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PersonalEnigma
Hummingbird
Joined: Dec 03, 2007
Posts: 23
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 Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 11:17 pm Post subject: Lack of motivation |
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| Well, my son, L, has a real problem with not being motivated by much. When he makes an effort he can do very well at things, but most of the time he can't be bothered. He feels bad about getting poor marks or not getting things, but when push comes to shove he has no motivation to make the changes necessary to improve. Consequences can definitely help, but I don't like to have to use negative things to motivate him. Progress charts and other ways of earning awards don't seem to help much at all - they are ok when he's thinking of them, but the rest of the time they are forgotten and left on the wayside. I'm not worried about him getting good marks, or anything as tangible as that. I just want to see him take the initiative on something, anything (other than playing video games or board games) and go the extra mile with it. Any suggestions are welcome. |
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laplantain
Deinonychus
Joined: May 24, 2005
Posts: 307
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 3:07 am Post subject: |
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| I would like some tips on that as well as inertia is the biggest hurdle around here for us. |
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sinsboldly
Free Range Aspie
Joined: Nov 22, 2006
Age: 59
Posts: 13241
Location: Oregon, USA
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:42 am Post subject: |
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| I have lost the will to be apathetic |
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KimJ
Legend in my own mind
Joined: Jun 11, 2006
Posts: 2540
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:51 am Post subject: |
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Does the lack in motivation seem rooted in procrastination? Like he wants to do it, plans to do it and then drops the ball somewhere and doesn't get it done? Or has to have his study time in a particular time and place?
Procrastination is due to perfectionism (fear of failure) ironically and might be an early sign of depression or depressive tendencies.
Requiring the "perfect study hall" might be due to needing a highly rigid schedule for meeting goals. I have both problems. It's a bad habit because I do it with bills, paperwork and phone calling. During depressive spells I procrastinate on personal goals and entertainment.
I would enforce a strict homework/study period after school-whatever works-and see if that helps. And then don't sabatoge that study hall. For instance, if he can work in his room under certain conditions, don't knock on the door or check on him. If it's the kitchen, don't go in and out of the kitchen while he's in there. Don't ask him to do other things during that period.
My parents would cajole me into working in the kitchen and then harass me to no end. I really needed a quiet place of my own. To this day, I do my best reading in a coffee shop. |
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kclark
Velociraptor
Joined: May 11, 2007
Age: 28
Posts: 464
Location: NE Illinois
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 10:05 am Post subject: |
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Most of the time I get bored with things that don't challenge me enough so I don't bother with them and perform poorly. So maybe upping the challenge of whatever he is not doing may provide enough interest in it to pursue it.
I have never found extrinsic (outward) rewards like gold stars, earning treats or privileges to be any source of motivation to me. I don't do something to earn a reward that is not directly involved with the activity, that just does not make much sense. In fact the setting of a reward for doing something often had the opposite effect where it made me less interested in doing something. I then saw that activity as being so worthless that it needed an extra bribe just to make it worthwhile.
I enjoy the intrinsic rewards of knowing I did well on something that took some effort and was challenging to me. The challenge does not necessarily need to be difficult, but enough where you need to get the brain working a bit.
Having my work acknowledged when I did well was a good thing to me. All it took was a really simple, "Good work on that project." Too much praise felt fake and was ignored as well as praise given at a level disproportionate to my results. An excellent work on a B grade was garbage praise to me, but a remark that it was a good effort or that this one section was very well done, with a suggestion for improvement would be more accepted.
I think that you will have to start fairly small in his initiative taking skills, but the small affirmations of the choices he makes will help build confidence in doing so. |
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ster
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 24, 2005
Posts: 2727
Location: new england
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 11:47 am Post subject: |
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| it is also possible that the lack of effort has to do with depression .... |
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Triangular_Trees
What is right is sometimes found on the left.
Joined: Jul 18, 2007
Posts: 2053
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 11:50 am Post subject: |
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i have never been able to do something I don't see the point in - I nearly failed geometry in large part because I couldn't see any use for such a math. Indeed, I am now graduating with my master's degree, and I've yet to utilize any of the knowledge I gained from high school geometry for anything other than taking the SAT's. When i don't see the point in knowing in something its extremely difficult for me to learn it, even if i want to.
Too much praise does make me feel like the entire act is fake and worthless. that doesn't mean that I don't want praise though - i loved being the top of my college classes for grades.
I've found deadlines motivate me the best. The papers I didn't started writing until 4 or 5 hours before they were due are the ones that i was always told were my best.
Froma teachers perspective, turn his work into something he likes. for example if he loves dinosaurs, isntead of asking him what 2 + 5 is, say 2 brontosauruses were launging in the sun when they were joined by 5 triceratops. How many dinosaurs were there? |
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PersonalEnigma
Hummingbird
Joined: Dec 03, 2007
Posts: 23
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Does the lack in motivation seem rooted in procrastination? Like he wants to do it, plans to do it and then drops the ball somewhere and doesn't get it done? Or has to have his study time in a particular time and place?
