the 'Neurodiverse Society' idea. Discussing ideas and etc.

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Warsie
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09 Sep 2008, 10:37 pm

I remember I believe Donna Williams typed this? (not sure; google some of the paragraphs to make sure please ^_^ )

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Characteristics of an Autistic Utopia

To finalise this paper, I would like to theorise about what would be an ideal society for an autistic person to live in; a

society designed for autistic people. Since autistic people are a world-wide minority that is geographically diffuse, it is

not likely that such a thing will ever happen; yet, speculation about this could provide important clues that help define

strategies for advocacy and self-advocacy. Below I am proposing three main characteristics of an ideal society for autistic

people; I would be interested if others can think of more.

Listen, accept, respect. The needs of autistic people, in spite of everything they have in common, do vary widely. An

autistic person's individual needs and desires should be respected and allowed for as much as possible, with no social

pressure to conform to any group norms. Respect for the individual, not for the group, should be the basic value in society;

people should listen to each other, accept each other's needs and problems, and respect them even if they don't understand

them.

Organised around individual. One main feature that sets autistic people apart from the rest of humanity is that an autistic

person is not necessarily a "social animal" and has trouble functioning in groups of people. The individual, not the group,

would thus have to be the centre around which an autistic society is organised. In schools, every child should have an

Individual Education Plan (IEP), and workplaces should be flexible enough so that each worker can work in the way that suits

him or her best. Education and work should also be organised such that each person can work at his or her own pace, and

contribute as much as he is up to at any given moment.

No hierarchy but redundancy. A disadvantage of a society organised around the individual is that collaboration is hard

without a group to base it on. Since collaboration is essential to have a society at all, a different way to accomplish this

is needed. Organisations in NT society are traditionally organised according to a hierarchical, authoritarian model: the boss

is on top and controls his subordinates, who in turn control their subordinates, and so on, until the lowest level of

subordinates who don't control anybody. This traditional model is clearly incompatible with the concept of respect for

individual, the difficulties to function in groups, and last but not least, the intolerance of most autistic people of being

controlled. For alternatives, we should therefore look to non-hierarchical ways of organisation. The most successful and

famous instance of a non-hierarchical organisation today is the Internet (indeed a "society" in which many autistic people

thrive). The Internet is effective and unlimited in its growth precisely because of its lack of hierarchy: it is a

distributed, redundant network (note 14). Even though the Internet is an organisation of computers, not of humans, this could

well serve as a model to organise a new kind of human society compatible with the autistic way of being. Human organisations

set up in similar ways that exist today are grassroots activist groups, and the Open Source model of developing software

(with the Linux operating system as a well-known proof of its effectivity - Note 15).


One of the things I theorize this union (let's call it the Neurodiversity Union)

what do you think some of the ideas and values would be carried on?

For the autistics:
for one, I suspect there would be a greater hatred of lying, dishonesty is a strong sin there, as well as other things similar. Politicans can't get away with that as much lol.

Would there be any sort of unity or a multiparty system (based off the current factions on the internet, there being no one unified movement)

how would the economy, or military work? I'm thinking the ship crews would be lighter given technology and people not really good at those jobs.

Now what about the other groups labeled 'neurodiverse'. Please continue...


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Inventor
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10 Sep 2008, 5:04 am

My world is centered on self. After that, the usual, family, church, town, nation, does not apply.

Extenions of self to me are machines, my close companions, and information, so I am an internet junkie.

My differance seems to vanish on the internet. Mostly it is groups gathered about an idea, an edge where we join, and our differance of approach is a good thing.

The broader the subject matter the less connection.

I find that organizing around knowledge is easy. No matter how many points of view, they do have to all connect to one point.

Most human systems have disadvantage built in. Advantage would work better. The quality of education is one example, what could be more important than educating the next generation?

Some see a need for producing service workers, and use education to disadvantage. They think in the past, no one is up to the present, and none has any idea of the world in twenty years. Still, they continue the methods of the past.

Good education is seen as a ticket to the top, but I have not seen that work in practice. Inability seems equal, so the management group has the same flaws as the general population.

