EricS
Raven
Joined: Dec 23, 2010
Posts: 100
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 Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:49 am Post subject: |
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Dear Joe90, be fair to yourself. Have the courage to tell your family members, relatives and friends who are close to you - ask them for help. Skip those who won't help, or even likes to tease you. Look for caring and understanding people. But be sure you make yourself willing to try helping yourself first. Why I say like this is because sometimes I was something like this when I was young. Like they tell me to call this man "uncle", or say "thank you" yet I was too stubborn to call him 'uncle' or say "thank you"! -
One reason here was, I need to understand why I should say it, that only if I understand why, then I will say it. - But now I understand the reason is simply this - that it's the polite way of communication that people will like us, if we say such nice and pleasant words. This is something I never thought of when I was young, until my wife taught me. She even taught me the value of a smile. People like those who smile.
When I was young, I did ask my brothers for help, but they didn't help. Reason? They didn't understand I have such a great problem and need. Neither could I figure out how to explain to them my problem because more than 40 years ago, no one knows about asperger. My brothers just tell me I have to go and mix around, that I'll get used to it. But I did try, and it was really tough. Not knowing how to do it. But, if my brothers did try helping me in a way that I can learn, I'm sure it could help. But about 10-15 years ago, my wife did notice something wrong and I was glad she did try helping. Though I didn't improve as much as I wished for, but at least there's some improvement.
As for you, Joe, you already know it's asperger. So do your family members, relatives and friends. So, ask them for guidance. Whatever they try teaching, try practicing. If they teach yet you never try, they may give up on teaching you anything later. |
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cyberdad
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 22, 2011
Age: 45
Posts: 1603
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:30 am Post subject: Re: Is there any Aspie who wish they are born normal? |
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| EricS wrote: | Is there any Aspie who wish they are born normal? -
If only I am born normal, things would surely be more happier and meaningful than I've been experiencing.
I feel being an aspie is like a punishment, not able to do what I wish to be able to do, especially making friends, able to speak like other normal people. I felt like being not acceptable to anyone at all - this really makes me feel low and useless. In fact, I'm already 52, I only knew I have asperger a year ago, so it's like I'm already in hell suffering the years of difficulty not knowing what's really happening in my life, why I was so different. |
I'm very sorry to read this. As a nuerotype I can tell you being nuerotypical is not that great. Most nueotypicals I know are very shallow people who like conform rather than think critically for themselves. The good ones out there will understand your nuerodiversity and either try to understand you or at least tolerate your difference.
Those who are intolerant have an opportunity to educate themselves if they really want to. That's what comes from living in a socially inclusive society. |
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Niall
Snowy Owl
Joined: Feb 13, 2011
Posts: 141
Location: Forth Estuary area, West-European Archipelago, Western Palearctic, Sol 3 (AKA Central Scotland!)
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 5:21 am Post subject: Re: Is there any Aspie who wish they are born normal? |
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| cyberdad wrote: |
Those who are intolerant have an opportunity to educate themselves if they really want to. That's what comes from living in a socially inclusive society. |
Is there anyone on the planet who lives in a socially inclusive society? Plenty of societies claim to be socially inclusive, but it seems to be the way of most humans to hate and refuse to tolerate anyone who is different. Since societies are made up of humans, inclusion is likely to be beyond any society.
Also, please do not overestimate human intelligence. Many people can't learn. Many others can't be bothered.
_________________
"Do not try to understand them, and do not try to make them understand you. That is because they are a breed apart, and make no sense."
( I was nicknamed Hawkeye after a field survey a few years ago. This seems even more appropriate now!) |
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Molecular_Biologist
Deinonychus
Joined: May 19, 2010
Posts: 329
Location: My own world
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 6:02 am Post subject: Re: Is there any Aspie who wish they are born normal? |
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| cyberdad wrote: | As a nuerotype I can tell you being nuerotypical is not that great. Most nueotypicals I know are very shallow people who like conform rather than think critically for themselves. The good ones out there will understand your nuerodiversity and either try to understand you or at least tolerate your difference.
