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geniuskid
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Oct 04, 2008
Posts: 31
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 Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:41 am Post subject: AS and murder. |
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| Quote: | | [A study attempting] to correlate pervasive developmental disorders in forensic settings implied that 15 percent of juveniles evaluated in a forensic setting in Sweden had autistic spectrum disorders. |
Additionally, Asperger's combined with psychopathy may also produce an individual that kills when upset, gets upset over small things and knows enough to clean up any evidence.
Do autism spectrum disorder make one more prone to violent crime?
Here are some "warning signs" that an individual could be a spree killer. I'd say some of those tends to be prevalent in cases of ASD.
| Quote: | In each spree killing case, there are warning signs that go unheeded. These are, according to the FBI and my own research:
- Inability to take criticism
- Unusual sensitivity to rejection which may form the basis for...
- Holding one or more grudges which remain unresolved and grow over time
- Lack of language skills to resolve grudges, avoid conflict, etc
- Intolerance
- Exaggerated sense of self-importance
- Narcissism and attention-seeking behaviour
- Nihilism
- Mood swings
- Inappropriate sense of humour
- Drug and alcohol abuse
- Fascination with violence in films and on TV
- Angry outbursts
- Obsession with weapons, usually guns, and excessive practising with firearms
- Often described as a loner with few friends
- Often the target of bullying, taunting and teasing which those in authority fail to identify, fail to address, fail to put a stop to - but often collude with
- Sometimes an unusual relationship with his mother, perhaps through cocooning or smothering - what Samenow describes as "well-intentioned but maladjusted parenting", which leads to poorly-developed social skills, an unusually poor self-image and an impaired ability to function successfully as an individual
- An unusually high degree of unwillingness to accept personal responsibility as an adult combined with a higher-than-average tendency to use blame
- An unusual relationship with either parent which may comprise lack of recognition, unmet needs, failure to meet parent's expectations, and constant undue criticism
- Often a non-sporting type at school which also led to him being regarded as an outcast, perhaps being regarded as a "nerd" or "geek" because he found solace in, for example, using computers or studying art, literature, poetry or dance
- A significant emotional event in childhood such as the loss of a parent or family breakdown which is still raw and unresolved
- Unusually poor social skills and social behaviour as an adult
- Emotional immaturity
- An unusually fragile sense of self, often present from an early age and without obvious cause
- Possible "mental health problems" although these may be more a sign of long-term psychiatric injury
- An increasing sense of isolation combined with increasing scapegoating or mobbing
- At work, a growing suspicion that he's shortly going to be fired or made redundant or failed in some way
- The spree killing has been brewing for some time although no-one was sufficiently clued up to recognise the signs
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I'm personally very fascinated with school shootings such as those in Columbine. It makes me sad when the moral police removes important videos and manifestos from internet servers. |
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bunny-in-the-moon
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Sep 19, 2008
Age: 20
Posts: 62
Location: Preston, Lancs, UK
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:55 am Post subject: Re: AS and murder. |
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| geniuskid wrote: | | Quote: | | [A study attempting] to correlate pervasive developmental disorders in forensic settings implied that 15 percent of juveniles evaluated in a forensic setting in Sweden had autistic spectrum disorders. |
Additionally, Asperger's combined with psychopathy may also produce an individual that kills when upset, gets upset over small things and knows enough to clean up any evidence.
Do autism spectrum disorder make one more prone to violent crime?
Here are some "warning signs" that an individual could be a spree killer. I'd say some of those tends to be prevalent in cases of ASD.
| Quote: | In each spree killing case, there are warning signs that go unheeded. These are, according to the FBI and my own research:
- Inability to take criticism
- Unusual sensitivity to rejection which may form the basis for...