Procrastination is due to perfectionism (fear of failure) ironically and might be an early sign of depression or depressive tendencies.
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He does procrastinate (something I am also quite guilty of), but it is more forgetfulness or distractability. Without regular reminders L doesn't tend to finish things. I often let him split up work time with short breaks in the middle as it helps him work better. Having the motivation of something he wants to do afterwards works well for homework, but that's not always something that can be offered. Usually L doesn't want to do homework, but many things are things he does want to do, but he gives up easily - usually as soon as it requires some level of effort. Location is pretty much set - on the kitchen table where I am readily available to help as necessary. Time is supposed to be set but things seem to get in the way at times... Our home life can be a bit chaotic some days. L is definitely a perfectionist - has been since he was a baby. I am very aware of the risk of depression as I am prone to depression myself and know that makes him higher risk.
| Quote: | | Most of the time I get bored with things that don't challenge me enough so I don't bother with them and perform poorly. So maybe upping the challenge of whatever he is not doing may provide enough interest in it to pursue it. |
I have thought this before with him, but I think that fear of failure gets in the way. He prefers easy, repetitive tasks to more challenge. He's the opposite to me that way - I can't stand repetition.
| Quote: | | I have never found extrinsic (outward) rewards like gold stars, earning treats or privileges to be any source of motivation to me. I don't do something to earn a reward that is not directly involved with the activity, that just does not make much sense. In fact the setting of a reward for doing something often had the opposite effect where it made me less interested in doing something. I then saw that activity as being so worthless that it needed an extra bribe just to make it worthwhile. |
Interesting. L likes the reward idea at first, but quickly grows bored of it.
| Quote: | | I enjoy the intrinsic rewards of knowing I did well on something that took some effort and was challenging to me. The challenge does not necessarily need to be difficult, but enough where you need to get the brain working a bit. |
This is what I want to teach L. So far he does not really understand the concept of taking pride in a job well done. He will be proud after the fact, but beforehand he'd rather do the bare minimum rather than making an effort so that he can be proud of his work. My favorite thing is when he gets projects to do at home. I can work with him helping him see beyond the bare minimum so that he can do a better job and be proud of his effort in the long run. I just wish that he'd have this incentive for work he does without my help.
| Quote: | | Having my work acknowledged when I did well was a good thing to me. All it took was a really simple, "Good work on that project." |
I make a real effort to praise not only the results of his work, but also the effort he makes on them. He is a sucker for praise 
| Quote: | | i have never been able to do something I don't see the point in |
I think that may be the root of things. I'm not sure L sees the point in doing anything that he doesn't already want to do. He hates writing and reading - it's a lot of effort for him although he is steadily improving. He doesn't mind math, but has been struggling with some of the newer concepts. Part of it is that he doesn't seem to remember terms for things, messing them up or putting the backwards (i.e. not remembering which is bigger a cm, m or km). He also gets set on one way of doing something and is not willing to try other methods which may be easier in the long run. If he learns something the wrong way at first it is nearly impossible to teach him to do it the right way.
| Quote: | I've found deadlines motivate me the best. The papers I didn't started writing until 4 or 5 hours before they were due are the ones that i was always told were my best.
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I'm also like that. I'd do far better work when I pulled an all-nighter than if I spread it out over time...
| Quote: | | Froma teachers perspective, turn his work into something he likes. for example if he loves dinosaurs, isntead of asking him what 2 + 5 is, say 2 brontosauruses were launging in the sun when they were joined by 5 triceratops. How many dinosaurs were there? |
I wonder if there is a way to try this. I don't know if it would work, but it might. L's interests are mostly board games and video games. I think that once he finds purpose to things he will do better, but right now...
The thing I am working most on getting him to be interested in is getting his Cub badges. He really likes getting the badges and feels proud of the accomplishment in the long run. Now if only he would show the initiative to work on the badges without my husband and I pushing him at all times. He will do the work, but grouses and tries to get out of it. When he is reminded that he won't get the badge unless he does the work he'll do it more readily, but he still does everything to the bare minimum  |
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Triangular_Trees
What is right is sometimes found on the left.
Joined: Jul 18, 2007
Posts: 2053
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I wonder if there is a way to try this. I don't know if it would work, but it might. L's interests are mostly board games and video games. I think that once he finds purpose to things he will do better, but right now... |
that wshould be easy. you can turn anything into a game - the bulk of my education courses consisted of that
| Quote: | | The thing I am working most on getting him to be interested in is getting his Cub badges. He really likes getting the badges and feels proud of the accomplishment in the long run. Now if only he would show the initiative to work on the badges without my husband and I pushing him at all times. He will do the work, but grouses and tries to get out of it. When he is reminded that he won't get the badge unless he does the work he'll do it more readily, but he still does everything to the bare minimum |
Why are you choosing what he should be getting interested in? That seems like a pretty big root to the problem your having - let him choose what he wants to like, don't choose it for him. It could even be its not the badge he likes, but the way you react to him earning one |
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