marshall
Under the whirlwind
Joined: Apr 15, 2007
Posts: 9167
Location: Western Michigan
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 Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:09 am Post subject: |
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| ouinon wrote: | | marshall wrote: | | My problem is strictly with organized religions such as Christianity. The concept of Christianity is contrary to my personal sense of morality. Sorry to be so blunt, but I don't feel there's a better way to put it. Bible God is an authoritarian as*hole. When I see people worshipping the Bible God it's like seeing people worshipping Joseph Stalin. |
That reminds me of what i thought about jesus two and a half years ago; that he was a megalomaniac , "scientology-crossed with jones" style, responsible for a terrible mental black plague, of spreading a psychological big brother, and dragging people into more obsessive self-criticism, guilt and keeping up with the neighbours than ever before. I thought of jesus as one of the worst things that had happened to western civilisation.
Weird.
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Actually I don't think Jesus was a bad guy. He was a narcissist with a bit of a temper (see fig tree cursing) but overall he had more good teachings than bad. OTOH I think Paul was completely nuts. He’s the guy who put the psychotic OT god back into the NT and added all that fire and brimstone crap.
Protestants in America tend to go for the old school fire and brimstone teachings of Paul. If you don’t accept Jesus into your heart you’re gonna burn in hell. The Catholics don’t seem quite as insane, but I come from a protestant background so that’s what I’m familiar with. |
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iamnotaparakeet
Martian
Joined: Aug 01, 2007
Age: 27
Posts: 25128
Location: 0.5 Galactic radius
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 4:06 am Post subject: |
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| Awesomelyglorious wrote: | | iamnotaparakeet wrote: |
Although there may be wackos like Hovind, there are also scientists who reject evolution on its lack of scientific merit. Parts of evolution, like natural selection, are valid, but on the whole it is not. YEC is about more than biology though. ID touches on this topic only although it never spells out who the Designer is. After I get a Ph.D I intend to do research that would test and refine current theories. A country without the ACLU (or the like thereof) would be only kind I could publish papers in, so that is one reason I'm leaving America. |
YEC is about a lot of different propositions that are currently scientifically questionable but technically unfalsifiable. ID is also lacking in scientific merit though, from the very beginning it starts off with an unscientific hypothesis, as there is no way of testing to see if something is designed from an unknown power. Where would you go to though? Frankly, America has the best universities, a good number of universities, a good amount of research spending, and is one of the most conservative nations in the world. |
I'm thinking about Australia or maybe New Zealand. America was one of the most conservative nations, but it is quickly deteriorating from that. Australia is fairly liberal, but they have a good educational system which is affordable too and there is no organization similar to the ACLU or whatnot. There may be plenty of good colleges here, but financial aid is nonexistent to me since my stepdad makes too much money. Next year, by my age, I will no longer be considered a dependent, so then I may get a Pell or Stafford or whatever. |
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Awesomelyglorious
Destroyer of worlds, reaver of souls
Joined: Dec 18, 2005
Posts: 14174
Location: Omnipresent
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 4:18 am Post subject: |
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| iamnotaparakeet wrote: |
I'm thinking about Australia or maybe New Zealand. America was one of the most conservative nations, but it is quickly deteriorating from that. Australia is fairly liberal, but they have a good educational system which is affordable too and there is no organization similar to the ACLU or whatnot. There may be plenty of good colleges here, but financial aid is nonexistent to me since my stepdad makes too much money. Next year, by my age, I will no longer be considered a dependent, so then I may get a Pell or Stafford or whatever. |
Deteriorating? Not really. Very few nations actually HAVE an ID movement. Australia also isn't *that* liberal for a developed nation, and easily can be considered one of the more conservative nations there. Honestly, from everything I have heard, America is one of the hottest places to be an academic no matter where you stand really. |
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iamnotaparakeet
Martian
Joined: Aug 01, 2007
Age: 27
Posts: 25128
Location: 0.5 Galactic radius
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 4:23 am Post subject: |
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| Awesomelyglorious wrote: | | iamnotaparakeet wrote: |
I'm thinking about Australia or maybe New Zealand. America was one of the most conservative nations, but it is quickly deteriorating from that. Australia is fairly liberal, but they have a good educational system which is affordable too and there is no organization similar to the ACLU or whatnot. There may be plenty of good colleges here, but financial aid is nonexistent to me since my stepdad makes too much money. Next year, by my age, I will no longer be considered a dependent, so then I may get a Pell or Stafford or whatever. |
Deteriorating? Not really. Very few nations actually HAVE an ID movement. Australia also isn't *that* liberal for a developed nation, and easily can be considered one of the more conservative nations there. Honestly, from everything I have heard, America is one of the hottest places to be an academic no matter where you stand really. |
Well, thanks for your input.  |
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marshall
Under the whirlwind
Joined: Apr 15, 2007
Posts: 9167
Location: Western Michigan
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 4:48 am Post subject: |
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I don't think the ACLU can prevent someone from having an academic opinion or publishing papers supporting ID or creationism. There are plenty of academics with non-mainstream ideas in American universities.
