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Ogouferay
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Jul 03, 2008
Age: 168
Posts: 40
Location: Gehenna, Sigil Chambers
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 Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:28 am Post subject: |
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I wonder.... A good dose of reality never actually hurt anyone. There are cases where some people who've been trapped in the mire of deep depression and suicidal tendencies have been snapped back out of it by having to face reality. A bit of 'reverse psychology' would be akin to it; like when someone keeps on with 'woe is me, I wanna die' and someone says 'well go ahead, why don't you do it?' Some see it as egging them on, while others see it as making them see the bigger picture, that their worries aren't as big as what they are making out. Whether the people who contribute to this area may benefit is anyone's guess, but to pooh-pooh the suggestion that a little 'hard reality' wouldn't work may be a little naive.
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MissConstrue
Aquarius
Joined: Feb 05, 2008
Age: 26
Posts: 10852
Location: Anywhere but HERE!
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| Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:43 am Post subject: |
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^Only problem with that is, it never worked for me. I guess it might work for some people though.
I can't name how many people would tell me to suck it up or cheer up or either do it or don't.
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Ogouferay
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Jul 03, 2008
Age: 168
Posts: 40
Location: Gehenna, Sigil Chambers
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| Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 7:42 am Post subject: |
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It may work, or may not; it depends on the individual. I doubt that whining or continuing to complain and getting heaps of sympathy without any real help is going to make things better. Internet forums are good for discussion, but I'm not sure whether total reliance on them for help when all you get is 'sympathy' is a good thing. Especially when people talk of suicide, because the lack of qualified people amongst the membership of said forums only too ready to give some 'advice' can do more harm than good. Reverse psychology can work, and there has been success, but as I said, it depends on the case. Humour in most cases has been known to work wonders extremely well, but without the ability to detect sarcasm and the humour itself, then some people may be left wondering 'what the?'
I doubt though that the creation of a fictional character, even at the expense of a couple of people is going to cause an enormous amount of harm in the long run. BTW, I wonder how many of the people that were affected actually felt so aggrieved that they would commit some self-harm or whatever? I don't think there'd be any at all.
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MR_BOGAN
Mysterios Dirty Dancer
Joined: Mar 06, 2008
Age: 30
Posts: 1854
Location: The great trailer park in the sky!
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| Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Ogouferay wrote: | | It may work, or may not; it depends on the individual. |
I agreed, but you see in the case where it doesn't work you may make the individual worse, that is why you have to exercise restraint. |
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Ogouferay
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Jul 03, 2008
Age: 168
Posts: 40
Location: Gehenna, Sigil Chambers
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| Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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What is that quote, 'for the good of the many?'....
When not knowing the full background of anyone on a forum, because of limited information, you can only go on what is on the screen in front of you. So when you see a message about how someone is depressed and they are having a hard time, your immediate thought can be 'why are they complaining here? Why don't they get some real help?' Words on a screen are no true indication of the inner person, and the inner person may be screaming out for a cyber-slap (or the equivalent). To be denied this because of a judgemental call that everyone should be treated with 'kidd gloves' is maybe stopping them from realising that what they are doing is causing them more harm. But as you say, it may not work for everyone. I would think though that there is no harm in trying.
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MR_BOGAN
Mysterios Dirty Dancer
Joined: Mar 06, 2008
Age: 30
Posts: 1854
Location: The great trailer park in the sky!
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| Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Ogouferay wrote: | What is that quote, 'for the good of the many?'....
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I quoted the first part of your last post.
| Ogouferay wrote: |
When not knowing the full background of anyone on a forum, because of limited information, you can only go on what is on the screen in front of you. So when you see a message about how someone is depressed and they are having a hard time, your immediate thought can be 'why are they complaining here? Why don't they get some real help?'
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I believe getting advice from other people that have got similiar problems is real help. This site has helped me out.
| Ogouferay wrote: |
Words on a screen are no true indication of the inner person, and the inner person may be screaming out for a cyber-slap (or the equivalent). To be denied this because of a judgemental call that everyone should be treated with 'kidd gloves' is maybe stopping them from realising that what they are doing is causing them more harm. But as you say, it may not work for everyone. I would think though that there is no harm in trying. |
I'm sure most members with problems probably get judged enough in there real life and they probably come here to escape that.
