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MrMark
Abstract Data Type
Joined: Jul 04, 2006
Age: 49
Posts: 8164
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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 Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:33 am Post subject: MMR scare doctor: How I made link with autism (Daily Mail) |
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MMR scare doctor: How I made link with autism
The doctor behind worldwide concern over the MMR jab yesterday insisted he was right to seek answers for parents whose children had developed autism.
Dr Andrew Wakefield, 51, who linked the condition to the measles, mumps and rubella vaccine, said he was simply doing his duty "as a physician and a human being" when mothers came to him for help.
But the consultant now fighting to save his career told a disciplinary hearing he had not ordered invasive tests on children, as has been alleged.
more...
Mother told me of child’s autism after MMR jab, Andrew Wakefield claims (TimesOnline)
The doctor at the centre of the MMR vaccine controversy was told by a mother that her child showed signs of autism after receiving the vaccination — and that other parents were facing the same problem, a medical hearing heard yesterday.
Dr Andrew Wakefield. 51, said that he found the story of a link “compelling” and that it “merited attention”. It was his duty as a human being to help mothers who came to him seeking answers, he said.
Dr Wakefield faces being struck off the medical register after publishing in The Lancet in 1998 findings that suggested the triple vaccine could cause inflammatory bowel disease and autism.
more...
MMR-autism link doctor Andrew Wakefield defends conduct at GMC hearing (Telegraph)
The doctor at the centre of the controversy over the MMR vaccine has denied committing serious professional misconduct, saying it had been his "duty as a physician and a human being" to investigate potential links between the jab and autism in children.
In a passionate defence of his research Dr Andrew Wakefield told a disciplinary hearing at the General Medical Council in London that he had responded to the "plight" of mothers with sick children.
Dr Wakefield faces being struck off the medical register after he and two colleagues published findings in the respected medical journal The Lancet in 1998 suggesting a link between the triple jab for measles, mumps and rubella and inflammatory bowel disease and autism.
more...
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"He excels who has sameness of appreciation (or valuation) towards well-wishers, friends, enemies, strangers, neutrals, haters, and kinsmen, and even saints and sinners."
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lelia
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 12, 2007
Age: 55
Posts: 1025
Location: Vancouver not BC, Washington not DC
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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| I know I am in a minority here, but I respect Dr. Wakefield and I am sorry to hear he is being hounded. One can disagree with him without trying to ruin his life. |
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LeKiwi
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Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 1562
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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| lelia wrote: | | I know I am in a minority here, but I respect Dr. Wakefield and I am sorry to hear he is being hounded. One can disagree with him without trying to ruin his life. |
Amen. It's sad to see someone doing his job and investigating something like this that he probably knew could lead to him being struck off in such a way, for the good of the children involved. Not all doctors have patients best interests at heart and I wish more would have the courage to do what Dr Wakefield has done. Regardless of your opinions on his findings, surely you can agree that it's rare to see someone pursuing something that could have such dire personal consequences so that others might have a better life...
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"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain |
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beau99
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Joined: Nov 06, 2007
Age: 21
Posts: 1189
Location: A cruel H*llhole called Earth.
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LeKiwi
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Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 1562
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:46 am Post subject: |
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Why? He had a number of people coming up to him and saying "This happened to my child after this" - surely it was his job, as a good doctor, to investigate those claims and either prove or disprove them? That's the responsibility he has to his patients, and he did it, knowing he would be risking what's happening now happening. Surely that deserves respect? Many wouldn't go down that road as it would be too easy to just dismiss it outright for fear of reprisals for questioning the status quo (i.e. 'vaccines are good'). But he did, and predictably he's now watching his name get dragged through the proverbial mud for publicly claiming things not in the interests of the powers-that-be in this case.
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"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain |
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zendell
Free Thinker
Joined: Nov 11, 2007
Posts: 1174
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| Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 4:21 pm Post subject: |
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The message to doctors is - conform to the official theory or you will lose your license and be out of a job. This is happening with other conditions as well. For example, doctors in the US are being harassed and losing their licenses for treating Lyme disease (a bacterial infection) with antibiotics instead of referring their patients to psychiatrists. Doctors who treat cancer patients with alternative therapies instead of the highly profitable chemotherapy drugs are losing their licenses and risk jail time if something happens to their patients. Even parents are forced to conform. If a doctor says give your autistic child dangerous anti-psychotic drugs, you had better comply or the government will remove your children and place them in an institution. The medical establishment has lots of power and if you disobey, you will suffer.
CONFORM! OBEY! DON'T DARE QUESTION ANYTHING! |
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Mage
Toucan
Joined: Oct 11, 2006
Posts: 295
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| Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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| The problem is, he just listed a few examples of circumstantial evidence without actually doing a research study that showed causation. It was irresponsible of him to publish based on what little work he actually did on it. It caused thousands of parents across the world to stop vaccinating their kids, and exposed the masses to new outbreaks of measles where it had previously been eradicated. |
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Mage
Toucan
Joined: Oct 11, 2006
Posts: 295
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| Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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| zendell wrote: | The message to doctors is - conform to the official theory or you will lose your license and be out of a job. This is happening with other conditions as well. For example, doctors in the US are being harassed and losing their licenses for treating Lyme disease (a bacterial infection) with antibiotics instead of referring their patients to psychiatrists. Doctors who treat cancer patients with alternative therapies instead of the highly profitable chemotherapy drugs are losing their licenses and risk jail time if something happens to their patients. Even parents are forced to conform. If a doctor says give your autistic child dangerous anti-psychotic drugs, you had better comply or the government will remove your children and place them in an institution. The medical establishment has lots of power and if you disobey, you will suffer.
