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LoveableNerd
Velociraptor
Joined: Apr 24, 2008
Posts: 435
Location: Kentucky, USA
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 Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 1:24 pm Post subject: |
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| krex wrote: | | I would like to know who and how they came up with the questions for this test. I scored 26 but think I am a very empathetic person. I work in social services and often feel so much pain at the discomfort of the clients I work with that it is painful. I may not be able to give a hug or know what to say but I try and "problem solve" to alleviate as much of their pain and discomfort as possible. The NT's I worked with appeared unaffected and indifferent to it. |
I think the fact that we "problem solve" instead of communicate our sympathy with their feelings in a comforting way is what they mean when they say we lack empathy. That is one reason the average scores were so much higher for women than men. If you buy into the whole venus/mars thing, women are supposedly more likely to want this "empathy" for their problems, whereas men are more likely to offer them practical solutions to the problems. Hence the argument that aspies have an "extreme male" brain, regardless of gender.
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Alexey
Blue Jay
Joined: Jan 25, 2008
Posts: 82
Location: Moscow, Russia
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 1:38 pm Post subject: |
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| anja wrote: | | I thought the "lack of empathy" referred to how aspies have difficulties reading body language and facial expressions. |
I've asked several NT's about their way of reading non-verbal communication: they have "built-in" mechanism that converts non-verbal clues into emotions directly and almost without realizing. E.g. I've asked my mother about doing emotional "aura" of conversation: she is even not realizing it and thinks that it is "natural".
I have such thing too, but it is slow and not accurate: my EQ is 20 (AQ is 32); so immediate emotional response and emotional involvement may be not obvious for me and require extra energy compared to NT. |
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krex
Phoenix
Joined: Jun 21, 2006
Age: 45
Posts: 5012
Location: Village of the Damned
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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| LoveableNerd wrote: | | krex wrote: | | I would like to know who and how they came up with the questions for this test. I scored 26 but think I am a very empathetic person. I work in social services and often feel so much pain at the discomfort of the clients I work with that it is painful. I may not be able to give a hug or know what to say but I try and "problem solve" to alleviate as much of their pain and discomfort as possible. The NT's I worked with appeared unaffected and indifferent to it. |
I think the fact that we "problem solve" instead of communicate our sympathy with their feelings in a comforting way is what they mean when they say we lack empathy. That is one reason the average scores were so much higher for women than men. If you buy into the whole venus/mars thing, women are supposedly more likely to want this "empathy" for their problems, whereas men are more likely to offer them practical solutions to the problems. Hence the argument that aspies have an "extreme male" brain, regardless of gender. |
Well, I agree that that is the issue but my point is that they need to reword the DX and stop telling people we lack empathy just because we show it differently(it carries a very negative value judgement in our society). It is a harmful stereo-type as empathy is a very valued trait. It is considered one of the hallmarks, separating humans for animals,(which is absurd because I know animals can often tell when we are sad and hurt and offer comfort the best they can). Anyway...I don't see it as better to offer some empty words rather then try and alleviate the actual suffering.
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ThatRedHairedGrrl
Deinonychus
Joined: May 11, 2008
Posts: 332
Location: Totally confusing all the passing piranhas
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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Great question!
Empathy. The word comes from the Greek for 'feel within'. To me, it's the ability to out yourself in someone else's shoes, to 'get inside' their feelings and understand why they're feeling the way they are, in the way you'd understand if you were having those feelings.
Now, this isn't something I have trouble with. But I do often have trouble knowing how to respond. I often say that I'm a wuss around other people's pain, and it's true; if someone is crying round me, I don't know how to react. That doesn't mean I don't understand or share their feelings - they can be very clear, and perhaps too intense - it's the actual behavioral aspect of dealing with them that gets me.
Of course, an interesting point is that while many AS folks have made a conscious effort to understand the way NTs feel, there are plenty of NTs who - in spite of supposedly having more 'natural' empathy - don't appear to understand, or even be prepared to try and understand, how we feel. Which puts a whole different spin on things, I think!
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Twibbit
Emu Egg
Joined: Apr 03, 2008
Age: 21
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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scored an 8...
despite that I think I do have some innate empathy. I after all never like to see people crying/upset. I just tend to not know why they are feeling this way. |
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Marrshu
Raven
Joined: Oct 12, 2006
Posts: 110
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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I scored a 45 out of 80 on the EQ test. However, my problem is more expressing my empathy.
