I am starting to doubt that humans are capable of true love

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The only way true love can exist is if it is forgiving and cautious.

No one needs an obsession at that level. And there is nothing holy in that kind of fanatical obsession. Also, an expectation of unconditional, ''true'' love is nothing but selfishness IMHO. Love is (and should be) based on reciprocity.

Yeah I know, there are films, poems... but they are no evidence for true loves existence. ''Flying Spaghetti Monster'' should be enough to falsify that argument. Finally:

“We owe to the Middle Ages the two worst inventions of humanity - romantic love and gunpowder.” -Andre Maurois

True love is something you give, not expect. reciprocity is nothing more than business arrangement. if you have to receive back then you don't have love, you have a mutual arrangement.

Poets, historical lovers. These are all evidence of what you appear to have missed, judging by your words, IMHO.

Good luck in your business arrangements. Don't begrudge others their willingness to give unconditionally and others won't begrudge you and whatever partner you find in your "tit for tat" quest.

Even "True Love" has expectations.

The only measure of "True Love" is when someone gives up his or her life so that someone else may live.

Less than that is mere transactional game-playing.

A neighbor has a wife who, very early in marriage, was in a really bad accident. can't care for herself, can't walk, has to wear diapers and be changed. They don't get home health care. He cares for her completely, no children, nothing. The state would probably euthanize her (let her starve) since she can't communicate a sentence. But he cares for her continually. they have been married over 50 years. he does her physical therapy faithfully, pays for help when he can afford it. I don't know which will pass first. but I would have to say that is unconditional love. he takes her out to see the world, even though she probably doesn't have the mental capacity to understand. he can never get kisses or hugs from her. Perhaps he expected something when he first got married, but now there is no doubt that he will never receive reciprocity, there is no transactional playing game..

Yet he has not died. Deny it if you will but True love exists without death.

^ Duty. Plus, he'd likely be a social outcast if he abandoned her.

Don't tell me that he never had a little something on the side going on.

He's never had a little something going on. There I told you. No he wouldn't be a social outcast. We live in a society where putting her in a home and eventually divorcing her would have been considered humane for both.

You have watched Twilight too many times recently, I suppose.

Can you torture a 3 year old baby for your true love? If not, then it is conditional. If you can, then it is fanatical and obscene.

I have never seen twilight. IMO your ideologies are strange, at the least. Love is not torture. nor is it fanatical. sacrificial love is self sacrificing. The characteristics do not make it conditional. There is nothing to gain by encouraging baseless inhumanities under the false pretext of love. This is not conditional, this is wisdom.

Your refusal or inability to separate violence and destruction from your concepts of love or relationships, your inability or refusal to consider or accept that love includes intelligence and wisdom, informs me clearly that you have, either by choice or limitation, no comprehension true emotions. It would be like trying to run a current through an insulator, far too much energy expended for far too little, if any, throughput.

Say what you will, but your posts, to me, evidence nothing more than the inability and/or refusal to go beyond the "black and white" mentalities, the inability and/or refusal to accept and/or comprehend abstract facts, a key component of our intelligence that distinguishes us from the rest of nature.

I apologize for the possible offensive nature of this post. No offense is intended but I cannot quickly think of any more polite forms to present my thoughts on this. As such I will no longer post in response to this because I do not want to risk further offense. I would not post this one if I did not feel the need to respond to key points.

I believe your responses provide a welcome counterpoint to the cynicism of a group notorious for having trouble with relationships. There's a warmth to them which is wonderful to see on WP.

No problem in that, I did not feel offended. I respect your opinion. On the other hand, I think ''Other than true love, it is business'' rhetoric is the very ''black and white'' mentality. From ''unconditioned'', I understand that absolutely NOTHING can get through. I feel that kind of recklessness is dangerous. This is not about love, this is about ''unconditioned'' love.

I do not expect an answer, I just want to clarify what I said.