Those who are intolerant have an opportunity to educate themselves if they really want to. That's what comes from living in a socially inclusive society. |
The problem is that I don't want to be "just tolerated" by sympathetic NTs.
Prejudice is at most, only half of our social problems.
If by some magic, everyone stopped acting like assholes, I would still be socially crippled.
Even in acceptance, I lack the "social giving" aspect that is essential for building successful friendships and relationships.
At most I can only expect to be "just tolerated" by the people around me and never be considered worthy of any kind of close relationship that normal people get to experience in their lives. |
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Joe90
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 24, 2010
Posts: 8229
Location: Great Britain
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:04 am Post subject: |
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| EricS wrote: | Dear Joe90, be fair to yourself. Have the courage to tell your family members, relatives and friends who are close to you - ask them for help. Skip those who won't help, or even likes to tease you. Look for caring and understanding people. But be sure you make yourself willing to try helping yourself first. Why I say like this is because sometimes I was something like this when I was young. Like they tell me to call this man "uncle", or say "thank you" yet I was too stubborn to call him 'uncle' or say "thank you"! -
One reason here was, I need to understand why I should say it, that only if I understand why, then I will say it. - But now I understand the reason is simply this - that it's the polite way of communication that people will like us, if we say such nice and pleasant words. This is something I never thought of when I was young, until my wife taught me. She even taught me the value of a smile. People like those who smile.
When I was young, I did ask my brothers for help, but they didn't help. Reason? They didn't understand I have such a great problem and need. Neither could I figure out how to explain to them my problem because more than 40 years ago, no one knows about asperger. My brothers just tell me I have to go and mix around, that I'll get used to it. But I did try, and it was really tough. Not knowing how to do it. But, if my brothers did try helping me in a way that I can learn, I'm sure it could help. But about 10-15 years ago, my wife did notice something wrong and I was glad she did try helping. Though I didn't improve as much as I wished for, but at least there's some improvement.
As for you, Joe, you already know it's asperger. So do your family members, relatives and friends. So, ask them for guidance. Whatever they try teaching, try practicing. If they teach yet you never try, they may give up on teaching you anything later. |
I do talk to my close relatives about how I feel and what I should do. All the time. But my mum and my auntie are NTs, but they aren't sociable NTs, and they do understand my difficulties with socialising because they feel the same, and so we all try to help eachother. My mum's lost all trust in outsiders because she's faced a lot of issues in her past with some friends she had, for example friends turning against her for no reason at all. And I'm not sure about my auntie, if she's completely NT because she does show a lot of Aspie traits. Apparently she wasn't mixing properly when she started school, and I was also told she used to rock backwards and forwards right up until she was 15. She's middle-aged now, but is struggling even more with coping with change and socialising. She's being bullied at work (but this bully-type person isn't being nasty to anyone else at her work, only my auntie), and she is afraid of finding a new job because she's getting anxious about her routine changing. Also she can't make friends, and the friends she did have ended up telling her how socially difficult she is, literally.
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Real gender: Female
From: East UK
Age: 23 |
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cyberdad
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 22, 2011
Age: 45
Posts: 1603
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:34 pm Post subject: Re: Is there any Aspie who wish they are born normal? |
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| Niall wrote: | | cyberdad wrote: |
Those who are intolerant have an opportunity to educate themselves if they really want to. That's what comes from living in a socially inclusive society. |
Is there anyone on the planet who lives in a socially inclusive society? Plenty of societies claim to be socially inclusive, but it seems to be the way of most humans to hate and refuse to tolerate anyone who is different. Since societies are made up of humans, inclusion is likely to be beyond any society.
Also, please do not overestimate human intelligence. Many people can't learn. Many others can't be bothered. |
LOL! You must have more faith in humanity, after all your parents are humans. In Australia we went through a period where people with development disorders (based on the terminology of the time) were integrated into the community rather than institutionalized. These state based programs have disappeared since the 1990s due to resourcing issues. My mum used to work with intellectually handicapped youth including low functioning autistic kids. Ironically we used to have the kids home on weekends and I got to know a fair number of autistic kids and enjoyed simple conversations and interactions including hiking and going to the cinema. It's fashionable to talk of nuerodiversity these days but as I got to the kids it became apparent they were more like me than I imagined. It actually annoyed me they were given labels because once we connected the differences seemed irrelevant.
