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What do you think about common core standards?
They're good. 10%  10%  [ 2 ]
They're bad. 90%  90%  [ 19 ]
Total votes : 21

LonelyJar
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24 Oct 2014, 2:23 am

What do you think about common core standards, and why?



superpentil
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24 Oct 2014, 2:37 am

Common Core was grounded in a good idea, but like most things the government does, it went way off track and turned to muck. The standards are so low, the curriculum is all out of sync, and the questions and concepts that are in most of these worksheets and workbooks are entirely made up. If you had engineers trained in CC and then engineers trained in the old ways, many will not be able to understand each other without a while to know what they are talking about. All questions are worded horribly. They are incredibly open ended. As an Aspie it is already a struggle to understand what a teacher wants in current questions, but these questions are even worse. Many students will not know the difference nor even care. The government is doing something entirely different than what they should be doing. They need to focus more on getting the unions to back off when you have a low performing teacher. Most teachers, becuase of the unions, can't be fired, even if they suck. They should also treat teachers as professionals, rather than just assembly line managers. That's really what the current educational system is. A giant assembly line of students. Made with horrible quality for many reasons both in and out of school.



DRzero
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24 Oct 2014, 6:15 am

Take a look at this Common Core math problem:

"Juanita wants to give bags of stickers to her friends. She wants to give the same number of stickers to each friend. She's not sure if she needs 4 bags or 6 bags of stickers. How many stickers could she buy so there are no stickers left over?"

I've seen this described both as the worst math problem in history and as the Kobayashi Maru of math problems (if anyone doesn't recognize the reference, please post and I'll respond). It has so many flaws and ambiguities, it's hard to even begin counting them.


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BuyerBeware
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24 Oct 2014, 7:19 am

superpentil wrote:
Common Core was grounded in a good idea, but like most things the government does, it went way off track and turned to muck. The standards are so low, the curriculum is all out of sync, and the questions and concepts that are in most of these worksheets and workbooks are entirely made up. If you had engineers trained in CC and then engineers trained in the old ways, many will not be able to understand each other without a while to know what they are talking about. All questions are worded horribly. They are incredibly open ended. As an Aspie it is already a struggle to understand what a teacher wants in current questions, but these questions are even worse. Many students will not know the difference nor even care. The government is doing something entirely different than what they should be doing. They need to focus more on getting the unions to back off when you have a low performing teacher. Most teachers, becuase of the unions, can't be fired, even if they suck. They should also treat teachers as professionals, rather than just assembly line managers. That's really what the current educational system is. A giant assembly line of students. Made with horrible quality for many reasons both in and out of school.


This pretty much covers it.

The first year, I really liked CC math. They were learning concepts, doing addition with manipulatives, actually LEARNING MATH instead of memorizing rules and addition and subtraction facts. I was THRILLED.

The second year?? They're doing the same stuff they did last year, with really really really obtuse story problems. I'm not totally against story problems-- I realize that life seldom throws numbers at you in neat little columns-- but I long for the days when a kid with executive function issues like task sequencing and using multiple pieces of information at once could still enjoy, and be good at, math.

I do see the social engineering agenda in CC-- that's why it practically gutted literature instruction, because in literature instruction lies the tools to think about something like a social engineering agenda and the dystopian mess that is the likely result. I see it, and I don't like it.

Our public school system REALLY IS an "education factory." That's the reason that it doesn't work, and it isn't about to change.


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AspieUtah
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24 Oct 2014, 9:29 am

I attended a public Utah Board of Education meeting a couple years ago about the Common Core curriculum which was ordered by the governor. The meeting was hosted at my nearby local school board building. Two-thirds of the 300-person audience were paid employees of the state and local boards while 1/3 were parents from around the state. The employees wore their workplace IDs to identify each other (and prove that they should have been at their desks working like the public servants they were, but were, instead, getting paid to attend the meeting and promote the curriculum which would result in "more funding" for "classrooms."

In other words, they were paid to lobby their employers for even more money within a system that is already broke. Classy. The parents, however, tried to oppose the curriculum for what they saw as outrageous reasons ("2+2=5 if the student argues well http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local ... 63861.html that it should be so"). The education employees were livid that ordinary parents (scum) would dare involve themselves in such an important matter. Childless, I chose to sit near the back of the crowd alone, but was quickly overrun by cackling employees who openly, verbally and loudly insulted me for ... not having an employee ID and, therefore, appearing to be one of their "opponents" or parents. I have had almost 35 years on politics, lobbying and such, and I have never seen such a ravenous crowd of hostile zombies demanding more tribute. That experience, combined with the sheer logic of the matter, taught me all I need to know about the curriculum idea.

