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BazzaMcKenzie
Wild colonial man
Joined: Aug 22, 2006
Posts: 3702
Location: the Antipodes
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 Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 2:10 am Post subject: |
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| MR_BOGAN wrote: | | Mugabe actually used to be a good and highly respected president, but he has been corrupted by power and is really old and senial now. |
I don't think that's true.
He was always a brutal murderer
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I just dropped in to see what condition my condition was in.
Strewth!
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Jaunty
Butterfly
Joined: Jul 06, 2008
Age: 112
Posts: 15
Location: Auld Eire
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 2:55 am Post subject: |
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I just say: Robert Who?
If you don't acknowledge it, sooner or later it will go away. Treat it like a stain on the Y-fronts of the world.
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Be gosh and begorrah, oh what a foine place this be....
Oi'll have a Guiness, if ye be buying... |
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Aspie_Chav
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 07, 2006
Age: 35
Posts: 2107
Location: Croydon
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 2:58 am Post subject: |
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Whatever the official results, whenever they are announced, some people, and not just the well off, voted for Mugabe. With all the press coverage of the country's economic woes, people outside Zimbabwe may be wondering why anyone would still do this.
Here are a few quotes from the streets of Harare (in answer to the question: "Why do you think some people voted for Mugabe?":
"He's a pan-Africanist, he's the only one who knows how to deal with white people and their colonial agenda. He's repossesing our forefathers land. These white people have been having a free ride for too long. He's revenging colonialism and slavery." T Jay, a pan-Africanist.
"I like this chaos, I'm making billions. I pray that Comrade Bob doesn't go." An illegal foreign currency dealer.
"I'd rather vote for Bob than for Tsvangirayi because Tsvanngirayi has got the evil West behind him. Since when did white people start loving blacks other than for reasons that are to their own benefit." N Y, a pan-Africanist.
"This country can only be governed through an iron fist; if we are given too much freedom we will start robbing and raping each other like the South Africans." A corporal in the Zimbabwe National Army.
"This man has defeated a colonialist agenda for a decade. He's a true African." A Somali refugee.
"Robert Mugabe is a black Moses leading the children of Zimbabwe to the promised land." A beneficiary of the land reform programme.
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Quatermass
Deranged scientist
Joined: Apr 28, 2006
Posts: 17246
Location: The Crucible
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 3:54 am Post subject: |
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How is Metropolis relevant to Zimbabwe? Does not compute. Mea navis aėricumbens anguillis abundat.
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People and planets and stars will become dust. And the dust will become atoms and the atoms will become... nothing. This is my ultimate victory, Doctor! The destruction of reality itself! |
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DrizzleMan
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 814
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 4:42 am Post subject: |
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| Tim_Tex wrote: | | Which regime had worse standards of living, Mugabe or his predecessor (Ian Smith)? |
I hope those aren't the only choices 
Zimbabwe needs a leader who is accountable to all its citizens. Smith didn't qualify. Mugabe's rigging of the last election shows that he does not qualify either.
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Signature quote: "I apologise in advance for the cliches." |
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Voltaire
Blue Jay
Joined: Jul 07, 2008
Age: 53
Posts: 90
Location: At the back of your mind.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:06 am Post subject: |
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Problem is, Mugabe has been pulling this same sh** for nearly 30 years; it's about time the Hague ordered the UN and other African nations to use armed force and take him out. Destroy his fascist regime, put in the rightful winner of the election, and then declare martial law while you pick up all the Mugabe supporters. Then, employ a firing squad and shoot them, under rule 303. Either that or send him to Coventry, and make sure that no-one deals with them at all and the country itself blows itself up. Force obviously must be used on him, because diplomacy hasn't. Then when that is over, the country can start to function like a proper civilised society again.
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I may not agree with what you say, but I will fight for your right to say it.
Machiavelli, Dante, Sideshow Bob - now THAT'S a trinity. |
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monty
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 05, 2007
Posts: 2507
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| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:11 am Post subject: Re: Can anyone respect Mugabe point of view |
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| Aspie_Chav wrote: | | Can anyone respect Mugabe point of view or see his point of view. |
No. He is a kleptocrat - stealing everything he can get his hands on. Similar to Mobutu, except instead of right-wing rhetoric, he has left-wing rhetoric. His words don't mask his true nature. When he first came to power, there was hope that he would lead Zimbabwe to a better future. Obviously, he didn't do that. He used power to enrich himself at the expense of the nation. |
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Aspie_Chav
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 07, 2006
Age: 35
Posts: 2107
Location: Croydon
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 10:34 am Post subject: |
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| Quatermass wrote: | | How is Metropolis relevant to Zimbabwe? Does not compute. Mea navis aėricumbens anguillis abundat. |
In the film, the robot girl thing freed lower class workers from the machine that powered the city. The damn robot girl did not understand the implication nor did the damnass workers. Then the light in the city went out damn burst and flood the city.