I think a lot of autistics experience empathy, but either don't express it, or mistake it for something else. |
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Fred54
Raven
Joined: Feb 23, 2006
Age: 37
Posts: 106
Location: Montréal, QC
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Marrshu wrote: | | I think a lot of autistics experience empathy, but either don't express it, or mistake it for something else. |
Yup, this is what I am often saying to my GF, I feel things but can not express them 
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Bozewani
Deinonychus
Joined: Mar 04, 2008
Age: 19
Posts: 330
Location: Somewhere in the Universe
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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I scored 40, right down the middle
You know I try to be empathetic, but I wished I knew so these results are somewhat accurate, somewhat not (Just like SAT scores)
I try to be concerned, really, I do but I am not sure. |
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srriv345
Velociraptor
Joined: Jul 19, 2006
Age: 21
Posts: 447
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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| I agree about the aspie desire to "problem-solve" in crisis situations. I feel uncomfortable when others are suffering, and the best thing I know how to do is present possible solutions, point out irrationalities. Recently, this actually happened with my aspie partner. I kept talking at him about how everything could work out and asking questions, and he eventually was able to tell me that he just needed me to hug him and be with him. I honestly had no idea--but now I know for next time, I think. |
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Paperplate
Snowy Owl
Joined: Jan 29, 2008
Age: 33
Posts: 169
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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I find it easier to express empathy to other people when my senses are not overstimulated. It sounds selfish but i constantly have to cope with my own racing mind. I respond to something by instantly forming a picture in my mind first, intead of automatically responding to words and situations. Emotionally I think I have more empathy than many people because I can itensely live myself into situations, visualising it into the finest details with no effort. It is expressing empathy, the right amount at the right time, that space space between being overbearing and being aloof that is difficult to master.
Would be great if everyone was trying to figure out empathy and theory of mind when dealing with Aspies.
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Willard
Phoenix
Joined: Mar 24, 2008
Posts: 617
Location: Confederate States of America
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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| krex wrote: | II work in social services and often feel so much pain at the discomfort of the clients I work with that it is painful. I may not be able to give a hug or know what to say but I try and "problem solve" to alleviate as much of their pain and discomfort as possible. The NT's I worked with appeared unaffected and indifferent to it.
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Often as not, a seeming lack of empathy may come from not knowing how to demonstrate empathy naturally, or feeling so awkward about the other person's discomfort or unhappiness that I simply say nothing and it's easy for others to assume I didn't care.
Then again, there's sometimes a larger question of precisely who or what I'm supposed to be empathizing with. I always liked that Charles Schultz Peanuts quip: "I love mankind, it's people I can't stand."
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SotiCoto
Velociraptor
Joined: May 14, 2008
Posts: 474
Location: London
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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I'm proud to say I do not have empathy.
I have logical situation-analysis capabilities. That is to say I can attempt to account for the significant influences upon a given situation and thus analyse what the available options and potential thought processes would be for a person under said circumstances....... BUT I cannot and will not empathise. |
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sinagua
Deinonychus
Joined: Nov 29, 2007
Posts: 371
Location: Rhode Island
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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| tharn wrote: |
Sometimes I watch the news, and it's obvious that a particular area is going through hard times - through no fault of its own - and some of the residents are still selflessly looking after their neighbors. I experience sorrow at the tragedy, and then a sense of appreciation and hope for mankind. When someone abuses an animal, it's hard for me to choke down my pity and my desire to strangle the abuser. Of all the spectrum people I've met, I've never found these types of reactions to be lacking in them either!
So what behavior is it that they expect in order for me to be labeled "empathic"? Do I have to be able to read the emotions people are hiding, or not fully expressing? Maybe they should learn how to express their emotions properly. I know any emotion I feel, I either express honestly or keep it to myself, and I don't expect others to read my mind - is that so much to ask of others? Am I expected to break into tears every time I see some shmaltzy movie or tearful trailer park reunion on a talk show? The fact is that more often than not, people are being manipulative with the emotions they express, or shallow, or just wallowing about in their own drama. So sue me if I exercise a bit of restraint until I know more about the person or the circumstances.
So yeah, I'm tired of the notion that we lack empathy. I think it's an inaccurate and unfair conclusion based on psychometric tests that can't properly measure what they claim to measure, and the ridiculous assumption that because we don't communicate emotions the way THEY do, that we just don't have them. Stuff and non-sense. 
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I agree with this.
If anything, I think I'm often MORE emotional or empathetic than most NTs I know. Growing up (and even as an adult) I so often felt (and feel) like I was the only person who was outraged when someone was cruel to another person, or child, or an animal. I felt like I was always looking around me going, "Am I the ONLY PERSON HERE who sees this and thinks it's WRONG and totally unacceptable? Apparently, yes!" My family excuses the most horrible, cruel, even violent behavior from my little nephew, for instance, because "he's just a little boy" and "boys will be boys."  When my son with AS sobbed and screamed when his cousin spat in his face, instead of getting after the spitting cousin, my family chastised MY SON - said he was just "too sensitive."   There are even worse things I won't mention.
None of them have seen me or my son since. It's been years.
In summary, if anything, I feel like I'm MORE empathetic than most people I know, even though I generally prefer to spend most of my time alone. |
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samantca
Velociraptor
Joined: Apr 09, 2008
Age: 23
Posts: 459
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Your Empathy Quotient (EQ) is 20 out of 80 |
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Reodor_Felgen
Counting down till Castro bites the dust
Joined: Sep 29, 2007
Age: 20
Posts: 1633
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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It depends on what you define as empathy. Technically, I don't show much empathy, but I feel a lot of compassion and sympathy.
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