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Assassin
Phoenix
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Joined: Apr 24, 2005
Age: 19
Posts: 1679
Location: Not here, Not there, not anywhere.....
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 Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:04 pm Post subject: Patriotism = Imperialism |
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Patriotism ("I love my country") basically equates to "I think my countrys better than other countries"
"I think my countrys better than other countrys" is very close to saying "Other countrys shoud serve my country"
Discuss
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Chronicles of the Universe: Sons of Earth Volume 1 - Bounty Hunter now at 98 pages! Ill update this sig when it gets published.
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ed
Forum Moderator
Joined: Dec 20, 2004
Age: 64
Posts: 987
Location: central Massachusetts
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| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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I love my country, and consider myself almost a super-patriot. 
I don't think my country is better than others. In fact, as long as we are being governed by a mass-murder, I'm ashamed of my country. Which is why I won't rest until George Bush and his criminal gang stand trial in the world court for crimes against humanity. Then I can once again be proud of the country I love. |
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Endersdragon
Phoenix
Joined: Jun 14, 2005
Posts: 1666
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| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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Wait werent our founding fathers patroits because they thought our country should be free.
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"we never get respect ... never a fair trial
no one gives a sh** ... as long as we smile"
Im tired of smiling.
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Larval
Black Doves
Joined: Nov 16, 2005
Posts: 1037
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| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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Nah. One can be patriotic [deliberately misspelled to rhyme with neurotic ;] saying, "My country is better than your country. So we aren't going to trade with you or anything." This is isolationist policy, totally different from imperialism (the opposite in some ways) but still patriotic.
Can also be imperalist w/o being patriotic. (E.g. Other countries should serve "me", the new emperor of the world order.)
Granted, the 2 are so compatible and similitar that they often go hand in hand. |
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Endersdragon
Phoenix
Joined: Jun 14, 2005
Posts: 1666
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| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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Patriotic is just way too lose of a word to define that strictly.
_________________
"we never get respect ... never a fair trial
no one gives a sh** ... as long as we smile"
Im tired of smiling.
Vote for me in 2020 |
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Remnant
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 02, 2005
Posts: 2019
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| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 8:34 pm Post subject: |
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| ed wrote: | I love my country, and consider myself almost a super-patriot.
I don't think my country is better than others. In fact, as long as we are being governed by a mass-murder, I'm ashamed of my country. Which is why I won't rest until George Bush and his criminal gang stand trial in the world court for crimes against humanity. Then I can once again be proud of the country I love. |
You did know that Bush II negotiated a free pass from the World Court, didn't you? He didn't want the same embarassing black mark on his report card that they gave his father. |
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Remnant
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 02, 2005
Posts: 2019
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| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Larval wrote: | Nah. One can be patriotic [deliberately misspelled to rhyme with neurotic ;] saying, "My country is better than your country. So we aren't going to trade with you or anything." This is isolationist policy, totally different from imperialism (the opposite in some ways) but still patriotic.
Can also be imperalist w/o being patriotic. (E.g. Other countries should serve "me", the new emperor of the world order.)
Granted, the 2 are so compatible and similitar that they often go hand in hand. |
How about "Our country is better than your country. We are here for you if you need us."
That's where real greatness is. I am not greater than other animals because I am human and can dominate them. I am great because I will take care of them, protect them, and be there for them. |
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vetivert
gagged, but never silent
Joined: Sep 18, 2004
Posts: 5768
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| Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 3:26 am Post subject: |
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| biiiiiiiiiiiiig difference between patriotism and nationalism. |
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ed
Forum Moderator
Joined: Dec 20, 2004
Age: 64
Posts: 987
Location: central Massachusetts
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| Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 5:05 am Post subject: |
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| Remnant wrote: | | You did know that Bush II negotiated a free pass from the World Court, didn't you? He didn't want the same embarassing black mark on his report card that they gave his father. |
No, I'm not aware of this. Please explain.  |
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Sean
Banned
Joined: Apr 04, 2005
Posts: 3503
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| Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 5:57 am Post subject: |
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| ed wrote: | I love my country, and consider myself almost a super-patriot.
