what are asperger men problem

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Okay, after a good sleep I might be lucid enough to tackle this in a positive manner.

My sister's example certainly seems in favour that "if she's willing to put out, she can get a man" but I've known some other girls almost as repulsive that still have a hard time obtaining a man-toy. The difference between them may be that by sister's obesity let to enormous, sagging breasts that a number of men may have a fetish for, moreso than my repulsive friend's lopsided "one and two bee-sting" boobs.

I didn't like the tone of your rebuttal because it seemed to imply that if my repulsive sister gets prospects, somehow me getting prospects negated the argument because I'm just as repulsive and ugly as she is. That's the only way that argument could be true - one reason why I didn't like it.
(I'll have you know I brush my teeth and bathe daily - no blackened stinkiness here!)

Putting myself in that post was an irrelevant aside I should've just left out, it obviously just added to the general confusion around here.

You and I don't normally cross swords so it seemed odd you'd take such an aggressive stance against me when I replied to your post only moments before in full agreement!

This is interesting.
You can judge a guy's morality, attitude, intelligence and trustworthiness from only there appearance?
Really?
To me, that's prejudiced & stereotyping. Which is discrimination. You don't know anything about a guy until you date him.

What's so difficult about having an open mind? You know what, there should be a campaign for a 'just say yes' day of accepting approaches and then make an informed decision by giving the guy a chance at the very least. Because this social discrimination is vile and old fashioned, it needs to die out completely.

Hey... I like this one. This one's got a lot of merit... and how many of these bitter "forever alone" guys are stuck in that boat because they're simply not willing to risk themselves by NOT ASKING ANYONE?

To those guys (and sometimes myself!) I'll challenge them to change their mindset... if you think of asking a girl out as "no big deal", the positives far outweigh the negatives. You'll take the pressure off yourself, off of her, you'll seem like more fun which increases the chances of a yes, and if the answer is no it's not going to harm you!

Heck - I should make a new thread just for this! I'm-a gonna'!

No offence, but Aspie men are pretty bad with being open minded and will reject their fair share of women as well (some we don't realize we are rejecting). It always works both ways. I do understand where people don't have an open mind, and a friend to me last week said to me "You will get over this disease" and I rebuffed her and said "This is not a disease, it's part of who I am. Accept that."

Let's create another analogy, the job hunt.

Girls by social conditioning have always had the role of Interviewer/Employer.
Guys have always had the role of applicant.

Applicants do have the freedom to choose which employer they apply to & Employers can only interview the applicants that apply. They have no freedom in that respect.

However, because Employers have no freedom on who applies, they create there own freedom by introducing a set of criteria before granting an interview. These criteria lists go beyond the qualifications required for the job.

The applicants already know that these criteria lists exist.

Applicants have no power in the decision whether or not an interview is granted on the judgement of these criteria lists.

But they know that if they want the best possible chance of getting an interview they have to apply for hundreds of interviews irrespective of how qualified they are, even over-qualified applicants know the criteria for an interview is so strict that even an interview is an achievement.

Sadly, some applicants can see that the criteria list is so strict that the chances of being granted an interview are so small, they don't even apply in the first place, despite clearly having the qualifications to a become a model employee.

It's the same in the real world, people with Ph.D's are applying to McDonalds for a job and still get rejected.

if you don't apply for a job, there is a 100% chance you will not get it. that employer may be sitting and waiting for you to apply, but the union rules state that they cannot offer the job unless you apply first. and YOU decide which jobs you'll apply for. the power is ultimately in your hands.

Last edited by hyperlexian on 02 Dec 2012, 4:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Thanks for explaining.
No, I wasn't trying to imply the bolded part at all.

You see, even if you apply for the job it still is up to the employer to decide.

You seem to adopt the stance that the employer is just sitting there waiting for applications. They can also actively recruit by head-hunting. You also seem to imply that people arent applying for the job... when in fact they are. Its getting past the interview process that the whole 'problem' is in.

As a person seeking a job, what is a better situation to be in? To have the employer seek you out and offer you the job even though you've been actively applying to many other jobs... or to apply for jobs nonstop till you find one. Maybe. ?

Let's take it further. To get a job you must pass the interview. Interviews are heavily reliant on social skills that must be backed with experience/education. You get an applicant that is all charm and has good skills and another that is socially deficient yet an expert in the field. The job needs someone that can integrate with the team, company and perform on socializing-based tasks.

Who do you think gets the job? Why did he get it? Why was the other one not chosen?