I can only imagine how students with ASDs would function under such a curriculum.


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24 Oct 2014, 11:27 pm

Look at the name "Common". As an autistic that is all you need to know.

NT's hate it also. The parents here in New York are in open rebellion
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/edu ... -1.1742510

The material from what I hear is inappropriately advanced for the ages it is assigned to. A radical changed in thought process was rushed out with little or no training of teachers and parents who don't know how to help their kids with their homework.


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24 Oct 2014, 11:58 pm

DRzero wrote:
Take a look at this Common Core math problem:

"Juanita wants to give bags of stickers to her friends. She wants to give the same number of stickers to each friend. She's not sure if she needs 4 bags or 6 bags of stickers. How many stickers could she buy so there are no stickers left over?"

I've seen this described both as the worst math problem in history and as the Kobayashi Maru of math problems (if anyone doesn't recognize the reference, please post and I'll respond). It has so many flaws and ambiguities, it's hard to even begin counting them.


It doesn't say how many stickers are in each bag, how many friends she has, or even if she's trying to minimize the number of stickers purchased, so you can make up your own answer.

Mine is that she has 4 friends, and each bag of stickers has 20 stickers in it. Buy 4 bags and give one to each friend.



DRzero
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25 Oct 2014, 7:41 am

Also, the problem begins by stating that she'll give away entire bags of stickers, then changes its mind and says that she can give each friend an arbitrary number of stickers (fractions of bags, that is).

Stargazer43 wrote:
DRzero wrote:
Take a look at this Common Core math problem:

"Juanita wants to give bags of stickers to her friends. She wants to give the same number of stickers to each friend. She's not sure if she needs 4 bags or 6 bags of stickers. How many stickers could she buy so there are no stickers left over?"

I've seen this described both as the worst math problem in history and as the Kobayashi Maru of math problems (if anyone doesn't recognize the reference, please post and I'll respond). It has so many flaws and ambiguities, it's hard to even begin counting them.


It doesn't say how many stickers are in each bag, how many friends she has, or even if she's trying to minimize the number of stickers purchased, so you can make up your own answer.

Mine is that she has 4 friends, and each bag of stickers has 20 stickers in it. Buy 4 bags and give one to each friend.


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WAautisticguy
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27 Oct 2014, 10:22 pm

They are HORRIBLE, especially math. At the end of the 2012-13 school year in Algebra I (as a freshman), I was getting a B overall...and then also got a B in Geometry before I had to move out here to eastern Washington. I think my district got on the Common Core bandwagon before my previous one, because my grade fell 10 points due to CONFUSING, HORRIBLE, IRRITATING quizzes and tests. How in the he-- can I do these problems now with these new standards?
It also makes me cringe and jealous when other classmates get 90-100% on Common Core standards math tests. Wish I had their angular gyrus part of their brains...
Now I am in Algebra II and things have gotten even worse. We are still mainly reviewing "from Algebra I" but it doesn't seem like it, due to the horrible quiz/test grades. I'm in the medium-high F range on almost every test (around 40-55%). My grade has dropped to an almost-all time low D+ at 67%. And we HFA and AS kids are supposed to learn all these standards? The problems are confusing, and the teachers are not as helpful as they should be - they go through the lesson and give zero time for HW or questions on the assignment.
I try on quizzes and tests, so hard, but it still gets me in Fs. That's with several different things; studying between classes, studying and multitasking in non-math classes, going out to the hall to do it without shuffling noises, doing my tests earlier in the day so I had time to finish it in my math period, etc. About every person I run into says to go to after-school help, which may or may not help me, because it is students (most likely 99.9% NTs) helping others.
On tests/quizzes the counselors always say "oh, take deep breaths"...like I already knew that from 5th grade. Fidgets are definitely REAL distractions to me in quizzes/tests and don't help me at all. I don't have an iPod but those aren't allowed, EVER at our school. There's new rules that say any electronic devices will be confiscated between 1st tardy bell and the final dismissal bell.
I wish America would repeal this darn Common Core. It's making every student look the same, not different.



slave
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28 Oct 2014, 2:58 am

superpentil wrote:
They need to focus more on getting the unions to back off when you have a low performing teacher. Most teachers, because of the unions, can't be fired, even if they suck. They should also treat teachers as professionals, rather than just assembly line managers. That's really what the current educational system is. A giant assembly line of students. Made with horrible quality for many reasons both in and out of school.


