Clearly can't be too antisemitic of a movement. The Nazi Party support and the antisemitic protesters would be explained by the dumb stereotype that Jews control the banking system.
Violence
There's been significantly more violence towards the protesters than by them. See Occupy Oakland, and Scott Olsen in particular.
Media being towards the left
News Corp is far right and they're the second biggest media conglomerate in the world.
Rape occurring
There's been two rapes at Occupy protests. One of them was in Cleveland, a city with a horrible rape rate as it is. Steps need to be taken to make sure no more occurs, but I don't see how this is endemic of the movement in general.
Conspiracy to get Obama reelected
I don't think he really needs one of those. At any rate, slightly over half of the Occupy Wall Street protesters aren't going to vote for Obama in 2012 or are undecided, according to this poll:
Not quite, and I could go on(it was very unfair to blame them for the Giffords shooting, though).
I don't get the idea that this is about people "blaming others" for their problems either. There's been a lot of problems caused by our incompetent government and incompetent business leaders. Getting a job isn't too easy when there's a 10% unemployment rate and positions aren't opening to fill them. Plus that's only one of many complaints.
Clearly can't be too antisemitic of a movement. The Nazi Party support and the antisemitic protesters would be explained by the dumb stereotype that Jews control the banking system.
The Jewish people were duped by Adolf Hitler too, so just cause some liberal group happens to have Jewish people in it, doesn't mean that they can't be duped just like any other human being. Furthermore, different Jewish groups have different opinions on the subject, furthermore there was a recent election in New York that kinda destroys your argument that the Jewish people are all siding with Occupy Wallstreet.
Anthony Weiner's seat ended up in the hands of a Republican, for the first time in about 80 years, and a large portion of the voters in that district are Jewish.
Dennis wrote:
Violence
There's been significantly more violence towards the protesters than by them. See Occupy Oakland, and Scott Olsen in particular.
Oh really, I heard that the Occupy Oakland protesters were throwing rocks at police officers whom retaliated with tear gas.
Dennis wrote:
Media being towards the left
News Corp is far right and they're the second biggest media conglomerate in the world.
Actually, News Corp's (in particular, Fox News) success actually proves the rest of the media has a far left bias. There wouldn't be a demand for a right leaning news organization, if the public didn't believe that the rest of the media outlets have gone to the far left.
Dennis wrote:
Rape occurring
There's been two rapes at Occupy protests. One of them was in Cleveland, a city with a horrible rape rate as it is. Steps need to be taken to make sure no more occurs, but I don't see how this is endemic of the movement in general.
Fair enough.
Dennis wrote:
Conspiracy to get Obama reelected
I don't think he really needs one of those. At any rate, slightly over half of the Occupy Wall Street protesters aren't going to vote for Obama in 2012 or are undecided, according to this poll:
Could be in reality something like this:
The Denver Post reported in its Wednesday editions that Schwenkler had Democratic ties. He received $500 in November 2008 to walk door-to-door in support of Democrat Mollie Cullom, who lost her race to Republican state Rep. David Balmer of Centennial, according to The Post.
Schwenkler is not listed in the Democratic party’s database of registered voters.
Balmer said he suspects the vandalism might have been intended to make the Republican Party look bad.
"This sounds like the type of Democratic tactic from the left fringe trying to make Republicans look mean-spirited," Balmer said. "In this case, it blew up in their face."
Campaign records show Schwenkler was among dozens of canvassers paid by a political committee called the Colorado Citizens' Coalition. He was also arrested on a charge of unlawful assembly while protesting outside the 2008 Republican National Convention in St. Paul.
"This kind of hooliganism has no place in American politics. I condemn it," said Republican John Andrews, former Colorado Senate President and head of the conservative think tank, the Centennial Institute. "Beyond that, it's just idle speculation as to what might have motivated whatever slug did this. The most obvious health-related link might be alcohol impaired judgment."
Across the country, members of Congress conducting town hall meetings on health care reform have been met by protesters, some who have disrupted meetings with angry outbursts. In Arizona and New Hampshire, protesters have shown up outside President Barack Obama's appearances carrying guns, while Ohio Rep. Steve Driehaus was met by protesters in Cincinnati who were shouting his home address. He said that was a veiled threat.
The AZ shooter was just plain nuts, and the attempt to pin it on the Tea Party, Rush Limbaugh, Sarah Palin, and Republicans royally backfired the last time, if you care for a repeat of that backfire then please go right ahead.
Not quite, and I could go on(it was very unfair to blame them for the Giffords shooting, though).
Especially since the guy that committed that shooting was just plain nuts and was plotting to kill her long before the Tea Party even existed.