CONFORM! OBEY! DON'T DARE QUESTION ANYTHING! |
Zendell the only thing doctors are asked to conform to is to follow the same scientific method for their studies that everyone else does when they publish findings in a major science journal. When a doctor just has a few cases but has not done an actual study with a control group and oversight, then he shouldn't be publishing. Even little kids in 4th grade science class can learn how to properly test a hypothesis. I love the quote "The plural of anecdote is not data". |
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beau99
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 06, 2007
Age: 21
Posts: 1189
Location: A cruel H*llhole called Earth.
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| Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| LeKiwi wrote: | | Why? He had a number of people coming up to him and saying "This happened to my child after this" - surely it was his job, as a good doctor, to investigate those claims and either prove or disprove them? That's the responsibility he has to his patients, and he did it, knowing he would be risking what's happening now happening. Surely that deserves respect? Many wouldn't go down that road as it would be too easy to just dismiss it outright for fear of reprisals for questioning the status quo (i.e. 'vaccines are good'). But he did, and predictably he's now watching his name get dragged through the proverbial mud for publicly claiming things not in the interests of the powers-that-be in this case. |
He has subjected kids to invasive procedures without permission, and has killed some others.
He's about to lose his license to practice medicine, and rightly so.
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My sites: Thoughts of an Autistic (updated April 16, 2008)
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LeKiwi
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 1562
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Mage wrote: | | zendell wrote: | The message to doctors is - conform to the official theory or you will lose your license and be out of a job. This is happening with other conditions as well. For example, doctors in the US are being harassed and losing their licenses for treating Lyme disease (a bacterial infection) with antibiotics instead of referring their patients to psychiatrists. Doctors who treat cancer patients with alternative therapies instead of the highly profitable chemotherapy drugs are losing their licenses and risk jail time if something happens to their patients. Even parents are forced to conform. If a doctor says give your autistic child dangerous anti-psychotic drugs, you had better comply or the government will remove your children and place them in an institution. The medical establishment has lots of power and if you disobey, you will suffer.
CONFORM! OBEY! DON'T DARE QUESTION ANYTHING! |
Zendell the only thing doctors are asked to conform to is to follow the same scientific method for their studies that everyone else does when they publish findings in a major science journal. When a doctor just has a few cases but has not done an actual study with a control group and oversight, then he shouldn't be publishing. Even little kids in 4th grade science class can learn how to properly test a hypothesis. I love the quote "The plural of anecdote is not data". |
Unfortunately, it's true re. cancer treatments - in many countries naturopathic doctors/herbalists/other alternative or traditional medicine practitioners aren't allowed to say they can treat cancer with anything other than chemo, radiotherapy, or other mainstream drugs or they can be thrown in jail. Regardless of whether or not the treatment they're using works - most of the common ones are now confirmed as being successful treatments (more so than chemo, which actually has a shockingly low success rate), but can't make the money mainstream treatments can. Not talking about the more airy-fairy lets-dance-around-a-fire-praying-to-something sort; more like vitamin treatments, for example, and various herbs.
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"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain |
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Mage
Toucan
Joined: Oct 11, 2006
Posts: 295
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| Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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| There's absolutely no reason that these doctors that practice homeopathy can't do their own research studies to prove their findings. The real question would be, if such treatments work, then why aren't they publishing study after study in The Lancet? Why aren't they proving to the world that using control groups with no treatment, a placebo group, and their own medicine/vitamins/whatever, that their treatments make measurable results over the others? What's stopping them? |
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LeKiwi
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 1562
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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Drug companies, money, and publishers, usually. In that order more or less.
Suggest you check out the Oxford Journal of Evidence-Based Complementary and Alternative Medicine for some interesting reading. You can't really get more mainstream than that.
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"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain |
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zendell
Free Thinker
Joined: Nov 11, 2007
Posts: 1174
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| Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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Dr. Wakefield's findings have been confirmed by other researchers.
Revealed: more evidence to challenge the safety of MMR
By Lorraine Fraser at http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/06/16/nmmr16.xml
Last Updated: 9:54pm BST 15/06/2002
Scientists have found new evidence to support fears that the MMR vaccine is causing children to develop autism and bowel disease, The Telegraph can reveal today.
Specialists from Trinity College, Dublin, have detected the strain of measles virus used in the MMR jab in tissue samples from the inflamed intestines of 12 children, who each developed autism after receiving the injection.
The results will add further weight to claims that MMR may be responsible for a rapid rise in autism in children over the past decade. |
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MrMark
Abstract Data Type
Joined: Jul 04, 2006
Age: 49
Posts: 8164
Location: Tallahassee, FL
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| Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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That story's 6 years old.
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"He excels who has sameness of appreciation (or valuation) towards well-wishers, friends, enemies, strangers, neutrals, haters, and kinsmen, and even saints and sinners."
- the Bhagavad Gita |
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zendell
Free Thinker
Joined: Nov 11, 2007
Posts: 1174
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| Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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| MrMark wrote: |
That story's 6 years old. |
Yet some people still dispute Dr. Wakefield's findings. I figured they must have missed the article 6 years ago that showed his findings were confirmed. |
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