The best choice for all, is to educate all, and let merit rise. I may lack social skills, but most lack computer skills. Computers were beyond social control, hence a wide open field. It was by merit only, and the field advanced rapidly. Many in the field have no education, they learned by seeing and doing. A University Computer Degree from ten years ago is worthless.

The Internet works because it's information is in a standard format. Government regulates, which is to limit, except to a select few, the free flow of information. It also does not change with the times.

Government farm programs were put in place when most people earned their living from farming. They continue when only a few, less than 1%, make their living from farming, and most of those are corporations. What was set up to help farm families, helped corporations gain control of food production.

This is the past running the present, and the Internet sheds it's past.

Our educational system is set up to turn out factory workers, it is not about education, but about showing up on time, and doing what you are told. The jobs and system no longer exists, the education continues.

The Internet is future seeking in a way that nothing else is. It is education for a world yet to be.

It skips the, you have to work for someone else, pay taxes, then pay tuition to get some outdated education, and directly teaches potential future skills. Results are strictly by merit.

I do not see a concept of parties, factions, for those who can hang out do, and most of the world avoids the Internet. At least for the idea and information part.

Economics should be directed to local production. The era of cheap shipping is over, of grouped skills, most factories can now run lights out, and the cost of goods should reflect that. Local custom production makes sense, less consumed in making better local use products.

Ships can cross oceans with perhaps a few watchmen on board. Computer controlled machines are the future, and a light rail system could connect everyone, just as the Internet does.

Our use of land is very bad. Once Frank Loyde Wright proposed building three prymids in Centeral Park in New York, and tearing down the rest of the city, making it the park. There would have been more square foot of space, lots of open but climate controlled indoor green space, and a much lower heating, cooling, waste processing, and transportaion cost. The savings were huge.

We need to plan for a long term use, industrial wastes get dumped in the sewer system, metals, chemicals, ruining some good s**t. New Youk dumps it in the ocean, killing everything. It cannot be disposed of on land, because of metals and chemicals.

We are pillaging the life cycle, and dumping it in the ocean. The Mississippi causes a dead zone in the Gulf, due to Nitrates, which if pumped over the Great Plains, would reverse the spreading drought. Floods would become gold as waters were pumped, the flood providing the power and water, to arid regions, that with the addition of cubic miles of water, would change from being arid, more rain would fall, and the overall condition of the land be in an improving state.

The way out of continuing the present is planning the future, higher levels of education for all, a richer land, wisely used, with minimal costs in energy needed.

We are living in a past laid out at ports, river shipping points, then railroad towns, that has all lost it's meaning, yet continues. People voted with their feet, but built plywood boxes in California. Once you have a suburb, it is hard to change it, thousands of lot owners, a huge investment in water, sewer, power, that is very wasteful.

Young singles want one life, middle aged, raising a family, want another, and old folks want something else. Only a few get it all. We need to plan for our lives, not on making use of the obsolete past. Some cities should be leveled, dug out, and the land put to other use. New cities should be built.

We had better think up some work. China has past us as a manufacturer, and is only just starting. paying for the existing costs, like the Social Security of the war babies, the current war debt, plus the crumbling infastructure, roads, dams, bridges, and sewer and water systems in the cities, is going to take high earnings from future generations.

Another issue is we should keep the country. I am hearing 15% of the people here are not legal, 20% is one in five, we are losing control to people with no name, wanted for murder in Mexico? who give that same seeking freedom line. Yea, Right!

Twenty percent is about as large an army we could raise, this country is about to be lost to gangs.

The Government motto is, "No matter what, we get pay checks."

We are grown up now, time to disolve this Federal System, fire them all, tear down Washington DC, and become Countries, not States. It will bring a diversity of economies, and they can't all go broke at once. If our national Guard units can fight in Iraq, we can defend ourselves as smaller Countries.

The Tax Code is out of control, a flat 3% on assets would work for all. The savings on paperwork are worth more than the reduced tax. A business may owe no tax, and spend $20,000 on complying with the law anyhow.