I mentioned earlier the irony of having the kids over because fate would hand me an interesting hand when my daughter was diagnosed with Autism. |
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EricS
Raven
Joined: Dec 23, 2010
Posts: 100
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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Your aunt might be an aspie. Why I say this is as it is said, there seems 4x as many men than women being aspies - reason could be, some of the women are able to camouflage to being NT and not even knowing they are in aspie category. Sad to say, I know one woman just like your aunt, she always complain the secretary, accountant, boss, etc bullying her, skipping to many Co., yet each is same - bullied! But frankly, she's very pretty, so I couldn't figure out why they would bully her, but now I guess I know - it's because she can't socialize well, so somehow, she's being targeted when anything's not done right in the office.
As for getting help, look for other people among your friends or relatives who is willing to guide you. I'm sure one day you can find one who understands you and willing to help. Oh yes, did I tell you to google Neuron Learning? Very interesting, please read it.
http://neuron.typepad.com/neuron/ |
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Ikonovich
Toucan
Joined: Feb 07, 2011
Age: 22
Posts: 286
Location: Alabama/Georgia
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| Posted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 3:43 am Post subject: |
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There's a lot I would give to feel comfortable talking to people without a barrier between us, or to be able to continue those conversations for longer than 30 seconds, to be able to not shut down in a group of people, or to enjoy senseless social interaction, to stop feeling lonely no matter who I'm with, to feel a sense of belonging.
There's a whole lot I would give up... |
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tcorrielus
Phoenix
Joined: Jun 30, 2006
Age: 26
Posts: 574
Location: Buffalo, NY
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| Posted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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I always say that to myself. I don't want to be like all NTs, but I wish I had some of the essential abilities that most of my NT counterparts have since birth. Such as 1) permanently maintaining friendships (biggest challenge), 2) avoid saying or doing things that may piss others off, and 3) picking up nonverbal cues more quickly.
I can easily socially interact with people, but I think that having these 3 things just mentioned would help me become a better normal man. |
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SeizeTheDay
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 21, 2008
Age: 21
Posts: 700
Location: 'Adrift In a World of My Own'
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| Posted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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I wish I was NT. I feel I don't have a personality because I have Asperger's. It's so textbook and matches me so well, I want to have a personality of my own.
_________________
(I'm a Girl...  )
"The person who knows everything has a lot to learn."
"Dubito, ergo cogito, ergo sum" (I doubt, therefore I think, therefore I am) René Descartes
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cyberdad
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 22, 2011
Age: 45
Posts: 1603
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| Posted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:52 am Post subject: |
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| tcorrielus wrote: | I always say that to myself. I don't want to be like all NTs, but I wish I had some of the essential abilities that most of my NT counterparts have since birth. Such as 1) permanently maintaining friendships (biggest challenge), 2) avoid saying or doing things that may piss others off, and 3) picking up nonverbal cues more quickly.
I can easily socially interact with people, but I think that having these 3 things just mentioned would help me become a better normal man. |
Funny because I fail on all three of your criteria and I'm an NT. |
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EricS
Raven
Joined: Dec 23, 2010
Posts: 100
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| Posted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Ikonovich wrote: | There's a lot I would give to feel comfortable talking to people without a barrier between us, or to be able to continue those conversations for longer than 30 seconds, to be able to not shut down in a group of people, or to enjoy senseless social interaction, to stop feeling lonely no matter who I'm with, to feel a sense of belonging.
There's a whole lot I would give up... |
The friends we can find are those who are understanding. I remember one of my schoolmate, who I take as a good friend was because he's really a very understanding guy. When adult, he did his family business and he was doing very well. His business is as a wholesaler, so needs a lot of interaction with the dealers. He's so understanding, he allows me to talk while he listens, even though my grammar was out and I think I stammered to express what I want to say. I am glad to have such a wonderful friend. He seems to know I have a certain problem and he don't seem to mind it. How I wish everyone is like him. Of course to make friends with others is such a struggle.
