MjrMajorMajor
Phoenix
Joined: Jan 16, 2012
Age: 37
Posts: 3086
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 Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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| TM wrote: | | Kjas wrote: |
I do think that people who choose to engage in it, knowing the risks, should take responsibility for themselves and their choice down the road financially rather than depending on the state to pay their medical costs. |
By that logic, should we on the same note require the same from people who have high risk hobbies, drink more, eat bacon for breakfast and watch more than 4 hours of TV every day? |
The soda/junk food tax seems to keep popping up as another way to bleed the citizens dry. While the information on health risks should be readily available on anything we consume, I don't think we need a nanny government. We obviously don't have one now, because the money that the states recouped from the tobacco lawsuits isn't all being funneled into stop smoking programs. For all the PR about health concerns, shouldn't the government not be cutting funding to these programs? |
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Kjas wrote: | | Some things have risks, yeah sure. But there's a world of difference between watching tv for 4 hours a day and choosing to smoke a packet of cigarettes a day. |
You do realize for a lot of people it becomes more than a choice to smoke that much right? I think nicotine is one of the more addictive substances. Also what about people who started smoking when they were kids and not very aware of the risks? should they be left to die if they end up with lung cancer unless they can afford all the treatment them self? I think not.
But another thing is not everyone who smokes gets cancer......its just a factor in some peoples cancer, so for them to create a policy in which people who develop smoking related health problems would be barred from receiving any assistance with the financial aspect they would have to prove without a doubt that smoking 'causes' cancer not that it 'increases the chances of cancer'.
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Vigilans
Orgasm Donor
Joined: Jun 20, 2008
Age: 24
Posts: 12092
Location: La belle province
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| TM wrote: | | Kjas wrote: |
I do think that people who choose to engage in it, knowing the risks, should take responsibility for themselves and their choice down the road financially rather than depending on the state to pay their medical costs. |
By that logic, should we on the same note require the same from people who have high risk hobbies, drink more, eat bacon for breakfast and watch more than 4 hours of TV every day? |
I don't know about high risk hobbies, but drinking more or abusing any substance yes. Non-genetic morbid obesity I am also not really very happy to pay for.
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Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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| MjrMajorMajor wrote: | | TM wrote: | | Kjas wrote: |
I do think that people who choose to engage in it, knowing the risks, should take responsibility for themselves and their choice down the road financially rather than depending on the state to pay their medical costs. |
By that logic, should we on the same note require the same from people who have high risk hobbies, drink more, eat bacon for breakfast and watch more than 4 hours of TV every day? |
The soda/junk food tax seems to keep popping up as another way to bleed the citizens dry. While the information on health risks should be readily available on anything we consume, I don't think we need a nanny government. We obviously don't have one now, because the money that the states recouped from the tobacco lawsuits isn't all being funneled into stop smoking programs. For all the PR about health concerns, shouldn't the government not be cutting funding to these programs? |
I know soda and junk food is unhealthy, but its cheap.....if the government is so concerned with people eating healthy why don't they subsidize companies that produce healthy and/or organic food? I mean as it stands the government and big food corporations seem to like buying up all the small farms to create massive food factories where animals are crammed together and treated like crap and fed crap until they're slaughtered for food.....that can be sold cheaply. Things like that certainly don't help with peoples ability to eat healthy.
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Vigilans wrote: | | TM wrote: | | Kjas wrote: |
I do think that people who choose to engage in it, knowing the risks, should take responsibility for themselves and their choice down the road financially rather than depending on the state to pay their medical costs. |
By that logic, should we on the same note require the same from people who have high risk hobbies, drink more, eat bacon for breakfast and watch more than 4 hours of TV every day? |
I don't know about high risk hobbies, but drinking more or abusing any substance yes. Non-genetic morbid obesity I am also not really very happy to pay for. |
well damn  , I'm glad your not in office...if your policy would be 'anyone who develops substance related health problems, shall be hence forth banished from receiving any financial help should they be unable to afford their medical costs'
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Robdemanc
Phoenix
Joined: May 31, 2010
Posts: 2293
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| I don't think it should be banned but I think it should be limited in its promotion (not allowed to promote sports events etc). The manufacturers should also be obliged to hand over money to cancer research and other health projects. |
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Kjas
Onçinha
Joined: Feb 27, 2012
Age: 23
Posts: 4897
Location: the place I'm from doesn't exist anymore
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Sweetleaf wrote: | | I know soda and junk food is unhealthy, but its cheap.....if the government is so concerned with people eating healthy why don't they subsidize companies that produce healthy and/or organic food? I mean as it stands the government and big food corporations seem to like buying up all the small farms to create massive food factories where animals are crammed together and treated like crap and fed crap until they're slaughtered for food.....that can be sold cheaply. Things like that certainly don't help with peoples ability to eat healthy. |
Ideas like this, Sweetleaf, are the kind of thing that I would more than happily lend support to.