In other words, the teachers should have to live in a meritocracy. The open secret amongst all professionals, like Pharmacists, Physiotherapists, Engineers, etc.... is that a Bachelors in Education is the absolute bottom of the pile in terms of IQ, academic performance, rigor, professionalism, standards, and so on. Ask anyone, it soooo obvious. They are NOT professionals, they are the left overs who aren't good enough for the other faculties and a B of Ed is the default for those who just want a job. They are over valued citizen trainers. Obedient worker drones is what they are supposed to produce and they fail at even that laughable standard.



findingaplace
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29 Oct 2014, 12:21 am

Glad I saw this. My son has AS. He used to love math and reading and said they were his favorite things. Both subjects he tests above average in. Since CC started though, he now comes home crying and says he hates them. They push tests on him daily in each area. Math is absurd and was basically designed for anyone that has AS to fail because it is all abstract garbage. Too many story problems. Too many opinion based questions that are marked wrong. I looked at one of his questions that was multiple choice but totally subjective. Two of the answers were valid but of course you'd be marked wrong if you picked the one not in the answer key. Reading is not enjoyable for him anymore because of the pressure they put on him. He is a smart kid but with schools pushing him like this I'm afraid will diminish his desire to learn. It already seems like it has.



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29 Oct 2014, 4:01 am

findingaplace wrote:
Glad I saw this. My son has AS. He used to love math and reading and said they were his favorite things. Both subjects he tests above average in. Since CC started though, he now comes home crying and says he hates them. They push tests on him daily in each area. Math is absurd and was basically designed for anyone that has AS to fail because it is all abstract garbage. Too many story problems. Too many opinion based questions that are marked wrong. I looked at one of his questions that was multiple choice but totally subjective. Two of the answers were valid but of course you'd be marked wrong if you picked the one not in the answer key. Reading is not enjoyable for him anymore because of the pressure they put on him. He is a smart kid but with schools pushing him like this I'm afraid will diminish his desire to learn. It already seems like it has.


I know a kid in the same situation and his parents let him do the Math(s) stuff he once loved online @ home to keep him loving it and then try to support him through the insufferable bullsht of CC.
Unless you pull him and homeschool....whatdoyado?!?!?!



Janissy
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30 Oct 2014, 11:53 am

DRzero wrote:
Also, the problem begins by stating that she'll give away entire bags of stickers, then changes its mind and says that she can give each friend an arbitrary number of stickers (fractions of bags, that is).

Stargazer43 wrote:
DRzero wrote:
Take a look at this Common Core math problem:

"Juanita wants to give bags of stickers to her friends. She wants to give the same number of stickers to each friend. She's not sure if she needs 4 bags or 6 bags of stickers. How many stickers could she buy so there are no stickers left over?"

I've seen this described both as the worst math problem in history and as the Kobayashi Maru of math problems (if anyone doesn't recognize the reference, please post and I'll respond). It has so many flaws and ambiguities, it's hard to even begin counting them.


It doesn't say how many stickers are in each bag, how many friends she has, or even if she's trying to minimize the number of stickers purchased, so you can make up your own answer.

Mine is that she has 4 friends, and each bag of stickers has 20 stickers in it. Buy 4 bags and give one to each friend.


That is so ridiculous. There should not be ambiguity in a math problem. Given that this is a situation that is bound to happen in real life the next time Juanita hosts a birthday party with goody bags, the kids need all the relevant numbers. So many story problems don't reflect reality but oddly, this one does. Giving away stickers is pretty common these days and dividing them evenly between your friends is a must. It really does matter how many friends there are. And whether or not the bags can be opened and if so how many stickers are in each bag. :roll:

My daughter goes to a school for autistic kids so no common core, thank goodness.



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30 Oct 2014, 7:27 pm

To the OP:

You left out an option for "Mneh ... whatever ...".


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04 Nov 2014, 9:20 pm

I don't see how this will make America keep up with other countries' education systems. If anything it will increase the gap since the ones who are able to cannot just advance as easily as they used to be able to.


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WAautisticguy
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30 Nov 2014, 1:44 am

findingaplace, what grade is your son in? Even in Kindergarten, out here in my local school district, they are pushing C-C lessons and worksheets.
My Algebra II grade still continues to tank - it is 68.6% now. Last test was a 42 1/2%! Should see all of the markings of "X" or "-1/2" on my sheet - they are EVERYWHERE! That's with studying, shuffling the class around so I could be with one of the few A+ students, and help from my special-ed "Study Skills" class - where there are 17 or 18 other kids wanting help at the same time. I also think that my teacher may be part of the problem - he's a little confusing and writes so much on the board for one problem, I can't follow him completely. Two more assessments after this weekend's Thanksgiving break - barf.
I wonder without C-C, I suppose my grade in Alg 2 would be in the low-mid 80s, like it was pre-Common Core.