Dennis wrote:
I don't get the idea that this is about people "blaming others" for their problems either. There's been a lot of problems caused by our incompetent government and incompetent business leaders. Getting a job isn't too easy when there's a 10% unemployment rate and positions aren't opening to fill them. Plus that's only one of many complaints.
The real unemployment rate is probably well over 20% possibly as large as 1/3 of the country, they don't count people that have dropped off the rolls.
Joined: Nov 03, 2005 Age: 26 Posts: 332 Location: Ohio
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:51 pm Post subject:
Poor argument on the Jews. I never said all Jews supported the movement, I just showed that there was Jewish support of the movement to repute claims of the movement being antisemitic. I'm also not sure Hitler "fooled" the Jews, he wrote Mein Kampf well before he came to power and he displayed his antisemitism clearly there.
I'm also still pretty sure the Oakland PD attacked first. They sure didn't seem to mind lying about how they used force, anyway. Plus Oakland has possibly the worst police department in the country.
You also missed the point of the second article I posted, which was that Republican officials in Arizona resigned after the Giffords shooting because they felt threatened by other Republicans.
Poor argument on the Jews. I never said all Jews supported the movement, I just showed that there was Jewish support of the movement to repute claims of the movement being antisemitic. I'm also not sure Hitler "fooled" the Jews, he wrote Mein Kampf well before he came to power and he displayed his antisemitism clearly there.
You should really study your history.
Dennis wrote:
I'm also still pretty sure the Oakland PD attacked first. They sure didn't seem to mind lying about how they used force, anyway. Plus Oakland has possibly the worst police department in the country.
Maybe, maybe not.
Dennis wrote:
You also missed the point of the second article I posted, which was that Republican officials in Arizona resigned after the Giffords shooting because they felt threatened by other Republicans.
Riiiightttt....
More like they were afraid of being associated with the people being demonized by a left wing partisan hacks of a media that were engaging in blood libel.
Joined: Nov 03, 2005 Age: 26 Posts: 332 Location: Ohio
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 1:09 pm Post subject:
So you think the Republicans lied about why they were resigning and it was really because of the media? ...You shouldn't complain about political bias.
So you think the Republicans lied about why they were resigning and it was really because of the media? ...You shouldn't complain about political bias.
I don't know what was going through their heads, but it was a likely possibility considering what was going on at the time and how the left-wing drive media and the irresponsible sherriff (whom may have been recalled now) tried to paint the shooter as being a tea party member, when the shooter was in fact not even remotely associated with the tea party.
Let's consider something. Let's zoom out. Let's look at the bigger picture, for just a little while, just to consider.
Virtually everything was once revolutionary. Everything was once radical, weird, outrageous, impossible, stupid, ridiculous. Democracy in the ancient world failed... It was looked upon as a flawed concept for many hundreds of years. Absolute monarchies soon became limited monarchies. Democracies emerged, tyrants became overthrown. Communism rises and falls. Economies are controlled by governments. Economies are left to their own devices. Economies are manipulated some. Freedoms and rights are enforced in full. Freedoms and rights are ignored. Freedom and rights are selectively enforced. Transparent government. Lying government. Censorship. Freedom of the press. This and that, this and that.
I do believe it's time to think about how things should be, for once, instead of merely considering, and going along with the popular thought-mould: this is this way, and this isn't this way. WHY what "is"- WHY NOT what "should be."
Why have past systems of working things failed? Why has communism failed? Monarchies? Dictatorships? X economic system, Y type of government. This policy, that policy. Why have these various past things failed? Now, why has OUR SYSTEM failed?
You don't think our system has failed? The failure is the homeless, the wars over questionable motives, the lies, the secrets, the corruption, the wrongs- what "is" that "shouldn't be." Why should we settle for anything less than what "should be." Do not fall into an attitude of complacency. We tend to settle for the lesser evil... X foreign country has got it worse- that's how we tend to think. X is bad, Y is worse. Many people, or many people in my country, at least, tend to turn that into... X is good, Y is bad.
We are human. We are capable of unbelievable things. We can get what we want to get done, done. It's not "human nature" for us to be "like this." We are capable of so much more. It's not "human nature," the incredible error, not "genetics." We really, really, can.
I know- in practice, things are different. What "should be" cannot always be easily applied to what "is." That is why we need to find a new way, and not only that, but this new way must make things right, or how they "should be," but also work "in practice." I don't know, but maybe this is an example... Communism can sound great on paper. Everyone is equal; doesn't even the Universal Declaration of Human Rights say this? All human beings are born free and equal (in dignity and rights)? How does, or did, it fail in practice, though? I hope I got my idea across... I tend to be long-winded at times, and sometimes my long-windedness does nothing to even help explain my idea(s). A summary: I feel, due to various failures of past and present systems, that a new way of working things in the world is needed. A completely new, innovative, better way. A fresh, new start. Somehow...