I don't think my country is better than others. In fact, as long as we are being governed by a mass-murder, I'm ashamed of my country. Which is why I won't rest until George Bush and his criminal gang stand trial in the world court for crimes against humanity. Then I can once again be proud of the country I love. |
Good luck!  Any 'evidence' trumped up against Bush would be a tota sham make the case for most of the Nuremberg trials look legit (a couple were legit but mishandled). It's all irrelevant because Bush currently has enough power to have the members of any tribunal killed anyway. It would be far easier for Bush to put members of the UN on a sham trial (trying the reresentatives that sat are sitting on their thumbs over Sudan would be legit enough) than the other way around. |
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Remnant
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 02, 2005
Posts: 2019
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| Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 6:20 am Post subject: |
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| ed wrote: | | Remnant wrote: | | You did know that Bush II negotiated a free pass from the World Court, didn't you? He didn't want the same embarassing black mark on his report card that they gave his father. |
No, I'm not aware of this. Please explain. |
This made the mainstream news just a few weeks ago.
BBC article
If I remember correctly, and I could be wrong, the excuse for the invasion of Iraq was that Saddam Hussein committed war crimes and it was our job to stop it and punish him for this. A lot of people won't understand where I got the idea that those who enforce such laws should live by them. In fact, one might expect the enforcers of such laws to demand to live by them, they are such good laws that over a thousand of our own were sacrificed in their name. |
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Ladysmokeater
Rogue Historian
Joined: Oct 22, 2005
Posts: 1048
Location: North of Atlanta, South of Boston, East of the Mississippi, and West of the Atlantic
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| Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 7:27 am Post subject: Re: Patriotism = Imperialism |
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| Assassin wrote: | Patriotism ("I love my country") basically equates to "I think my countrys better than other countries"
"I think my countrys better than other countrys" is very close to saying "Other countrys shoud serve my country"
Discuss |
you can Love ones country with out wanting total world domination.
I love my country, as it provides a free envireoment for me to exist. Do I think its better than all the others out there? not entirely. would I take up arms and defend if we were attacked? you bet. Being a patriot means that you are willing to defend, be that verbally or even physically if it came to it, or otherwise support your nation and defend the ideals that that nation was founded on. In being a patriot, you may not fully agree with every single thing that the country stands for, and you may not even be a citizen of that nation, but you are willing to do what you can in support of that nation. |
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RobertN
Phoenix
Joined: Jul 31, 2005
Posts: 934
Location: Cambridge, UK
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| Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 8:45 am Post subject: |
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Patriotism is blind and foolish. It is the product of mass indoctrination to coerce the population into defending the interests of a small elite.
Right now, it seems there is a war between capitalist dogs (USA) and terrorist radicals, and to be honest, they are both as bad as each other. In fact, the capitalists are even worse than the terrorists.....its just they kill their victims in a different way (mass 3rd world starvation and global warming) to the terrorists. |
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Endersdragon
Phoenix
Joined: Jun 14, 2005
Posts: 1666
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| Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 8:51 am Post subject: |
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| Sean wrote: | | ed wrote: | I love my country, and consider myself almost a super-patriot.
I don't think my country is better than others. In fact, as long as we are being governed by a mass-murder, I'm ashamed of my country. Which is why I won't rest until George Bush and his criminal gang stand trial in the world court for crimes against humanity. Then I can once again be proud of the country I love. |
Good luck! Any 'evidence' trumped up against Bush would be a tota sham make the case for most of the Nuremberg trials look legit (a couple were legit but mishandled). It's all irrelevant because Bush currently has enough power to have the members of any tribunal killed anyway. It would be far easier for Bush to put members of the UN on a sham trial (trying the reresentatives that sat are sitting on their thumbs over Sudan would be legit enough) than the other way around. |
Yes but we (as are they) are sitting around and doing nothing for whats going on in Darfur and that would be a much easier sham trial.
_________________
"we never get respect ... never a fair trial
no one gives a sh** ... as long as we smile"
Im tired of smiling.
Vote for me in 2020 |
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Ladysmokeater
Rogue Historian
Joined: Oct 22, 2005
Posts: 1048
Location: North of Atlanta, South of Boston, East of the Mississippi, and West of the Atlantic
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| Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 10:06 am Post subject: |
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| RobertN wrote: | Patriotism is blind and foolish. It is the product of mass indoctrination to coerce the population into defending the interests of a small elite.
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But for the defence of government in any form then what? Without patriotism the coheasion that bonds a free nation together would be based on what? Why defend or support what you do not have faith in?
Without patriotism the only coheasion would be administered by force. Martial Law, or a "rule by the iron fist".
or anarchy.
A person, as you or I, is smart and able to see things. But PEOPLE, as in a group (state, city, nation, school, what ever) are stupid. And the best mentality to prevent anarchy from reinging or preventing a totaliaran rule, etc is to encourage pride in ones country. Its more than just a small elite, its the health of an entire nation at stake. If nothing exists to hold things together, than nothing together can exist.
RobertN, I would have thought you'd have thought of that. |
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