H&R Block, 1 week study, 4 wks job maybe, "cross-co

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You've got to inform your clients about the possibility of bank "cross-collection." To my way of thinking, the ethics of it, there's just no other way of doing it. Even though it's relatively rare, even though it only happens to about 1 out of 100 clients, I really recommend informing each and every client.

In addition, a lot of clients won't get the loans and won't get a straight answer why not or even a straight answer about what's happening with their money. And they will storm the store. I have never seen a business with so many angry customers. Notice I am not saying, I have never worked in a place . . . I am saying I have never even seen a business with this many angry customers. The 'customer service' desk at American Airlines with the hour long wait, that was a somewhat distant second.


Why would someone ever want to work in a place like this ? ?


Because it is chaotic and exciting. Because you get skills. Because H&R Block was one of the things that convinced me, my God, I could have gone to medical school and become a doctor. That I'm good at that face-to-face, that somewhat structured interaction. I try and be both technically correct and communicative. For example,

'Presidential election fund?'

And that's how I ask it. It's a relatively minor point, I ask it briefly. The part with the "cross-collection," I've experimented with different methods. If I had to do it over again, I think I would underline this part in blue ink as I hand it to the client, not say a word, and let them ask about it.

I got good enough on the computer system to be able to, with the clients permission, look up their efile record and be able to show them that it was accepted by the IRS (first step) but the bank denied the loan. I would literally turn the computer screen so that the client could see it. This is what I do when an angry customer storms the store, and they do. I advocate for the customer. I am a good guy. However, there is very little you can do after the fact, so the key thing is to meaningfully inform the customer before the fact. (The official formal corporate voicemail message is so garbled some clients think there's a problem with the IRS.) Several days will go by smoothly, then three angry customers will come in on one day. You have got to be prepared.

The screen in the program where you ask for the driver's license and type in the number, that's your friend. A lot of new preparers are embarrassed by this. Please don't be. This is one of the things that is communicating to the client that this is a real loan application. I have considered the following.

'They will pull your credit.'

I haven't done this. But that's what I do. I try and experiment with different things.

I would also recommend showing the office manager the loan application
'I have a problem with this part.' Then don't say anything. Let the tension kind of hang there a count one thousand-one, one thousand-two

'But I would like to inform them. And I think it would save us problems in the long run.'

You're hardly going to make any money. 9 or 10 dollars an hour, so you might as well be ethical! The job will probably end first week of February. Hardly any chance of making the bonus, regardless of what they say. Some employees work off the clock to 'protect' their bonus, don't do that.

So, you've missed the prefile. But the IRS starts accepting efile returns around Jan. 15th, and that gives you some time. You could get hired now if you passed the H&R Block tax test and then you'd have three weeks to practice the computer system (as well as take their modules on bank agency and what they call "ethics" HA!)

But if you give yourself one week to learn taxes. For example, that a single person is entitle to both standard deduction and personal exemption. To get reasonable familiar with Earned Income Credit and credit for new homebuyers (have not previously owned a home within last three years, used to be that way, probably still is), then you'd still have two weeks to get familiar with their computer system. (and if you need to take the Block test twice to pass it, some district managers will let you. But please understand that none of this is guaranteed.)

You won't make a whole lot, but it will be interesting experience. And it will make a difference you being there.

This is a post I made about Block from just about a year ago referencing some of what I say about "cross-collection":
H&R Block, bank products, cross-collection, unethical wo
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt114422.html

Not a bad seasonal job, but H&R Block (as well as other "drive in" tax preparers) do a lot of unethical things.

These "quick refunds" are always loans, and the only validity I see to the comments against them is that I don't put it past many clerks to not inform people that these are loans (I'm sure there's a bonus involved for pushing these because H&R Block makes money off them). However, absent the clerk lying or misleading the customer, anyone should know that nothing's for free.

So long as you don't do anything you'd be ashamed of admitting to, it's better than nothing.

Frankly, unless you're an idiot, most tax programs from Wal-Mart will do your return right and walk you through the process one step at a time.

Don't see the point in paying someone else to do a return for me.

I just read that H&R Block lost their lending partner, so no loans this year.

I've never seen the point in offering the loans, but I guess H&R was doing well appealing to that segment. Why can't people just wait three more weeks? A whole area of bickering out the window.

Zer0netgain, I agree that most people can learn to do their own returns. They've done more than half the work gathering the documents, and with all the readily available software, it's pretty easy to do. The first year they own a home is usually a good year to pay for assistance, just to get a sample of what it all should look like, but after that if nothing complicated is going on, they can do it. Still, as some clients will say, "sure, I can change the oil in my car, too, but I don't WANT to." Which is another matter. But those aren't the people looking for refund loans, now are they?

If someone finds they like the work, they can pursue enrolled agent courses and move to a better firm than H&R Block.

There is no direct bonus for the bank products, although indirectly there is, because if the client decides not to do it and walks out the door, you don't get the (potential) bonus for the tax prep. Actually, sadly, very few employees get the bonus, and from what I see hardly any first or second year tax preparers.

My first year, the office manager was uncomfortable with me informing clients of cross-collection. Didn't say anything, but I could feel him uncomfortable. And then late in the season, he butted in as I was talking with a married couple and tried to talk them into the loan application.

Another year, for another storefront company (they're all the same), the office manager was critical of me for talking too much and made disparaging comments about the intelligence of our clients. Although ironically, he was pretty decent face-to-face with clients. People are funny this way. Maybe he was blowing off steam. (and I don't think he was just being two faced with his clients, I don't think he was fully aware of cross-collection, not at an emotional level, or not both emotionally and intellectually and/or he felt it was too rare to worry about. It is rare, but not to that point.) But he didn't need to be aggressive critical of me, yes, it was bullying behavior with him being in a position of authority.

Yet another year, back with H&R Block, I decided to take the bull by the horns and I talked with that manager at the beginning of the season. He at first argued with me saying, well, let me ask you this, the people do owe the debt. I stayed calm. I said, yes, but we've still got to try to inform people about this best we can. He reluctantly went along. I think I kind of won him over as the season went on, at one point he said in a favorable way that I was a real advocate for the underdog (to me, the 'problem' clients are among our best clients and a prime reason for doing the job in the first place). I was good with the computer system. And I think he saw that he got fewer complaints from my clients than other people's clients.

National Taxpayer Advocate’s
2007 Objectives Report to Congress
Volume II
The Role Of The IRS In The Refund
Anticipation Loan Industry
June 30, 2006
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-utl/2007_obj ... _final.pdf

from bottom of page 11, top of page 12:


" . . . It is also interesting to note that federal law prohibits banks from exercising their right to offset Social Security benefits for the recipients’ defaulted loans to that bank. It would make sense to protect EITC funds in a similar manner. At the very least, banks should be barred from transferring EITC under a cross-collection arrangement to satisfy a debt owed to a third party bank. . . "

I would be very interested in some news articles on this.

And that's kind of the other way to hang your shingle and be a reputable tax preparer. One can either be a CPA or an EA.

I'm a CPA, but if it's just tax prep work someone wants to do, and mostly with individuals, then EA is an easier road and will work just as well.