I went to the Oakland General Strike yesterday; it was absolutely amazing to march united with 10,000+ other people, and to see Angela Davis speak. Did anyone else from WP go?
Joined: Mar 23, 2009 Posts: 4456 Location: The shooting range
Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 1:09 am Post subject:
What the hell is up with invading the shipyard? They are hurting blue collar workers most there. Where are the Pinkertons when you actually need them? _________________ "Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
- Unknown
"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."
-Sigmund Freud
I went to the Oakland General Strike yesterday; it was absolutely amazing to march united with 10,000+ other people, and to see Angela Davis speak. Did anyone else from WP go?
Joined: Aug 13, 2009 Posts: 3341 Location: In Georgia sipping a virgin pina' colada while the rest of the world is drunk
Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 3:16 am Post subject:
1frank1 wrote:
Let's consider something. Let's zoom out. Let's look at the bigger picture, for just a little while, just to consider.
Virtually everything was once revolutionary. Everything was once radical, weird, outrageous, impossible, stupid, ridiculous. Democracy in the ancient world failed... It was looked upon as a flawed concept for many hundreds of years. Absolute monarchies soon became limited monarchies. Democracies emerged, tyrants became overthrown. Communism rises and falls. Economies are controlled by governments. Economies are left to their own devices. Economies are manipulated some. Freedoms and rights are enforced in full. Freedoms and rights are ignored. Freedom and rights are selectively enforced. Transparent government. Lying government. Censorship. Freedom of the press. This and that, this and that.
I do believe it's time to think about how things should be, for once, instead of merely considering, and going along with the popular thought-mould: this is this way, and this isn't this way. WHY what "is"- WHY NOT what "should be."
Why have past systems of working things failed? Why has communism failed? Monarchies? Dictatorships? X economic system, Y type of government. This policy, that policy. Why have these various past things failed? Now, why has OUR SYSTEM failed?
You don't think our system has failed? The failure is the homeless, the wars over questionable motives, the lies, the secrets, the corruption, the wrongs- what "is" that "shouldn't be." Why should we settle for anything less than what "should be." Do not fall into an attitude of complacency. We tend to settle for the lesser evil... X foreign country has got it worse- that's how we tend to think. X is bad, Y is worse. Many people, or many people in my country, at least, tend to turn that into... X is good, Y is bad.
We are human. We are capable of unbelievable things. We can get what we want to get done, done. It's not "human nature" for us to be "like this." We are capable of so much more. It's not "human nature," the incredible error, not "genetics." We really, really, can.
I know- in practice, things are different. What "should be" cannot always be easily applied to what "is." That is why we need to find a new way, and not only that, but this new way must make things right, or how they "should be," but also work "in practice." I don't know, but maybe this is an example... Communism can sound great on paper. Everyone is equal; doesn't even the Universal Declaration of Human Rights say this? All human beings are born free and equal (in dignity and rights)? How does, or did, it fail in practice, though? I hope I got my idea across... I tend to be long-winded at times, and sometimes my long-windedness does nothing to even help explain my idea(s). A summary: I feel, due to various failures of past and present systems, that a new way of working things in the world is needed. A completely new, innovative, better way. A fresh, new start. Somehow...
Wow....that is one of the most intelegent things I heard in this whole discussion.
However I have read that we are no longer a world of seperated countries, but there is a global economic governance which is why sh*t that goes on in greece effects the world economy.
I do agree we need to rethink how we do things instead of just reacting.
I think we need to scrap the global economy and try to keep each country seperate, so when one falls, the rest of the world doesnt go with it.
As things are now, europe is going belly up, the US is teetering on the brink of a depression and China is left supporting the economic world. However, China's economy is in a bubble, when it busts....it is not going to be pretty.
China holds alot of the bonds for the US as well as europe....when China can no longer lend.
I predict a new dark age. We will come out of it, like always, only the strong will survive and humanity will reinvent itself, we will learn from our mistakes and try again.
Inventor taught me that only through exeptional struggles does real change happen. Humans for the most part are stubborn, short sighted, and reactionary. You have a unique gift to see the big picture. _________________ All art is a kind of confession, more or less oblique. All artists, if they are to survive, are forced, at last, to tell the whole story; to vomit the anguish up.
-James Baldwin
Let's consider something. Let's zoom out. Let's look at the bigger picture, for just a little while, just to consider.
Virtually everything was once revolutionary. Everything was once radical, weird, outrageous, impossible, stupid, ridiculous. Democracy in the ancient world failed... It was looked upon as a flawed concept for many hundreds of years. Absolute monarchies soon became limited monarchies. Democracies emerged, tyrants became overthrown. Communism rises and falls. Economies are controlled by governments. Economies are left to their own devices. Economies are manipulated some. Freedoms and rights are enforced in full. Freedoms and rights are ignored. Freedom and rights are selectively enforced. Transparent government. Lying government. Censorship. Freedom of the press. This and that, this and that.
