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paolo
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 1047
Location: Italy
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 Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:05 pm Post subject: Loneliness at the end |
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I have tried several times to bring forth one subject: the fact that if all humans are lonely, if autistic people are more lonely than others, old people “in the ASD syndrome” are, as a rule, more lonely than anybody else. There have recently been some efforts by the British NAS to reach at least some statistical evaluation of the problem. But here, on WP, very few people want to discuss the extreme loneliness of the end. There may be some unbecomingness about talking of one’s own old age. But the problem touches old and young people alike. In fact this shows, if need be, how hidden in our consciousness is the subject of death, while life and death are interwoven in an inextricable way.
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Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.
--Samuel Beckett |
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Zsazsa
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 20, 2007
Posts: 600
Location: Upstate New York, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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When we are born, we come into the world crying and all those people around us are smiling with joy. I hope to leave the world
with the people around me tearful and sad to see me go...but, in having lived a very full life, I will be the one smiling with joy. |
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lelia
Pika
Joined: Apr 12, 2007
Age: 56
Posts: 1309
Location: Vancouver not BC, Washington not DC
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| Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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| That is so true of my Asperger's dad, but it seems to be what he wants. Certainly he likes me to visit, for about twenty minutes, and then he starts looking at his watch and mentioning all the busy things he needs to do. He's so feeble now that doing the laundry takes him all day. |
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asplanet
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 11, 2007
Posts: 1651
Location: Cyberspace, New Zealand
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| Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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This one perplexes me, my own mother years before she died stopped seeing anyone, including her own children. As I get older I cut myself off more and more, but I do wonder is this partly because the majority of the world crushes our every turn, having to continually explain, trying to fit it can become tasks in themselves. Maybe we grow in confidence to believe and be who we are, are we really lonely or does society not allow individualization, to be honest if I had the control to reinvent my own world, would be so much happier... but I am not allowed, so guess it does get lonely living in a world that does not want to allow me to share my deserve difference, so what choice do I have but to enjoy this world behind closed doors....
_________________
"Believe in your self, we are who we are - as it can feel like an endless task trying to be someone else!" Alyson Bradley ...
Aspergers Parallel Planet web site - http://asplanet.info/index.php
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paolo
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 1047
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 2:05 am Post subject: |
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| I agree with Asplanet and I practice the same policy. All my attempts to explain what being autistic means have failed. At this point the only thing we might do should be to make of "the remains of the day", a work of art. I will try to make more clear what I mean. |
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TRUE
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 21, 2007
Posts: 710
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 9:28 am Post subject: |
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| asplanet wrote: | | This one perplexes me, my own mother years before she died stopped seeing anyone, including her own children. As I get older I cut myself off more and more, but I do wonder is this partly because the majority of the world crushes our every turn, having to continually explain, trying to fit it can become tasks in themselves. Maybe we grow in confidence to believe and be who we are, are we really lonely or does society not allow individualization, to be honest if I had the control to reinvent my own world, would be so much happier... but I am not allowed, so guess it does get lonely living in a world that does not want to allow me to share my deserve difference, so what choice do I have but to enjoy this world behind closed doors.... |
I have pretty much cut myself off from everything. Oh, I make a few attempts online, but that's about it. It just gets harder and more disappointing. So much ends in failure. At least where people are concerned.
I'm good with the animals, so I spend my time with them. They don't mind my quirkiness. And they can be affectionate, whereas people aren't. They don't have the same crappy human traits and they don't play a lot of games. I'm very devoted to them, and they seem to be devoted to me.
The things I never got from people, I get from animals. |
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asplanet
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 11, 2007
Posts: 1651
Location: Cyberspace, New Zealand
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| TRUE wrote: | I have pretty much cut myself off from everything. Oh, I make a few attempts online, but that's about it. It just gets harder and more disappointing. So much ends in failure. At least where people are concerned.
I'm good with the animals, so I spend my time with them. They don't mind my quirkiness. And they can be affectionate, whereas people aren't. They don't have the same crappy human traits and they don't play a lot of games. I'm very devoted to them, and they seem to be devoted to me. The things I never got from people, I get from animals. |
I agree, we seem to have a nature connection/understanding with animals, they seem more in tuned with the nature world like us, where as many NTs seem to feel the more they consume the better they are. I feel we have a much better respect for animals and the world in general.
_________________
"Believe in your self, we are who we are - as it can feel like an endless task trying to be someone else!" Alyson Bradley ...
Aspergers Parallel Planet web site - http://asplanet.info/index.php
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pbcoll
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 15, 2007
Posts: 1637
Location: England
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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I'm sure I will die lonely, but I do not think I will die old. When the few people I actually love die, there will no longer be any reason to live.
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I neither take revenge, nor beg for favours. (Rabindranath Tagore)
I am the steppenwolf that never learned to dance. (Sedaka) |
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CaptainMac
Snowy Owl
Joined: Mar 10, 2008
Posts: 166
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 2:47 am Post subject: |
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I worry about this myself. I'm not getting any younger and neither are my family members.
I'm an only child with only one member of my close family younger than me, and I don't even see her much at all. When my parents, etc. die off I will have just my dogs at home.
My fear is that I'll die and I'll go unnoticed until a tax collector comes by to ask a dead corpse why I never paid my taxes (because I'm dead!) What will my dogs do if this happens? |
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paolo
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 1047
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 8:05 am Post subject: |
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This is a tough thing to say. So I don’t know where to post it exactly. I use to post in some sites for and of autistic people, and in sites of people believing to be “normal”. Do they really exist, normal people? What is “normal”? and is it good to be normal in an abnormal horrible society?