We need a system by the people, for the people, and of the people, of the future.



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10 Sep 2008, 5:17 am

This is very self-centred, but the one thing that would make the biggest difference to me personally is if the world were... quieter. Like much quieter. If people recognised that sound can be a good thing, but that unnecessary sound isn't. No loud music in shops, cars built to be quieter, and a general understanding that shouting on the street is not okay. Oh, and people who play music on their mobile phones in public should be shot, together with people who think that playing loud music late at night is acceptable. But then it probably isn't just the spectrumites who feel that way. My life has improved dramatically since I invested in a decent pair of ear defenders, but it would be absolute bliss not to need them. So much of my anxiety, executive dysfunction, difficulty in understanding people and general discomfort would be abated if everything else could just STFU for a while.


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Warsie
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10 Sep 2008, 8:38 pm

Inventor wrote:
My world is centered on self. After that, the usual, family, church, town, nation, does not apply.


No Nationalism! Traitor :P

Quote:
Extenions of self to me are machines, my close companions, and information, so I am an internet junkie.

My differance seems to vanish on the internet. Mostly it is groups gathered about an idea, an edge where we join, and our differance of approach is a good thing.

The broader the subject matter the less connection.

I find that organizing around knowledge is easy. No matter how many points of view, they do have to all connect to one point.


that reminds me of something I saw on Tor...do you post there?

Quote:
Some see a need for producing service workers, and use education to disadvantage. They think in the past, no one is up to the present, and none has any idea of the world in twenty years. Still, they continue the methods of the past.


erm; there are several good predictions, ranging from the US needs to regain its industrial base (due to peak oil) to the US should prepare for globalization and the like.


Quote:
The Internet works because it's information is in a standard format. Government regulates, which is to limit, except to a select few, the free flow of information. It also does not change with the times.


Erm...what? Granted there is a bunch of BS laws regarding the internet but lots of it is easy to get legally...and for the other stuff..there's P2P and Tor

Quote:
Government farm programs were put in place when most people earned their living from farming. They continue when only a few, less than 1%, make their living from farming, and most of those are corporations. What was set up to help farm families, helped corporations gain control of food production.


that is correct, a LOT of them are; but there are plenty of farms in existance that are family-owned. There needs to be a balance to precent US and EU flooding Africa (And other) economies due to subsidizies but the US needs to maintain its' own production likely.

Quote:
I do not see a concept of parties, factions, for those who can hang out do, and most of the world avoids the Internet. At least for the idea and information part.


erm...there are a bunch of factions on the internet...peopel on several sites arguing, flaming, invading other peoples forums...though it seemed to slow down when the internet attacked Scientology in group (well the chans dragged the other in)

Quote:
Our use of land is very bad. Once Frank Loyde Wright proposed building three prymids in Centeral Park in New York, and tearing down the rest of the city, making it the park. There would have been more square foot of space, lots of open but climate controlled indoor green space, and a much lower heating, cooling, waste processing, and transportaion cost. The savings were huge.


lol...yes the use of land is bad; there should be some government program to encourage moving back into the central cities or at least halting suburban growth. how would FLW try thst now? I wonder if making n artifical island and building a megastructure (tall, big building..) in the nearby waters would be a good idea

Quote:
We are living in a past laid out at ports, river shipping points, then railroad towns, that has all lost it's meaning, yet continues.


Erm...they still all have a decent population..and ports would still be needed for various things.


Quote:
We are grown up now, time to disolve this Federal System, fire them all, tear down Washington DC, and become Countries, not States. It will bring a diversity of economies, and they can't all go broke at once. If our national Guard units can fight in Iraq, we can defend ourselves as smaller Countries.

The Tax Code is out of control, a flat 3% on assets would work for all. The savings on paperwork are worth more than the reduced tax. A business may owe no tax, and spend $20,000 on complying with the law anyhow.

We need a system by the people, for the people, and of the people, of the future.


lol Ron Paul :P


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10 Sep 2008, 8:42 pm

As long as people can still CHOOSE to go out and socialize if they so wish, then anythings fine with me. 8)


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