I've stopped seeing this friend more than 20 years ago because I didn't want to disturb him when he's in business. I mean I didn't want to cause him any kind of trouble at all. Maybe later I will try to see him again. |
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Joe90
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 24, 2010
Posts: 8229
Location: Great Britain
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| Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:31 am Post subject: |
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I don't know.....I think I'll rather be me than my new friend's older brother. I made friends with the new girl at work, and we went to her parent's house last week, and I met her 22-year-old brother, who lives with his parents because of his condition. I don't know what he's got, but he's got something wrong. But it isn't Asperger's Syndrome.
He's very aware of the world, but cannot handle it. Every minute of the day when he's awake, he is just full of anger, but it ain't just a general anger management disorder. It is very chronic. He can talk well, just like you and me, and he can cook and wash and do all the usual everyday things what we all can do, but nothing satisfies him. He doesn't swear much, and he doesn't stim or get anxious - but he is always shouting angrily. He doesn't like being touched, and he doesn't make eye contact, and if something makes him feel sad he will angrily throw himself on the floor and kick his legs and scream. But he knows he's doing it - my friend says he does (she knows her brother well). But it's just part of his personality - he just has to shout and scream all the time. He wrecks things when they're not working, or if he's holding something (for example, a guitar), and you go and touch him or criticise him, he will smash the guitar up. He wouldn't hurt people, but he's always wrecking objects. And if you tell him off for wrecking something, he will just scream, ''I DON'T CARE!!!'' and go around kicking doors in. His parents wonder if he has severe ADHD, because he always had been aggressive and angry, ever since the day he started crawling. But he hasn't been diagnosed (I don't know why). His behaviour has nothing to do with upbringing, because his sister's just normal, and his parents are really nice.
The doctor did prescribe him some medication to calm him down, but his anger is so bad that the medication had only helped calm him down about 10 percent. He's still on them now. He couldn't even go to school because nobody could handle him. He had ordinary social skills (when he was calm), but he was so full of anger and aggressiveness that any children around him ran away and didn't want to be his friend. So he had to be educated on his own by a social worker (or someone like that), and she took him to the gym (because exercise is always good for aggressiveness), and she took him to do other stuff like that. He did like it, but if she touched him or made him do something for too long, he would start yelling.
He is so good-looking, but he is just too much for anybody to cope with. He's got no friends, and there's no way he could get a job, and he can't walk out in public by himself. Because he's not unconfident and socially phobic like I am, he looks confident and normal in the shops. Me and my friend took him up the shops yesterday and he was OK - until he took ages choosing sweets and my friend said, ''hurry up, mate,'' and he yelled, ''SHUT UP! GIVE ME A CHANCE!'' and carried on choosing his sweets, calmly. I had a great conversation with him, but I was a bit wary of his unpredictable behaviour. But my friend says he only really screams at people he's used to.
I think I'd rather be me than someone like him. Any day. The only lucky thing about him is he does not have sensory issues with noise, whereas I do, and I hate it.
_________________
Real gender: Female
From: East UK
Age: 23 |
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EricS
Raven
Joined: Dec 23, 2010
Posts: 100
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| Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Joe90 wrote: | I don't know.....I think I'll rather be me than my new friend's older brother. I made friends with the new girl at work, and we went to her parent's house last week, and I met her 22-year-old brother, who lives with his parents because of his condition. I don't know what he's got, but he's got something wrong. But it isn't Asperger's Syndrome.
He's very aware of the world, but cannot handle it. Every minute of the day when he's awake, he is just full of anger, but it ain't just a general anger management disorder. It is very chronic. He can talk well, just like you and me, and he can cook and wash and do all the usual everyday things what we all can do, but nothing satisfies him. He doesn't swear much, and he doesn't stim or get anxious - but he is always shouting angrily. He doesn't like being touched, and he doesn't make eye contact, and if something makes him feel sad he will angrily throw himself on the floor and kick his legs and scream. But he knows he's doing it - my friend says he does (she knows her brother well). But it's just part of his personality - he just has to shout and scream all the time. He wrecks things when they're not working, or if he's holding something (for example, a guitar), and you go and touch him or criticise him, he will smash the guitar up. He wouldn't hurt people, but he's always wrecking objects. And if you tell him off for wrecking something, he will just scream, ''I DON'T CARE!!!'' and go around kicking doors in. His parents wonder if he has severe ADHD, because he always had been aggressive and angry, ever since the day he started crawling. But he hasn't been diagnosed (I don't know why). His behaviour has nothing to do with upbringing, because his sister's just normal, and his parents are really nice.