The people of Zimbabwe thought the country would be better of by chucking out the white workers, they did not understand the implications
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Voltaire
Blue Jay
Joined: Jul 07, 2008
Age: 53
Posts: 90
Location: At the back of your mind.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 11:02 am Post subject: |
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Mugabe would be more like this as far as his nation is concerned:
[url] [url]
A very insular person indeed.
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I may not agree with what you say, but I will fight for your right to say it.
Machiavelli, Dante, Sideshow Bob - now THAT'S a trinity. |
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Quatermass
Deranged scientist
Joined: Apr 28, 2006
Posts: 17246
Location: The Crucible
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Aspie_Chav wrote: |
In the film, the robot girl thing freed lower class workers from the machine that powered the city. The damn robot girl did not understand the implication nor did the damnass workers. Then the light in the city went out damn burst and flood the city.
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Actually, if you knew about the story as much as I do, you'd know it was Rotwang (please hold your sniggers for later) who actually ordered the robot version of Maria to bring down Metropolis. You know Rotwang? The kooky scientist with a metal hand and a fixation on his dead wife?
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People and planets and stars will become dust. And the dust will become atoms and the atoms will become... nothing. This is my ultimate victory, Doctor! The destruction of reality itself! |
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adverb
Sea Gull
Joined: Dec 08, 2007
Posts: 242
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 4:17 am Post subject: |
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| Orwell wrote: | | No. He murdered, brutalized, and intimidated innocent civilians in his attempts to illegally cling to power. The sooner he dies, the better. |
by those standards, is he any better than any us president from the last half of the 20th century, or since?
sure, it's easy to criticize mugabe, but could anyone really be a respected leader of zimbabwe? this is a country where 1 out of 5 people has AIDS, where less than 3% of the population can even speak the official language. the inflation rate is 26000%, and the unemployment rate is 80%. could those figures really be the result of one man, rather than the corporate and industrial and social leaders (or lack thereof) in that country? the life expectancy in zimbabwe is a good bit less than half of that of the usa - how is that the fault of mugabe? has it decreased that much since he took power?
the literacy rate of zimbabwe is 90% - pretty great compared to it's neigbhors.
i'm not at all trying to defend mugabe, but his country is doing better than a lot of those around it, and the problems that it does have are shared by all of its neighbors. in this light, how can you finger-point at one man half a world away, and kvetch about his immoralities when most of the continent around him is at least as bad?
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What will happen in the morning when the world it gets so crowded that you can't look out the window in the morning?
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Quatermass
Deranged scientist
Joined: Apr 28, 2006
Posts: 17246
Location: The Crucible
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 4:33 am Post subject: |
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| adverb wrote: |
by those standards, is he any better than any us president from the last half of the 20th century, or since? |
How many US leaders go out of their way towards political terror? Or many other world leaders, for that matter?
| adverb wrote: | | sure, it's easy to criticize mugabe, but could anyone really be a respected leader of zimbabwe? |
It's better to ask, can anyone do better?
| adverb wrote: | | this is a country where 1 out of 5 people has AIDS, |
Unfortunately common in Africa, not just Zimbabwe.
| adverb wrote: | | where less than 3% of the population can even speak the official language. |
English? So? If they can speak and write their local dialects, it's fine. It's only if English is used for official forms used by the populace that that would worry me.
| adverb wrote: | | the inflation rate is 26000%, and the unemployment rate is 80%. could those figures really be the result of one man, rather than the corporate and industrial and social leaders (or lack thereof) in that country? |
It is rather what he allowed people to do. It's a kleptocracy.
| adverb wrote: | | the life expectancy in zimbabwe is a good bit less than half of that of the usa - how is that the fault of mugabe? has it decreased that much since he took power? |
It was 56 in 1993 (average for African countries at the time, according to the WHO report I looked up). It has gotten worse since then. What more do you need to ask?
| adverb wrote: | | the literacy rate of zimbabwe is 90% - pretty great compared to it's neigbhors. |
Very good. One good thing about that country at the moment.
| adverb wrote: | | i'm not at all trying to defend mugabe, but his country is doing better than a lot of those around it, and the problems that it does have are shared by all of its neighbors. in this light, how can you finger-point at one man half a world away, and kvetch about his immoralities when most of the continent around him is at least as bad? |
Because he seems to actually concentrate these barbarities, and continually add to them.
_________________
People and planets and stars will become dust. And the dust will become atoms and the atoms will become... nothing. This is my ultimate victory, Doctor! The destruction of reality itself! |
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