Well this is the problem: would it be better to push disables off the cliff, rather than having them taken care of by mercenaries (paid nurses), or by the “next of kin” whose only desire is that the old and disabled people terminate their life the sooner the better. I think I lived all my life without love, though I have always desperately wanted love, meaningful love, not fulfillment of a duty. I had in my life taken care of persons I didn’t love at all. It’s awful. I have seen nurses making their chores with absolute cynicism. What scares me is the idea of having before me in my last conscious moments a face contriving a faked grief, a faked compassion, a faked sympathy.
Dr. Gachet (Artaud “Van Gogh le suicidé de la societé”) .
I want to assure that, at the best of my knowledge I am not sick, though certainly old.
_________________
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.
--Samuel Beckett |
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Apatura
Phoenix
Joined: Jul 25, 2006
Age: 35
Posts: 1184
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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I don't know how lonely I will be when I'm old. My main fears about being elderly are losing my eyesight (and thus my ability to read) and being placed in an institutionalized setting (lack of privacy, florescent lights... etc....). And obviously I don't want to be a burden or nuisance to my children.
I'm hoping that I'll care less and less about loneliness as I grow older. I seem to care less now than when I was a teenager or in my 20s. Maybe by the time I'm 70, I really will be prepared to be a hermit.
As I watch my father (who I think is AS) age, he seems to be getting calmer, as far as meltdowns go, but also sadder. |
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Argon
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Jul 18, 2008
Posts: 52
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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| I'd only panic if my internet went away. |
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asplanet
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 11, 2007
Posts: 1651
Location: Cyberspace, New Zealand
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 6:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Argon wrote: | | I'd only panic if my Internet went away. |
That I have to agree with, it would be like losing a family member... when not working I really miss it how sad is that  so aspie community I really need my new found extended family 
Hi Paolo ..
Quote "faked grief, a faked compassion, a faked sympathy".
As I get older I am calmer and more excepting of who I am, feel a lot to do with understanding...
I have often felt like you in the fact that my emotions, situations are fake... but feel this has a lot to do with having to be what we are not, play the part to make others feel at ease... as I get older maybe more eccentric, allowing myself to be who I have truly found I am... in part it has isolated me, and mostly the NT world have backed off... but I feel less fake. Society I feel creates our isolation, as they would prefer we conform rather than except us for who we are...
Paolo
Quote:"desperately wanted love, meaningful love, not fulfillment of a duty"
I feel like this and always have to a point, but think this is due to the fact that I have always wanted what will never be available to me, an imagine of what NTs experience, I never knew what to expect or look for in life up until now and to be very honest a lot of my life I have felt extremely sad and lonely, confused lost like so many of us. But at last with finding aspergers I am beginning to enjoy, and find my true identity, I am happy when allowed to be in my own space, but still find the majority of the world an unforgiving place!
_________________
"Believe in your self, we are who we are - as it can feel like an endless task trying to be someone else!" Alyson Bradley ...
Aspergers Parallel Planet web site - http://asplanet.info/index.php
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Postperson
The Daughter of Indifference
Joined: Jul 10, 2004
Age: 51
Posts: 2559
Location: Uz
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 4:02 am Post subject: |
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I have become more isolated as I've aged. I no longer work or study which was a source of social contact for me. No kids, no near family. I quite expect to get cancer as it's in the gene pool and it usally involves a hospital death. Both my parents went that way....so fingers crossed I won't end up dying and not being found for a long time.
I have two dogs but I should outlive them hopefully. It's bit of a worry this dying alone and who will look after my pets thing. I think that's the main reason people keep in contact with others, to be seen doing the same thing at the same time by other locals, whether you eat at a cafe or deliver junk mail, it can be a useful thing to do, that people know your habits, volunteering too, that's a way of being seen. We have 'senior citizens' clubs in Australia, it's bingo and cheap meals sort of thing. I used to volunteer at one. It can be a good idea to attend one regularly when you're aging and alone, at least that way people will notice if you don't turn up and make some enquiries about you. Death is frequent there, they're always going to funerals, so it's a bit like a club for people who expect to die.
I haven't made a will yet as I find it hard to think of anyone I'd want to leave money to (you know how people treat you when you're an undx'ed aspie, ugh). I will be using the public trustee as executor.
If it's any consolation to any other loners out there who worry about aging, I've known plenty of people with adult children who die alone. It's no guarantee that you will be 'looked after' or helped in your old age.
It's been a wierd week in my little town, a suicide (he shot himself in the garage - his brother found him) and a couple of other deaths. |
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Sora
Illogical, Irrational
Joined: Sep 16, 2006
Age: 20
Posts: 2483
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 10:47 am Post subject: |
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Well, non-autistic old people have the same problem. Some rot at home, can't walk and can't hear or see right anymore and no relative and friend comes to them. Nobody ever dares to talk about any old people that no can longer participate in society on the same conditions as younger people.
If you walk an old lady out who's over 90 years old and sitting in a wheelchair most of the time, even the mothers with their children in push chairs get annoyed by the 'lack of space' (not taking notice that a stupid pushchair is a total waste of space as well, if anyone wants to say that vehicles that help people are a 'waste').
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The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. Terry Pratchett |
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