The doctor did prescribe him some medication to calm him down, but his anger is so bad that the medication had only helped calm him down about 10 percent. He's still on them now. He couldn't even go to school because nobody could handle him. He had ordinary social skills (when he was calm), but he was so full of anger and aggressiveness that any children around him ran away and didn't want to be his friend. So he had to be educated on his own by a social worker (or someone like that), and she took him to the gym (because exercise is always good for aggressiveness), and she took him to do other stuff like that. He did like it, but if she touched him or made him do something for too long, he would start yelling.
He is so good-looking, but he is just too much for anybody to cope with. He's got no friends, and there's no way he could get a job, and he can't walk out in public by himself. Because he's not unconfident and socially phobic like I am, he looks confident and normal in the shops. Me and my friend took him up the shops yesterday and he was OK - until he took ages choosing sweets and my friend said, ''hurry up, mate,'' and he yelled, ''SHUT UP! GIVE ME A CHANCE!'' and carried on choosing his sweets, calmly. I had a great conversation with him, but I was a bit wary of his unpredictable behaviour. But my friend says he only really screams at people he's used to.
I think I'd rather be me than someone like him. Any day. The only lucky thing about him is he does not have sensory issues with noise, whereas I do, and I hate it. |
This guy sure describes me a bit. But not so serious. When my brother lectures me repeatedly, I would get so boiled up, I'd bang the table or wall and walk off. Maybe due to my Christian upbringing, I do not like to show my temper when I'm not boiled over. I have problem looking at people like I'm supposed to, though I do look at some people sometimes, but I do not have problem with being touched or noise. In fact, I like being tickled, like I read there's one Queen with asperger who also like being tickled! My wife felt it's so funny that I like this.
Actually, I have a brother who may be like this guy. He's not able to study at all, kicked out of school when he was just 8 years old. Mother said his problem was due to high fever at age 2, but I think it's more than just the fever. He gets angry too easily, sometimes for no reason. He sometimes tries to yell at everything because he feels everyone's against him. He's usually lazy, do only when told to do, never bother to learn the skill necessary to do cooking, though he can do some cooking. I believe he can learn, but he's too lazy to learn. His mentality brought him such a broken personality. It's sad. |
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Joe90
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 24, 2010
Posts: 8229
Location: Great Britain
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| Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2011 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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I get really angry when people lecture me, especially over certain things (due to black and white thinking), and my blood boils and I feel an angry outburst coming. I'm probably worse than my friend's brother when I have outbursts. I'm a very angry person; I'm angry with myself, angry with the fact that I have AS and everybody else in my family is NT, and angry with the government for cutting back everything this country needs (eg health services, bus services, home repairment services, ect). But I'm not angry every minute, like this lad is. His anger is his own normal behaviour, and he is just never satisfied with anything or anyone.
When I'm on holiday, I'm really happy. I never get angry. I'm too busy enjoying the different environment, the hot weather, the warm sea, the carefree days of sun-bathing, all the outdoor activities there is to do, and there is always an exciting feeling in the air when you're on holiday. But my friend said that her brother even gets angry when he's on holiday. He's OK when he's just sitting there, but say for example a bit of his ice-creams drips on to the ground, he would yell, ''GOD! It's dripping EVERYWHERE! What a crappy ice-cream! Why do they make them so crap?!!!!'' And he'll shout it in an angry but slurry sort of way - even if he's out in public. If that was me with an ice-cream what dripped a bit on the ground, I would either not notice, or if I got annoyed I would just tut and say, ''it's dripping everywhere now.'' I wouldn't start angrily blaming everyone else.
_________________
Real gender: Female
From: East UK
Age: 23 |
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