- Holding one or more grudges which remain unresolved and grow over time
- Lack of language skills to resolve grudges, avoid conflict, etc
- Intolerance
- Exaggerated sense of self-importance
- Narcissism and attention-seeking behaviour
- Nihilism
- Mood swings
- Inappropriate sense of humour
- Drug and alcohol abuse
- Fascination with violence in films and on TV
- Angry outbursts
- Obsession with weapons, usually guns, and excessive practising with firearms
- Often described as a loner with few friends
- Often the target of bullying, taunting and teasing which those in authority fail to identify, fail to address, fail to put a stop to - but often collude with
- Sometimes an unusual relationship with his mother, perhaps through cocooning or smothering - what Samenow describes as "well-intentioned but maladjusted parenting", which leads to poorly-developed social skills, an unusually poor self-image and an impaired ability to function successfully as an individual
- An unusually high degree of unwillingness to accept personal responsibility as an adult combined with a higher-than-average tendency to use blame
- An unusual relationship with either parent which may comprise lack of recognition, unmet needs, failure to meet parent's expectations, and constant undue criticism
- Often a non-sporting type at school which also led to him being regarded as an outcast, perhaps being regarded as a "nerd" or "geek" because he found solace in, for example, using computers or studying art, literature, poetry or dance
- A significant emotional event in childhood such as the loss of a parent or family breakdown which is still raw and unresolved
- Unusually poor social skills and social behaviour as an adult
- Emotional immaturity
- An unusually fragile sense of self, often present from an early age and without obvious cause
- Possible "mental health problems" although these may be more a sign of long-term psychiatric injury
- An increasing sense of isolation combined with increasing scapegoating or mobbing
- At work, a growing suspicion that he's shortly going to be fired or made redundant or failed in some way
- The spree killing has been brewing for some time although no-one was sufficiently clued up to recognise the signs
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I'm personally very fascinated with school shootings such as those in Columbine. It makes me sad when the moral police removes important videos and manifestos from internet servers. |
lmao... I meet 22 of the 28 criteria... that's incredibly disturbing. Although not really surprising, there were times between me being the ages 14-18 where I fantasised about going on a killing spree  .
I'm a lot more settled and happier now though  and experiencing those kinds of thoughts myself has enabled me to identify individuals who I'm better off staying away from.
To be fair though, I don't give much credence to that list, or this idea that people with Asperger's are more prone to violence than any other individual. I personally believe that those with AS who adamantly defend this theory are trying to deal with a perceived sense of victimhood, seen as believing oneself to be capable of such things can be quite empowering to some. Also, those who adamantly rail against the theory, beyond a "reasonable" amount, I believe are desperately trying to protect the idea that aspies are more capable of having a positive effect on the world than NT's.
Obviously, I'm aware that this is just my own opinion and that things are by no means so black and white. Each person has thier own individual reasons for having whichever opinion they do on the subject. |
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Danielismyname
Troglodyte descended
Joined: Apr 03, 2007
Posts: 5926
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:00 am Post subject: Re: AS and murder. |
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| geniuskid wrote: | | Do autism spectrum disorder make one more prone to violent crime? |
On a whole, people with an ASD are less likely to commit violent crimes than the normal population (conversely, they have a greater incidence of it happening to them). This is from criminology studies. If violent crime does happen, it's usually arson which involves property damage.
You'd probably be interested in reading up on Martin Bryant; he was diagnosed with AS post-killing spree by a government psychiatrist. |
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donkey
we have met the enemy, he is us.
Joined: May 22, 2006
Age: 37
Posts: 1478
Location: ireland
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:27 am Post subject: |
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1st rule of any report:
correlation isnt causation
correlation isnt causation
you also need to define forensic setting.
_________________
a great civilisation cannot be conquered from without until it has destroyed itself from within- W. Durant |
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dadum
Butterfly
Joined: Aug 27, 2008
Posts: 11
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:29 am Post subject: Re: AS and murder. |
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| Quote: | | [A study attempting] to correlate pervasive developmental disorders in forensic settings implied that 15 percent of juveniles evaluated in a forensic setting in Sweden had autistic spectrum disorders. |
Does that mean that among the juveniles that were considered to possibly have one disorder or another, 15% had ASD?
If so then the quoted is missleading, that statistic doesn't link crime to autism.
15% of youth with 'psychatric problems' have ASD? Sounds like a fair number.
Statistics can be missleading, media sucks. |
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Reodor_Felgen
Counting down till Castro bites the dust
Joined: Sep 29, 2007
Age: 20
Posts: 1633
Location: Aspies for Freedom
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:44 am Post subject: |
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Anti-social personality disorder (which often leads to psycopathy) is not even on the autistic spectrum.
