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SunWukong
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19 Sep 2014, 12:30 am

Hello, I am new here. I cannot fathom a possible reason, aside from a capricious undertaking, as to why I actually am here, though....
I am a high functioning Autistic; Asperger's Syndrome if you want a real title. I've been diagnosed for over eleven years, now.

I'm curious as to where the majority of you fall on this subject, though. Does the "typical" individual on the spectrum display a decisive propensity for misanthropy? I know three other people diagnosed with Asperger's in my life, and each one of them has a strong disposition on humanity. However, myself included, it seems each said disposition is cast with varying degrees of negative inflection.

Of all those I know (again, speaking of the aspies) mine is the most vehement of said animus, though the mere fact that all four of us view humans poorly is intriguing to me. Two, a married couple, seem to have some faith in humanity but agree that the world would be better of without the species. My father (un-diagnosed) is extremely critical of people, but quick to trust. Then there is me, the world's foremost paragon of misanthropy, who would rather sacrifice his entire existence for the power to make every last one of us suffer brutal deaths.

Do the vast majority of us feel this way, to an extent? If so, why do you figure? Is it our rearing, being so often exposed to an environment (society) we have difficulties circumnavigating; resulting in us losing faith in those around us? Is there some other explanation? Have studies been conducted on the subject?

Please forgive me if I have offended, I simply posses an insatiable curiosity and rather blunt and crude conversational skills.

Thank you in advance.



progaspie
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19 Sep 2014, 1:40 am

I don't think misanthropy is related to autism at all. I wouldn't deny some people with AS are misanthropic, but would imagine it would be in a similar ratio to those who are neurotypical.



cberg
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19 Sep 2014, 2:03 am

I wouldn't say misanthropy is neurotypical or otherwise in nature as much as I might suggest it is a biological response to the faults of the human "superorganism"; an internalized response to the risks of human living in what we call the anthopocene period, an attempt to exert influence over the course of human events via quite varied personal juxtapositions against the norms of the day.


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btbnnyr
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19 Sep 2014, 2:06 am

No, I don't relate to this misanthropy.


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mr_bigmouth_502
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19 Sep 2014, 2:29 am

I consider myself somewhat of a misanthrope, as I don't like most people, and I find the impact the human race has caused on our planet to be absolutely shameful, but at the same time I believe it's important to be a good person, and I also believe that there are more good people out there than one may think.

I'd say there could definitely be a connection between misanthropy and being an aspie, though you certainly don't have to be an aspie to not like people.



zer0netgain
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19 Sep 2014, 5:21 am

I don't think it's a part of being autistic, but I'm certain being autistic might give you reason to be a misanthrope. Look at how the world treats us....that tends to darken how we see the world at large.



BobinPgh
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19 Sep 2014, 5:47 am

Then again, how many here actually "love people" especially when there are so many of us? I go to an atomic energy board and the guy who runs it has a "love of humanity" (I almost puke typing that) and that we can nuclear our way to 20 billion people and that "people are wonderful resources with infinite potential" (oh, wait I have to run to the bathroom!) and "Bob, you are a misanthrope!" Guess what, I take that as a compliment! :P

Also, you might want to check out the VHEMT website where they advocate not having kids to save our planet. It actually makes sense.



Drehmaschine
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19 Sep 2014, 9:18 am

Being surrounded by humans for a long enough period of time and nearly everyone would grow irked by them.

Humans? Tried them once, not a fan.



SunWukong
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19 Sep 2014, 9:55 am

BobinPgh wrote:
Then again, how many here actually "love people" especially when there are so many of us? I go to an atomic energy board and the guy who runs it has a "love of humanity" (I almost puke typing that) and that we can nuclear our way to 20 billion people and that "people are wonderful resources with infinite potential" (oh, wait I have to run to the bathroom!) and "Bob, you are a misanthrope!" Guess what, I take that as a compliment! :P

Also, you might want to check out the VHEMT website where they advocate not having kids to save our planet. It actually makes sense.


You make good point; it's something I overlooked in my initial post. Back to anoter earlier poster: for myself I have only seen the tip of the iceburg in regards to the depths of human depravity. In spite of this, in spite of growing up under fairly normal circumstances (with an extremely supportive and understanding family) I still find my conception of the species wrapped in odium. So I don't think, in my case, it's possible to attribute the world's lack of understanding to my hatred. I am doubly certain of this because I am also quite apathetic and unconcerned with people's perception of me.

I am an extremely logic/law/rule oriented person, and seeing us humans act with such disregard to even the simplest of societal standards is infuriating. I don't know, I'm rambling now.



Hi_Im_B0B
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19 Sep 2014, 10:51 am

i can see where i could be a bit misanthropic, but i don't think it is a direct aspect of autism. i think it is more in reaction to the treatment i have received from humans over the course of my lifetime.



qFox
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19 Sep 2014, 11:01 am

Misanthropy is not a direct result from autism, but a symptom from a larger group of people who get rejected from and abused by society in general. People with autism are that much more likely to become socially isolated and rejected, so in a sense there is a connection.

Someone may have been conditioned to grow a sense of disdain towards human society because of years of bullying and social isolation, which is more common than you would think. Someone like this grows to hate the human society, has trouble trusting other humans and and tries to avoid strangers. It is a process of action and reaction: society around you treats you badly so you grow a negative image of society in response. This can gradually get worse and worse after more abuse and social isolation.

