughed…and said..”child…take your watch off”… |
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tahloola
Deinonychus
Joined: Jul 02, 2008
Age: 52
Posts: 322
Location: Southern Ontario (not too far from the blueberries)
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:00 am Post subject: |
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Dasha wrote: | Quote: | | did once read an article that those with out friends or close family died younger. |
sorry: my response - was before I saw what u wrote.....
but -
why die?
for what?
this NT - monkey society?
phaaaaaa!!!
I say - let them eat their fill of banana's ...and round out their lives....
I want to live...
in my aspie world....
without their bul**sh**t! - and the loudness of it all....
I don't espouse martyerdom.....
_________________
The “time-lord” thundered….”you’re late!”…..the wise old woman replied…."but I looked to the sun and the moon and the stars!”…..he glared at her….ready to throw a thunderbolt….she laughed…and said..”child…take your watch off”… |
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tahloola
Deinonychus
Joined: Jul 02, 2008
Age: 52
Posts: 322
Location: Southern Ontario (not too far from the blueberries)
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:24 am Post subject: |
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oh;......and...
I probably should address the immortality question visa/vias...children.....and pro-creation....
I have kids....
who cares about "immortality"?........that's bull***cra**p!!
I totally enjoy my kids....even though they cost me a lot of $$$$ and a lot of worry when they screw up .......
the good times ...........wash away all of the negative.......stuff....
we're not machines....
they are the machines (monkey society) - aka....NT hierarchy.....(not personal....- I like a lot of Nt's on a personal basis) .......another story, for another dayl......
our family is:
a) source of joy
b)source of angst
c)source
plain & simple
OMG - I feel like a Bingo player in a room of "people smarter than myself" .....
flip......flap.....booogie, woogie......flim, flam
p.s.
good point about - music.....and that endless vibration......
cuse me.....
just wanted to be the "early bird".
_________________
The “time-lord” thundered….”you’re late!”…..the wise old woman replied…."but I looked to the sun and the moon and the stars!”…..he glared at her….ready to throw a thunderbolt….she laughed…and said..”child…take your watch off”… |
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Arbie
Educated Stupid
Joined: Mar 23, 2007
Age: 27
Posts: 1683
Location: Near Greenville S.C.
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:04 am Post subject: |
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Or I could have a stone monument created in my likeness.
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!  |
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paolo
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 1095
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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When you save your life, in a sense, you are unselfish, because your life is not your private property.
THE OUTLET.
My river runs to thee:
Blue sea, wilt welcome me?
My river waits reply.
Oh sea, look graciously!
I'll fetch thee brooks
From spotted nooks, --
Say, sea,
Take me!
Emily Dickinson
Last edited by paolo on Sat Sep 06, 2008 1:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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naughtyrobot
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Feb 04, 2008
Age: 21
Posts: 56
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:02 pm Post subject: |
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I feel all humans in their own way are on a personal often subconcious quest for immortality, most use others in order to reach their goal out of fear, for relying on yourself for immortality is by nature destined to fail.
Personally, I write poems, stories, riddles, puzzles...
I try to keep a dream log, though I find that more frequent I bring dream to paper, the further I sink into my dreams when I sleep
When I am feeling stubborn I try to draw
and I hack away at everything... as I have done since I was a child.
"I hack to learn, never did I learn to hack" |
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peterd
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Dec 26, 2006
Age: 56
Posts: 50
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| Posted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 3:38 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Of course we know well that all our contemporary culture is based on a strategy of systematic elusion of the theme. |
'elusion"? "elision"? Wtf are we talking of here?
For half a century or so my faith in god underpinned everything. I reached a point though, where the equation of the greatest good for the greatest number solved identically both when I started from that foundation, and when I started from the atheist foundation. Occam's Razor had just severed me from my deepest held beliefs.
All this was pre-diagnosis, of course. I'm glad, now, that I don't have to reconcile the existence of god with the existence of aspergers. |
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peterd
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Dec 26, 2006
Age: 56
Posts: 50
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| Posted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 3:44 am Post subject: |
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| Some of us learned to hack before hacking was a verb, of course. Perhaps it's different now... |
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Postperson
The Daughter of Indifference
Joined: Jul 10, 2004
Age: 51
Posts: 2808
Location: Uz
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| Posted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 4:33 am Post subject: |
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| I couldn't think of anything worse than immortality. No kids for me, ugh. I want OUT of this gene pool. |
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ascan
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 23, 2005
Posts: 1663
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| Posted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 5:16 am Post subject: |
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| Postperson wrote: | | I couldn't think of anything worse than immortality. No kids for me, ugh. I want OUT of this gene pool. |
Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don't have any kids yourself. |
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