I do believe it's time to think about how things should be, for once, instead of merely considering, and going along with the popular thought-mould: this is this way, and this isn't this way. WHY what "is"- WHY NOT what "should be."
Why have past systems of working things failed? Why has communism failed? Monarchies? Dictatorships? X economic system, Y type of government. This policy, that policy. Why have these various past things failed? Now, why has OUR SYSTEM failed?
You don't think our system has failed? The failure is the homeless, the wars over questionable motives, the lies, the secrets, the corruption, the wrongs- what "is" that "shouldn't be." Why should we settle for anything less than what "should be." Do not fall into an attitude of complacency. We tend to settle for the lesser evil... X foreign country has got it worse- that's how we tend to think. X is bad, Y is worse. Many people, or many people in my country, at least, tend to turn that into... X is good, Y is bad.
We are human. We are capable of unbelievable things. We can get what we want to get done, done. It's not "human nature" for us to be "like this." We are capable of so much more. It's not "human nature," the incredible error, not "genetics." We really, really, can.
I know- in practice, things are different. What "should be" cannot always be easily applied to what "is." That is why we need to find a new way, and not only that, but this new way must make things right, or how they "should be," but also work "in practice." I don't know, but maybe this is an example... Communism can sound great on paper. Everyone is equal; doesn't even the Universal Declaration of Human Rights say this? All human beings are born free and equal (in dignity and rights)? How does, or did, it fail in practice, though? I hope I got my idea across... I tend to be long-winded at times, and sometimes my long-windedness does nothing to even help explain my idea(s). A summary: I feel, due to various failures of past and present systems, that a new way of working things in the world is needed. A completely new, innovative, better way. A fresh, new start. Somehow...
Wow....that is one of the most intelegent things I heard in this whole discussion.
However I have read that we are no longer a world of seperated countries, but there is a global economic governance which is why sh*t that goes on in greece effects the world economy.
I do agree we need to rethink how we do things instead of just reacting.
I think we need to scrap the global economy and try to keep each country seperate, so when one falls, the rest of the world doesnt go with it.
As things are now, europe is going belly up, the US is teetering on the brink of a depression and China is left supporting the economic world. However, China's economy is in a bubble, when it busts....it is not going to be pretty.
China holds alot of the bonds for the US as well as europe....when China can no longer lend.
I predict a new dark age. We will come out of it, like always, only the strong will survive and humanity will reinvent itself, we will learn from our mistakes and try again.
Inventor taught me that only through exeptional struggles does real change happen. Humans for the most part are stubborn, short sighted, and reactionary. You have a unique gift to see the big picture.
Thanks for your input. I think I get the gist of your thinking, and appreciate that there are those here that share similar views to mine. I like this: "I think we need to scrap the global economy." However, I'm not so keen on economically separating countries. At least, I'm not sure about that. To recap and paraphrase, I think that first it's important to realise that our present way of working things is hopelessly broken and we need something truly "revolutionary."
Now, what the solution to this broken system will be is impossible for me to say. The possibilities are literally limitless, infinite. Also note that it's not just economics I'm talking about. I'm talking about a whole new way of running things. You know, maybe we will one day have created a system in which countries in the modern sense are unnecessary and people are people, anywhere and everywhere, equally, without any such present-day boundaries and limits, selfishness, lack of altruism for humanity as a single entity. Lastly, what is in my opinion the strange phenomenon of patriotism and nationalism may one day be modified or seen to be useless, entirely.
It is important to remember that with the downfall of the present system(s), future potential is boundless.
But, of course, what is to come must truly be workable.
Joined: Jun 19, 2008 Posts: 7998 Location: Babylon
Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2011 7:27 pm Post subject:
University of California Davis students sprayed with commercial grade pepper spray just for protesting tuition hikes. Rights are being eroded more and more everyday.
_________________ JUST LET THE GUY BE FROM K PAX!!!!!!
Joined: Jan 07, 2011 Age: 23 Posts: 14808 Location: Somewhere in Colorado
Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:49 pm Post subject:
Inuyasha wrote:
Dennis wrote:
Conspiracy to get Obama reelected
I don't think he really needs one of those. At any rate, slightly over half of the Occupy Wall Street protesters aren't going to vote for Obama in 2012 or are undecided, according to this poll:
What they say and what they do are two different things, likely they are going to re-elect Obama simply cause he isn't an "evil Republican."
Really now? the democrats and republicans are one and the same, both parties have been bought by corporate america. _________________ It's like alice in wonderland except, my names not alice and this is the real world not a dream.
