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China
Butterfly
Joined: Sep 19, 2008
Posts: 9
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 Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:36 pm Post subject: Stubborn or "frozen"? |
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My son is 9 and has ADHD and a diagnosis of PDD(NOS) when he was 5. His doctor now thinks he has improved to the point that he looks more like someone with Aspergers. Anyway, I have a question about his tendency to not answer some questions. I cannot determine whether he is freezing up or is being excessively stubborn. My tendency at this point is to lean toward thinking he's being stubborn.
He talks well, he just has a funny intonation and some odd pronunications. Ordinary questions he can usually answer quickly, although usually with a long answer when a short one would do.
When I ask a question that could be interpreted as a "you might be in trouble" question, he puckers up his face and refuses/or won't speak. He also does this if he looks mad or sad and I ask him what is wrong. I can't decide if his fear or emotion is causing his verbal center to freeze up or if he is just being really stubborn and refusing to say anything that might incriminate him.
I know that no one here could tell me for sure what he is doing, but I'm wondering if anyone experiences this themselves and if they know they sometimes freeze under pressure, or if they just feel like digging in when confronted and decide to become mute.
If I make him sit out until he decides to answer or I press him for an answer he starts to cry and/or tantrum.
Thanks for any insight or comments.
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patternist
Stirring the pot....
Joined: Jul 29, 2008
Age: 35
Posts: 1833
Location: wouldn't you like to know?
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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IMHO, if this only happens when he thinks he might be in trouble, he might be frozen trying to think of what the "right" answer is. Although most kids might stall by saying "umm...." and then be better able to think of a convenient answer.
If normalcy in communication is one of the goals, I'd say this is progress. |
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China
Butterfly
Joined: Sep 19, 2008
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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| patternist wrote: | | If normalcy in communication is one of the goals, I'd say this is progress. |
Yes, he has made progress. He used to not answer ANY questions. He would respond to simple commands, but asked any question he would just not answer. This was when he was 3 or 4. For example, I would ask, "Do you want orange juice or apple juice?"
I would stand and look at him and wait and not let him walk away, and he would just duck his head and say nothing and not nod or anything. Finally I thought to start giving him yes or no questions and then telling him, "Say "yes" or "no"." This helped. Now, at 9, he is much more free with answering most questions. |
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zghost
Phoenix
Joined: Oct 29, 2007
Posts: 767
Location: Southeast Texas
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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I might understand, I was similar as a child. In certain situations, I would be literally be unable to get words out. The ones I remember the most were about manners, like when someone gave me something: All the sudden I was on the spot, knew what I was supposed to say but it was so hard. And then my mom would go "And what do you say?" and then it was impossible, I couldn't say it no matter what.
| Quote: | | When I ask a question that could be interpreted as a "you might be in trouble" question, he puckers up his face and refuses/or won't speak. |
Try asking qusetions that can be answered in yes or on. Then he can still nod or shake his head if he can't get the words out. Questions that require me to launch into an explination can still freeze me to this day. Yes and no I can do.
| Quote: | | He also does this if he looks mad or sad and I ask him what is wrong. I can't decide if his fear or emotion is causing his verbal center to freeze up or if he is just being really stubborn and refusing to say anything that might incriminate him. |
Probably a confusiong combination of all of those. It was more emotions than I could ever sort out.
| Quote: | | I know that no one here could tell me for sure what he is doing, but I'm wondering if anyone experiences this themselves and if they know they sometimes freeze under pressure, or if they just feel like digging in when confronted and decide to become mute. |
Can't say for sure really, don't know him.
| Quote: | | If I make him sit out until he decides to answer or I press him for an answer he starts to cry and/or tantrum. |
People would pull the "you can have it when...." thing with me, I never could do it. I'd just go without whatever it was. It was just more pressure, made it impossible. I was never really a tantrum kid though, and I hated to cry, even though I did it a lot.
Well, that's all the insight I have, maybe some of it is usefull. |
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China
Butterfly
Joined: Sep 19, 2008
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:41 pm Post subject: thanks Zghost |
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| Thank you zghost, that was very helpful. Thank you for putting yourself out there. Any hints as to what might work for a kid who is "frozen"? Just have to wait until he can sort it out? |
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0_equals_true
Quack!