I do see your point about people that constantly grizzle about their problems and make themselves worse by not doing anything about them and use WP to feed off peoples sympathy. With those members if you be straight up with them without insulting them or putting them down I don't see any problem with that. I do draw the line at personally attacking them though, if you do that then they will just end up arguing with you rather than taking your advice.
From time to time people just need a bit of support, I think that is all they are after. |
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CanyonWind
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 12, 2006
Posts: 1223
Location: West of the Great Divide
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| Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 10:58 am Post subject: |
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Dang, lau, assuming you're still around, couldn't say for certain, but there's times I suspect you might be an aspie.
So I figured I'd explain myself so you can tell me again that you can't figure out what I'm talking about.
Gotta be an archaeologist here, but here's the posted pic of the fictional character lollylongs:
| lollylongs wrote: | 
Me. |
So that was the basis for the reference to "women who need to bring a wheelbarrow to the mall because they buy more makeup than they can carry."
Which is exactly why this episode succeeded brilliantly as a deception, but failed completely as a malicious fraud. It was simply too believable, so nobody would have any reason to feel dumb about being fooled. I didn't feel dumb.
Sure, the picture was easy to find on google images... as long as you knew that the search term was "emo girl".
But why would anybody have even thought to look? What would have them suspicious?
So the fictional woman dedicates huge amounts of time to making herself look like the above picture in her search for true love or something.
Then she complains about guys she attracts who "seemed nice at first, but then..." Gee, I wonder why.
Then she concludes that "I think all guys are like that."
Who would have trouble believing such a character actually exists? Nobody who's spent time around wrongplanet.
I want to stress again, I know that all women aren't like that. I don't appreciate being judged by the worst behavior seen in males, and I think it's entirely reasonable for females to feel the same way.
But I believe the warrior comedians from that place called zomg learned from their last mistake.
They've got another thread running now, one that's got more holes than a target on the machine gun range, couldn't possibly be true, but last time I looked, everybody has been fooled.
And what it demonstrates about wrongplanet is deeply disturbing.
Which means they're doing us a huge favor. Buddha suggested that we should look at someone who points out our faults as someone who points to the location of a treasure.
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I can't take up my rifle
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But I ain't a gonna love 'em
And that's for certain sure.
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Ogouferay
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Jul 03, 2008
Age: 168
Posts: 40
Location: Gehenna, Sigil Chambers
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| Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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| CanyonWind wrote: | Dang, lau, assuming you're still around, couldn't say for certain, but there's times I suspect you might be an aspie.
So I figured I'd explain myself so you can tell me again that you can't figure out what I'm talking about.
Gotta be an archaeologist here, but here's the posted pic of the fictional character lollylongs:
| lollylongs wrote: |
Me. |
So that was the basis for the reference to "women who need to bring a wheelbarrow to the mall because they buy more makeup than they can carry."
Which is exactly why this episode succeeded brilliantly as a deception, but failed completely as a malicious fraud. It was simply too believable, so nobody would have any reason to feel dumb about being fooled. I didn't feel dumb.
Sure, the picture was easy to find on google images... as long as you knew that the search term was "emo girl".
But why would anybody have even thought to look? What would have them suspicious?
So the fictional woman dedicates huge amounts of time to making herself look like the above picture in her search for true love or something.
Then she complains about guys she attracts who "seemed nice at first, but then..." Gee, I wonder why.
Then she concludes that "I think all guys are like that."
Who would have trouble believing such a character actually exists? Nobody who's spent time around wrongplanet.
I want to stress again, I know that all women aren't like that. I don't appreciate being judged by the worst behavior seen in males, and I think it's entirely reasonable for females to feel the same way.
But I believe the warrior comedians from that place called zomg learned from their last mistake.
They've got another thread running now, one that's got more holes than a target on the machine gun range, couldn't possibly be true, but last time I looked, everybody has been fooled.
And what it demonstrates about wrongplanet is deeply disturbing.