The ACLU is merely against teaching creationism in public schools as it isn't the consensus among biologists. Why should creationism be given preferential treatment over other non-mainstream ideas such as cold fusion? Very few biologists are creationists just as very few physicists believe in cold fusion. If religion is the only reason then the case can be made that by teaching creationism the government is supporting the establishment of religion. |
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rocklobster
Deinonychus
Joined: Jun 13, 2006
Posts: 356
Location: Planet Claire
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 8:35 am Post subject: |
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| Well, I guess I'll keep my witnessing to a minimum here. |
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richardbenson
Fire Agate
Joined: Oct 31, 2006
Posts: 14425
Location: Leave only a footprint behind
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| rocklobster wrote: | | Well, I guess I'll keep my witnessing to a minimum here. |
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iamnotaparakeet
Martian
Joined: Aug 01, 2007
Age: 27
Posts: 25128
Location: 0.5 Galactic radius
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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| marshall wrote: | I don't think the ACLU can prevent someone from having an academic opinion or publishing papers supporting ID or creationism. There are plenty of academics with non-mainstream ideas in American universities.
The ACLU is merely against teaching creationism in public schools as it isn't the consensus among biologists. Why should creationism be given preferential treatment over other non-mainstream ideas such as cold fusion? Very few biologists are creationists just as very few physicists believe in cold fusion. If religion is the only reason then the case can be made that by teaching creationism the government is supporting the establishment of religion. |
In a few particular cases, people have lost their jobs who allowed nonnaturalistic papers to be published. Not just the ACLU though. As for public schools it is not just creationism that is banned, but ID which would question neodarwinism. |
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JohnnyCarcinogen
Phoenix
Joined: Jun 30, 2007
Posts: 789
Location: Missouri, USA
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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| rocklobster wrote: | | Well, I guess I'll keep my witnessing to a minimum here. |
Witnessing online is probably the most lazy way to "witness" to someone. Apparently you don't put a lot of effort into this.
_________________
"If Evolution is outlawed, only outlaws will evolve" - Jello Biafra
Check out my blog at:
http://thelatte.posterous.com/ |
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richardbenson
Fire Agate
Joined: Oct 31, 2006
Posts: 14425
Location: Leave only a footprint behind
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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| JohnnyCarcinogen wrote: | | Witnessing online is probably the most lazy way to "witness" to someone. |
maybe hes an aspie and cant go door to door |
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iamnotaparakeet
Martian
Joined: Aug 01, 2007
Age: 27
Posts: 25128
Location: 0.5 Galactic radius
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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| richardbenson wrote: | | JohnnyCarcinogen wrote: | | Witnessing online is probably the most lazy way to "witness" to someone. |
maybe hes an aspie and cant go door to door |
Also you get to have cool down time after being insulted repeatedly, whereas in person there is no cool down time. |
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