Joined: Apr 06, 2007
Age: 26
Posts: 5005
Location: London
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| How does 'you might be in trouble' become a question? If you are offering him a statement or a rhetorical question then there is nothing to answer. |
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mysterious_misfit
Velociraptor
Joined: Apr 25, 2008
Age: 27
Posts: 438
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| I get frozen when I feel under emotional pressure. Try teaching him some sign language. Or have him write an answer. |
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jat
Snowy Owl
Joined: Mar 30, 2008
Posts: 151
Location: Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Long ago, I learned that when my son couldn't answer a question, and I really needed to know something, I had to explain why I needed an answer, and offer two or three possible answers. He would tell me "one," "two," or "three," or "none of the above." Sometimes it would be a combination of the possible answers I'd offered and sometimes my suggestions would give him a starting point to answer me. Sometimes he just doesn't want to talk about it at all, and I have learned to respect that. If he doesn't want to talk about it, sometimes it's something that he will agree to talk about later. But there are times when a child - any child - does not want to talk about something and one cannot force it. With kids with Asperger's, this is even more the case. Verbal communication is like a second language, and when they are having a hard time, trying to force them to answer questions will only be counter-productive, increasing the child's anxiety and reducing his ability to respond. If it's something important, I generally tell him that we do need to talk about it, and we can talk about it later. Then I drop it until later, and when my son is less agitated, we have a conversation. I think that knowing in advance that it needs to be discussed gives my son a chance to process things so he can then verbalize his thoughts. |
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China
Butterfly
Joined: Sep 19, 2008
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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| 0_equals_true wrote: | | How does 'you might be in trouble' become a question? If you are offering him a statement or a rhetorical question then there is nothing to answer. |
I'm not literally saying to him "you might be in trouble". A you-might-be-in-trouble question would be a question that he thinks indicates that he is in trouble.
For example: If I ask "What are you doing?" He almost always thinks that I am asking because he has done something wrong. He doesn't catch my tone, he just thinks this question is always about me trying to find out what kind of mischief has been going on.
If I ask, "What did you make on your test today?" and he made anything less than 100% correct, he might freeze up. (He is very hard on himself when it comes to his grades at school.)
Another example of a question that might freeze him up is, "Did you understand me when I said 'Don't throw that?" (if he just threw that and DID understand me) |
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DW_a_mom
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 23, 2008
Posts: 1251
Location: Northern California
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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My AS son has trouble admitting to things that might get him into adverse consequences, and he is fairly well incapable of lying, so he often gets tongue tied because he just doesn't know what to answer. My NT daughter will just throw a lie out there to escape her inner emotional turmoil, but my son simply is not capable of doing that. So, instead, he practically throws himself into sensory overload trying to figure out how to answer without having to suffer.
My response has been to try to make situations feel safe for him to tell the truth. At times, simply because he told me, I will fogo consequences and instead ask him if he has suggestions on how I can help him learn to not repeat that behavior again the future. If he were to take advantage of this and somehow integrate it as a way to get away with things, I would stop but, so far, he hasn't. He has a very strong inner will to do what is "right," it is just that (a) sometimes he has a different idea about what that is than I do and (b) sometimes he can't control himself. Logical discussions go very far with him on getting the results I want.
I've heard from parents that you won't ever hear much a son, that they will keep it all to themselves, but mine shares quite a lot with me. For that, I am glad.
So ... it could be a number of things. The boy tendency to keep quiet, sensory or emotional overload, or avoidance. I think that working on open and trusting communication is the best default route to go.
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KingdomOfRats
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 01, 2005
Age: 24
Posts: 2675
Location: Manchester
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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China,
even though say he is verbal enough,could he have difficulty putting an answer in his head into words? could it be difficulty with not understanding the language used? could it be he has more difficulty with processing some words and questions than others?
his freeze reactions could be information overload.
am still need everything said in basic form,when people use too much language,or give too many options,or use difficult words it overloads am completely and result is self injury,shutdown or meltdown.
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PunkyKat
Phoenix
Joined: May 15, 2008
Posts: 697
Location: Twlight Zone
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| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:27 pm Post subject: |
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| I've always been accused of being stubborn, which I am. If I don't want to do something or feel uncomfortable doing so, be prepaired to fight fire with fire. I often had people ask me questions I was uncomfortable with. Phycologists seemed to love asking me questions I was uncomfortable with answering. Just because a normal person would not find it uncomfortable dosen't mean I would not. Such as why I liked a certian thing so much or why I acted the way I did. Sometimes I felt uncomfortable or just did not know. If I said I did not know they would often say something to make me feel stupid. I also had a few pervy shrinks too. If I didn't want to answer someone it was usualy because I felt uncomfortable with their question or sometimes with the person. |
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