Last edited by Dantac on 02 Dec 2012, 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Exactly. This is precisely why AS men fail in relationships. Just like interviews, dating relies heavily on social skills

no, most employers don't do any headhunting. most people don't get offered a job out of the blue, they have to actively seek it. i'm not sure about the rest of your tangent about headhunting as the analogy breaks down here.

but about having AS as an interviewee... what if the interviewer is similarly socially awkward, yet has to do all of that interviewing? i can't imagine a more uncomfortable experience.

I don't mean to go off topic. I agree with the employer-dating analogy a lot. I think it could even be taken further, though.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/2 ... 31289.html



Given the estimated 70-90% unemployment rate among AS adults, is it surprising that the majority of AS men cannot get a date?

I have found my dating prospects were much better when I had a job and declined when I went back to being a student after 3 years in the full-time workforce. So even if you're in school, you're less desirable. Add social awkwardness + student status (or worse, unemployment without student status), and I would be surprised even if neurotypical men in that situation could bag a date.

I tend to give women more credit though than some other people. I'm more likely to think that, as others have pointed out, that men with the qualities to secure a job also tend to have the qualities to secure a date, and vice versa --- rather than being unemployed is itself a cause of turning off women (I'm sure there's some of both though). I know many women who don't care much about money but still want a man who is going somewhere with his life. So it's not the money itself, but rather the idea of dating an equal.

Last edited by Tyri0n on 02 Dec 2012, 5:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

wait a minute. keep in mind that 50% of the workforce is comprised of women, and women tend to marry men of similar socioeconomic status as themselves. they were probably surveying employed women (the majority, after all. tellingly, the survey didn't mention it either way). if you are an unemployed man, maybe seek out unemployed women - they would be the same status, after all.

something you noticeably didn't quote from that same page:

also, if you're going to throw around aspie employment statistics, please back them up with credible sources.

(edit: if you are using the oft-quoted autism unemployment rates, it includes all of the people on the mid and low ranges of the spectrum)

They do head hunt when they seek specific skill sets or they get no applicants for a position they need fulfilled. Applicants not applying to 'most' jobs will likely end up with no job...its all a numbers game. Also, 'most' employers are precisely those that get tons of applicants so they do not need to head-hunt. In other terms, they get to decide who they hire. Sound familiar?



I don't see the relevance here. Even if both were unemployed there is still the same 'pool/interview' process that will decide if a relationship takes place. Granted, its is in general highly unlikely the unemployed male will succeed whereas an unemployed female will likely succeed... economic factors are generally less an issue in the male decision list than the female one.

because men are expected to do the approaching, initiating, asking out, so any form of a social deficiency is going to hurt men more than women in this area of life

Though it may not completely level the playing field it is one reason on line dating is a great place for someone who behaves socially I a way that may confuse women. Though I firmly believe AS... At least on the low end... Is not a deficiency. This frustrates me. Why is "not the same" a deficiency, negative, bad, wrong?? It is a shame to me that those of you who have so much difficulty with embracing your traits and loving them were not brought up being told how great they are. I was always able to see the great parts of my son whrn he was growing up.. and although there are things about some behaviors that were frustrating as a parent there are no more frustraiting behaviors from him than there are with his NT sister. Just in different areas. He would ask me as a young child. "Mom, am I different/weird/strange" my answer... With a huge smile and hug was always yes... and that is what I love most about you. Just be who you are and be happy with that. You don't have to be like everyone else to be happy or to be a good person. He has all the Aspie traits. He is socially uncomfortable. He has a girlfriend and two other close friends and they are all inseparable and just click together. But he still gets social anxiety when he knows they are all getting together. He wants to do it but the thought overwhelms him and we work on how he deals with it. People are drawn to him and he still does and says things that NT wouldn't and sometimes people say something to him about it. He really doesnt care. He accepts himself. Honestly that is all it takes weather you are AS or NT..

As for who decides. It is not one person or the other. Women are just as insecure in the start of a relationship and have just as many fears of rejection as a man does. You can chose not to believe it but it doesn't change the facts. I am a woman and I know how I felt in dating situations. I know all the conversations I have had with girlfriends when they start dating a new guy and hoping he will call or ask her out again and not reject her. In all those situations 100% of those girls would say the decision was his not hers. It does become difficult for an AS to "read" that her not calling is her waiting for him to call and not a rejection etc.. but a relationship is always a mutual decision not a choice by one gender or the other.

BlueMax. What is the title of your new thread? I have not been able to get on as much because things got hectic around here (busy not relationship hectic) but I always love your posts.