CAIRO — Joining protests against US President George W. Bush's wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, two American nuns finally found themselves on the country's terrorist watch list.
"This term terrorist is a really serious accusation," Sister Ardeth Platte told The Washington Times on Friday, October 10.
Ardeth and Sister Carol Gilbert received letters from the Maryland State Police that they are placed on the terrorist watch list.
"There is no way that we ever want to be identified as terrorists," said Ardeth, a nun for 54 years.
"We are nonviolent. We are faith-based."
The two nuns are known for anti-war activities.
In 2002, they were jailed after breaking into an unmanned missile site in northeastern Colorado in protest over the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.
"We're Dominicans; our mission is 'veritas,' which is truth," said Sister Carol.
The Bush administration calls its watch list one of the most effective tools in its "war against terrorism."
The list was initially limited to criminals and drug traffickers, but an executive order by President George W. Bush after the 9/11 attacks expanded it to include terror suspects.
The record, compiled and overseen by the FBI, can be used by a wide range of government agencies in security screening.
The names are put on "no-fly" or "selectee" lists in US airports that subject them to travel bans, arrest or additional screening.
According to the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU), the US watch list has ballooned to one million records.
Muzzling
The nuns were among 53 anti-war activists on the watch list, which activists believe is a broader effort to control Maryland's protest community.
"It is clear to us that the full extent of the MSP's improper activities have yet to be fully disclosed," said David Rocah, a staff attorney for ACLU, which represented the nuns in the effort to obtain information on the spying.
E-mails released by ACLU show that Baltimore police were coordinating with the National Security Agency in 2003 and 2004 to spy on the protest group Quakers, who routinely protested outside the security agency's headquarters.
A police spokesman declined to answer questions whether the spying was more expansive or involved many other groups, saying he was unsure why the nuns and other activists were on the list.
"The fact there was a record with their name is the reason we're in this situation that were in," said spokesman Greg Shipley.
The two nuns said that the O'Malley administration is brushing off questions about broader police surveillance.
"Think they just want to kind of pooh-pooh it away and say it's no big thing," said Sister Carol, a nun for 43 years.
The nuns said that the government wants to muzzle the anti-war activists.
"Democracy is built on these elements on being able to speak out to speak what we believe is truth," Sister Carol said. _________________ Faith not supported by reason and empirical evidence is wishful thinking.
Joined: Jul 08, 2008 Posts: 1170 Location: Australia
Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 9:27 am Post subject:
Ha! Good! Nuns creep me out; and I hate bench-sitters who try and think protesting is a fun, quick "democratic" event! These two think they had a valid opinion; but they broke into a missile silo!! Gods, that list may be extreme, but some peoples behaviour has a justifiable place on such a list! Everybody remembers almost every incidence of a "peaceful" protest. _________________ Oh, well, fancy that! Isn't that neat, eh?
In 2002, they were jailed after breaking into an unmanned missile site in northeastern Colorado in protest over the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.
In some cases, it is kind of a stretch to figure out why people were put on the watch list, and one fears government power. But I would say that this is fairly justified.
Quote:
Most common definitions of terrorism include only those acts which are intended to create fear (terror), are perpetrated for an ideological goal (as opposed to a lone attack), and deliberately target or disregard the safety of non-combatants.
Joined: Jan 09, 2007 Age: 17 Posts: 1388 Location: Somewhere over Alagaesia
Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:46 pm Post subject:
I'm probably already on the list for the stuff I've said against various gov't and non-profit organizations here, but if so they haven't gotten around to telling me. Guess I'll find out next time I fly. I've actually been singled out for a slightly more extensive search before when I was in line at the gate (the lady wanted to see what was in my huge camera bag that I carry my stuff in on vacation) but I have no idea whether it was a random search or pre-determined by my security status. _________________ California, rest in peace
Simultaneous release
California, show your teeth
She's my priestess, I'm your priest... yeah, yeah, yeah
It is crazy to think that the government is afraid of two Nuns, have you ever heard of a nun committing a violent crime? I mean this is so insane I mean first little babies and toddlers were not allowed on a plane because they had the same name as someone on the list. People have gone from having acceptable fear of terrorism to being extremely paranoid to the point innocent people are being target as suspects for no good reason.
I find everyone's reactions in this thread, barring Ishmael's, rather puzzling. I realize this is a standard reaction to stories about people being put on the watchlist, but did any of you actually read the article? To requote:
Rodent wrote:
Quote:
In 2002, they were jailed after breaking into an unmanned missile site in northeastern Colorado in protest over the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.
Joined: Jul 08, 2008 Posts: 1170 Location: Australia
Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 5:11 am Post subject:
Khan_Sama wrote:
Unmanned.
Excactly. If you think about it; it's worse. Nobody to stop them if they accidentally/decided to do something really stupid. Their behaviour fits the legal definition of terrorism; just because they are nuns, doesn't mean they can get away with it.
What if I hijacked a plane - not with intent to crash it, but to "protest".
What would that make me? _________________ Oh, well, fancy that! Isn't that neat, eh?
I find everyone's reactions in this thread, barring Ishmael's, rather puzzling. I realize this is a standard reaction to stories about people being put on the watchlist, but did any of you actually read the article? To requote:
Rodent wrote:
Quote:
In 2002, they were jailed after breaking into an unmanned missile site in northeastern Colorado in protest over the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.
They didn't do anything, besides trespass I mean its not like they went over to fire a few Missiles at Washington, it was a protest nothing more. People are idiots a lot and this is a case where idiots are in power.
If they were to just stand on a street with signs they sure wouldn't have made the news.
Is it worse to trespass or to kill millions of people?
They made a statement.
_________________ "Blessed are they who suffer many experiences, for they shall be made perfect through suffering: they shall be as the angels of God in heaven and die no more, neither shall they be born anymore, for death and birth have no more dominion over them.&am
Joined: Jul 08, 2008 Posts: 1170 Location: Australia
Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 11:02 pm Post subject:
They legally fit terrorists!
Who knows what kind of security measures they could have set off - and who knows what behaviour they might have decided were rational?
Breaking into any sort of weapons facility is no "protest" or minor transgression!
I think, by that logic, just to "protest" - I may as well steal an F/A-18 and go on a tank hunting rampage - y'know, as an anti-war "protest".
Breaking into an armed facility is an aggresive act; not exactly anti-war by any realistic description. _________________ Oh, well, fancy that! Isn't that neat, eh?
C'mon...Lets be reasonable. I'd hardly say that running around with machine guns can be compared to what they did. Answer me this:
If you were living in Germany when the Jews were in the concentration camps and millions of people were being slaughtered for the Fatherland,
would you have done anything?
Do you think that if those nuns would have committed the same crime to make a political statement against the Nazis that it would have been an ethical move, or just an illegal action?
http://www.afghanistanafterdemocracy.com/page10.html _________________ "Blessed are they who suffer many experiences, for they shall be made perfect through suffering: they shall be as the angels of God in heaven and die no more, neither shall they be born anymore, for death and birth have no more dominion over them.&am
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