Which means they're doing us a huge favor. Buddha suggested that we should look at someone who points out our faults as someone who points to the location of a treasure. |
Actually, the impression I got with the analogy was that a lot of the people in these threads go to such lengths to put on all these veneers to hide the real person inside, it's as if they have buried themselves and made themselves so artificial that when someone finally breaks down the layers, all they get is a very shallow person with nothing much of a personality at all. Either that, or one sad individual who had to create a persona just to get accepted amongst the cliques (Ugly Betty, for eg). Either way, the fictional character worked, and here we have a mod who can't tell the difference between fraud and fiction, and one who thinks there was some gain (though I can't see how you could profit with laughter, unless there is a crime in that), and neither of them could see the real side of it - which was to make people realise that forever moaning and griping and whingeing about little trivial things gets them absolutely nowhere.
BTW, I posted the REAL definitions of both those words on the previous page.
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sinsboldly
Free Range Aspie
Joined: Nov 22, 2006
Age: 57
Posts: 7033
Location: The Emerald Forest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 2:48 am Post subject: |
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and to think you don't even respond to the name of Ezili Freda.
Merle
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Ogouferay
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Jul 03, 2008
Age: 168
Posts: 40
Location: Gehenna, Sigil Chambers
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| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:20 am Post subject: |
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Elucidate, my devilish friend. Before moving to my residence in Gehenna, I took over the Deadside Lordship while at Isledead.
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sinsboldly
Free Range Aspie
Joined: Nov 22, 2006
Age: 57
Posts: 7033
Location: The Emerald Forest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:22 am Post subject: |
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| Ogouferay wrote: | | Elucidate, my devilish friend. Before moving to my residence in Gehenna, I took over the Deadside Lordship while at Isledead. |
of all the Ogous. . Feray was husband of Ezili Freda.
Merle
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Ogouferay
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Jul 03, 2008
Age: 168
Posts: 40
Location: Gehenna, Sigil Chambers
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| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:33 am Post subject: |
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Oh yes, my Haitian voodoo seemed to have slipped my memory. Good to see you are up on it as well.
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sinsboldly
Free Range Aspie
Joined: Nov 22, 2006
Age: 57
Posts: 7033
Location: The Emerald Forest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:56 am Post subject: |
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| Ogouferay wrote: | | Oh yes, my Haitian voodoo seemed to have slipped my memory. Good to see you are up on it as well. |
well, you can forget the basics, when you are all undead and stuff
Merle
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MissConstrue
Aquarius
Joined: Feb 05, 2008
Age: 26
Posts: 10852
Location: Anywhere but HERE!
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| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 6:33 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | It may work, or may not; it depends on the individual. I doubt that whining or continuing to complain and getting heaps of sympathy without any real help is going to make things better. Internet forums are good for discussion, but I'm not sure whether total reliance on them for help when all you get is 'sympathy' is a good thing. |
I second that because it can get annoying when one is either doing it for attention or disregarding those who are trying to resourceful rather than all sympathy. For me I had to actually GET HELP. In some forums when I post suggestions like that, I notice some OPs take offense as though I were insulting them. The internet is not the best place to get that kind of help only feedback, otherwise we'd all be certified gurus in unison.
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Oh you can't help that. We're all mad here.
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6thSin:Envy |
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CanyonWind
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 12, 2006
Posts: 1223
Location: West of the Great Divide
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| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 10:44 am Post subject: |
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I think it's appropriate to mention that wrongplanet is a lot more than just another internet forum.
None of the experts could do anything effective to help alcoholics until a couple of alcoholics got together and formed Alcoholics Anonymous to help each other.
The condition is so alien to a normal person's experience that they find it impossible to comprehend. I think it's similar with aspies.
I remember telling a counselor once that I found it extremely stressful going to restaurants, because I had no idea how I was supposed to act or what was expected of me.
The counselor couldn't understand how it was possible for anybody to find it difficult to go to a restaurant because it was obviously such a simple thing to do.
People on wrongplanet understand stuff like that, and that understanding is worth much more than a diploma.
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I can't take up my rifle
And fight 'em anymore,
But I ain't a gonna love 'em
And that's for certain sure.
-traditional |
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