As per your other post, if you read my first post, in it I made an allowance for those who did not know the risks. It may be addictive but there are now other options, programs and products to allow people to quit if they wish to. Deciding to do nothing is actually a choice, as is deciding not to make a choice.
Agreed that it is a factor, sometimes the main one, sometimes one among many others. I am asking that people simply take it into account.
| Vigilans wrote: | | I don't know about high risk hobbies, but drinking more or abusing any substance yes. Non-genetic morbid obesity I am also not really very happy to pay for. |
Finally, someone who isn't taking it out of context.
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Last edited by Kjas on Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:54 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Kjas wrote: | | Sweetleaf wrote: | | I know soda and junk food is unhealthy, but its cheap.....if the government is so concerned with people eating healthy why don't they subsidize companies that produce healthy and/or organic food? I mean as it stands the government and big food corporations seem to like buying up all the small farms to create massive food factories where animals are crammed together and treated like crap and fed crap until they're slaughtered for food.....that can be sold cheaply. Things like that certainly don't help with peoples ability to eat healthy. |
Ideas like this, Sweetleaf, are the kind of thing that I would more than happily lend support to.
As per your other post, if you read my first post, in it I made an allowance for those who did not know the risks. It may be addictive but there are now other options, programs and products to allow people to quit if they wish to. Deciding to do nothing is actually a choice, as is deciding not to make a choice.
Agreed that it is a factor, sometimes the main one, sometimes one amount many others. I am asking that people simply take it into account. |
I don't know that you understand much about addiction in general..the thing is it really is not as simple as wishing to quit and being able to, some quitting options don't work and some medications for it have nasty side effects. Its a pretty complex thing, not so much something one can just quit.
I mean its when you realise your smoking for some other reason then simply wanting to, that's usually when your at a point where it can be quite difficult to quit. Then you can quit, and start again under stress, or try to quit and get frustrated and give up on it for a bit. Also if smokers were barred from getting any financial aid for healthcare, how the hell are they supposed to afford treatments to help them quit on top of that? I mean I have to look at this from the perspective of how it would effect people in my financial position....and it just would not lead to good things.
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Vigilans
Orgasm Donor
Joined: Jun 20, 2008
Age: 24
Posts: 12092
Location: La belle province
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Kjas wrote: | | Vigilans wrote: | | I don't know about high risk hobbies, but drinking more or abusing any substance yes. Non-genetic morbid obesity I am also not really very happy to pay for. |
Finally, someone who isn't taking it out of context. |
Unfortunately, as evidenced already by Sweetleaf's reply, some people will not recognize that
_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do |
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Vigilans wrote: | | Kjas wrote: | | Vigilans wrote: | | I don't know about high risk hobbies, but drinking more or abusing any substance yes. Non-genetic morbid obesity I am also not really very happy to pay for. |
Finally, someone who isn't taking it out of context. |
Unfortunately, as evidenced already by Sweetleaf's reply, some people will not recognize that |
.....for some reason I am getting that same feeling I get when I end up being the idiot in the room that does not get the joke. Typically I respond better to people maybe explaining what they mean if I don't get it rather then poking fun at me for being too slow to get it.
Would it have been so hard to maybe not try and make things personal, or am I really that bad?
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Vexcalibur
Proud to be smug as heck
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Joined: Jan 18, 2008
Posts: 5379
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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Let those idiots smoke at home.
Just ban it from public places. Just like pooping.
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iamnotaparakeet
Martian
Joined: Aug 01, 2007
Age: 27
Posts: 25128
Location: 0.5 Galactic radius
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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| No. It's deadly and annoying though, but it shouldn't be considered a crime. However, aboard spacecraft and submarines with limited supplies of oxygen it should be considered the same as any other fire and be put out. |
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LiberalJustice
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 01, 2009
Posts: 1031
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:44 pm Post subject: Re: Should smoking be banned outright? |
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No. The way I see it, it is your body and you should be able to do what you want with it.
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Tequila
Trust the people!
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 26045
Location: Lancashire, UK
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Vexcalibur wrote: | | Let those idiots smoke at home. |
No, because then they'll infect their childrenz. Seen that one coming. |
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Joker
Sinn Fein
Joined: Mar 20, 2011
Age: 24
Posts: 7593
Location: North Carolina The Tar Heel State :)
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| Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:46 pm Post subject: Re: Should smoking be banned outright? |
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| LiberalJustice wrote: | | No. The way I see it, it is your body and you should be able to do what you want with it. |
I support this statement. |
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