For me it works two ways, in a one-on-one situation I can go along fine with most other humans and even really like it if I can connect to the person. I can more easily communicate with people I like and avoid the people I do not like as I can focus on that single person. But society is different, in most circumstances you deal with giant chaotic groups of people. In situations like that I cannot set apart the good from the bad, so I get defensive, close off and try to avoid people in general. In a way I really despise the way society works: the widespread glorification of narcissism and it's many egocentric and abusive people. I feel like it would be a lot easier to appreciate society in general if narcissists were just a few rotten apples, instead they are the norm while genuinely caring people who accept your differences are diamonds in the rough.



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19 Sep 2014, 11:30 am

qFox wrote:
"Does the "typical" individual on the spectrum display a decisive propensity for misanthropy?"


In thinking this through, I found myself almost immediately faced with the question, "Are Aspies less inclined to use Cognitive Dissonance as a defense mechanism regarding some of the terrible aspects of humanity?"

If so could Aspies, similar to people in a state of depression whereby they tend to report empirical observations with a higher degree of accuracy due to less filtering? In other words, human *culture* has some significant, possibly fatal faults but NT's won't admit it to themselves...



SunWukong
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19 Sep 2014, 11:45 am

qFox wrote:
In a way I really despise the way society works: the widespread glorification of narcissism and it's many egocentric and abusive people. I feel like it would be a lot easier to appreciate society in general if narcissists were just a few rotten apples, instead they are the norm while genuinely caring people who accept your differences are diamonds in the rough.


Narcissism is a facet of nature, though. On the contrary, the so called "selflessness" of people is a fabrication of the nescient troglodytes who revel in it. Even that, in itself, is another form of narcissism; whether your do good in order to receive adulation, to feel good about yourself, or simply because that is what you were taught it all comes down to a single creature acting on its prime drive in life: survival.

I don't think it's fair to criticize selfishness when in reality, from the lowliest amoeba to the mightiest human, life could not persist without it. We kill for food, we hurt to gain, and we execute philanthropies for social and self status. This is nothing new brought on from human society.

I've lived with animals all my life and I can say for certain that there is no difference, at the base level, between any form of life. A dog is content to eat and to sleep just as is a human, though because of our "elevated" intellect our instincts take rather prolix forms. To ask people to stop being ignorant/racist/unaccepting/ECT is asking the impossible when biology itself dictates discrimination (and by that I don't mean something stupid like "people are racist because of genes," I simply mean that primal drive is something impossible to track and control.)



Edenthiel
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19 Sep 2014, 2:23 pm

SunWukong wrote:
qFox wrote:
In a way I really despise the way society works: the widespread glorification of narcissism and it's many egocentric and abusive people.


Narcissism is a facet of nature, though. On the contrary, the so called "selflessness" of people is a fabrication of the nescient troglodytes who revel in it.


Interesting dichotomy. When looking at gene sets instead of individuals, they are neither. The ones that are a better fit to their environment simply become more widespread. We live in a sugar-and-oxygen rich environment so that gene set is among the very most prevalent. Nothing narcissistic or selfless about it.

But when you speak of individual organisms, as soon as one of them acts on it's own interest to the detriment of multiple others ostensibly with similar gene sets, it endangers the 'survival' of that larger set of genes. Classic Prisoner's Dilemma; in this case those that are selfless will over time tend to proliferate.



mr_bigmouth_502
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19 Sep 2014, 3:07 pm

BobinPgh wrote:
Then again, how many here actually "love people" especially when there are so many of us? I go to an atomic energy board and the guy who runs it has a "love of humanity" (I almost puke typing that) and that we can nuclear our way to 20 billion people and that "people are wonderful resources with infinite potential" (oh, wait I have to run to the bathroom!) and "Bob, you are a misanthrope!" Guess what, I take that as a compliment! :P

Also, you might want to check out the VHEMT website where they advocate not having kids to save our planet. It actually makes sense.


I think merely having 7 billion people is too much for the Earth to handle. I live in one of the world's least densely populated countries, and I would hate to have to live somewhere with a much higher population density, like China or India.



SunWukong
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19 Sep 2014, 5:25 pm

Edenthiel wrote:
SunWukong wrote:
qFox wrote:
In a way I really despise the way society works: the widespread glorification of narcissism and it's many egocentric and abusive people.


Narcissism is a facet of nature, though. On the contrary, the so called "selflessness" of people is a fabrication of the nescient troglodytes who revel in it.


Interesting dichotomy. When looking at gene sets instead of individuals, they are neither. The ones that are a better fit to their environment simply become more widespread. We live in a sugar-and-oxygen rich environment so that gene set is among the very most prevalent. Nothing narcissistic or selfless about it.

But when you speak of individual organisms, as soon as one of them acts on it's own interest to the detriment of multiple others ostensibly with similar gene sets, it endangers the 'survival' of that larger set of genes. Classic Prisoner's Dilemma; in this case those that are selfless will over time tend to proliferate.


It's a matter of perspective, I suppose. I should have made it clear that I speak empirically, my mistake. I apologize.