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WP doesn't have a working first amendment. |
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2ukenkerl
Phoenix
Joined: Jul 20, 2007
Posts: 4860
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:00 am Post subject: Re: AS and murder. |
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Here are some "warning signs" that an individual could be a spree killer. I'd say some of those tends to be prevalent in cases of ASD.
| Quote: | In each spree killing case, there are warning signs that go unheeded. These are, according to the FBI and my own research:
- Often described as a loner with few friends
- Often the target of bullying, taunting and teasing which those in authority fail to identify, fail to address, fail to put a stop to - but often collude with
- Sometimes an unusual relationship with his mother, perhaps through cocooning or smothering - what Samenow describes as "well-intentioned but maladjusted parenting", which leads to poorly-developed social skills, an unusually poor self-image and an impaired ability to function successfully as an individual
- Often a non-sporting type at school which also led to him being regarded as an outcast, perhaps being regarded as a "nerd" or "geek" because he found solace in, for example, using computers or studying art, literature, poetry or dance
- Unusually poor social skills and social behaviour as an adult
- An increasing sense of isolation combined with increasing scapegoating or mobbing
- At work, a growing suspicion that he's shortly going to be fired or made redundant or failed in some way
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The above fit me in some way.(Although 4 don't really fit NOW, since I am not in school, and 1 only APPEARS that way. The other 2 certainly would happen because some people just DON'T like honest competition, or are dishonest. People keep hiring friends and compatriots, and one jerk has blamed ME for problems HE created. But people like me, and he betrayed his company, which found out! ) Don't worry though. I am still not going to go on a killing spree, etc... |
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anna-banana
and yet it moves!
Joined: Aug 31, 2008
Age: 25
Posts: 1728
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:34 am Post subject: |
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I meet a lot of these criteria. I bet a lot of other people here would as well. I have a little problem with anger management at times.
my intellect tells me though that not only would killing people not solve any of my problems, it would also most likely get me in jail. so why do it?
_________________
I got some bad ideas in my head. (Taxi Driver) |
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ethos
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Sep 27, 2008
Posts: 33
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:37 am Post subject: |
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| Two words. Jeffery. Dahmer. |
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VMSnith
Blue Jay
Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 98
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:45 am Post subject: |
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Generally, studies show ASD people are a little less violent than the general population.
Unsubstantiated statements to the contrary just create more fear surrounding ASD. |
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bunny-in-the-moon
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Sep 19, 2008
Age: 20
Posts: 62
Location: Preston, Lancs, UK
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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Right, I really don't know much about how these studies are carried out, so please could someone explain to me??
Because, how do they figure this sort of thing out?? I've been a lot more violent than my peers over time, but who's to say that has anything or nothing to do with me having AS?? I just think that if an aspie does have a violent outburst, who's to say that his/her AS is the root of it? Could be many different reasons for it.
Forgive my ignorance on the subject, also my point being a little vague, could be because I'm incredibly hungry and can't really concentrate. |
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deathchibi
anime freak of nature!!!!
Joined: Oct 17, 2007
Age: 117
Posts: 7174
Location: earth
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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i met 24 of the criteria of the list in first post, in fact my entire class had a topic of murderers in (im still trying to figure out if its S.O.S.E or humanities) sose and he had the class vote on who is the most likely to be a murderer and i came 1st and the main person that bullied me came 2nd then surprisingly my friend came 3ed 
_________________
I shall rule the world with an iron spork!!!!
me fail english! thats unpossible!
4th sin: sloth. |
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ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
Phoenix
![]()
Joined: Jun 19, 2008
Posts: 1762
Location: US, midmap
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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Alright...so everyone knows who the potential killers are because of "profiles" like this one.
Let's say we know someone IRL that has traits or experiences that mimmick the ones listed on the profile.
What do you do with such a person? |
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Kelsi
Phoenix
Joined: Jun 23, 2007
Posts: 643
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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Most of those 'warning signs' fit people with certain Personality Disorders - especially Anti-Social, Borderline, and Narcissistic.
This has nothing to do with Asperger's.
However, it is of course possible for a small minority of Aspies to also have a Personality Disorder. |
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bunny-in-the-moon
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Sep 19, 2008
Age: 20
Posts: 62
Location: Preston, Lancs, UK
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| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 4:53 am Post subject: |
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| Kelsi wrote: | Most of those 'warning signs' fit people with certain Personality Disorders - especially Anti-Social, Borderline, and Narcissistic.
This has nothing to do with Asperger's.
However, it is of course possible for a small minority of Aspies to also have a Personality Disorder. |
I was diagnosed as an aspie when I was 14 and then when I was 19 I was diagnosed with "Personality Disorder NOS". Anyone else have any experience with this kind of comorbid diagnosis? |
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