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RogueProcess
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jun 22, 2008
Age: 23
Posts: 190
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 Posted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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Oh gawd, I go away for a week and people are STILL arguing about what emo is? Not even new bits of argument, BUT ARGUING OVER THE SAME POINTS? Come on. Jeez.
To digress again though, @Xanderbeanz - Although I can see where you're coming from with your argument about 'emo' being harmonically, timbrally and rhythmically dull, and to an extent I would agree with you, but I really cannot see where you're coming from with your argument that musical merit is based on its complexity and playmanship. Sure, I hate music that is most obviously lazily written, produced or played, but even if, say, Aphex Twin wrote a symphony, if it cannot garner an emotional response within the listener, then really, what's the point of it? Music is a form of art, and as somebody once said, music without a soul is merely mathematics. Sure, the complexity and accomplishment in a piece of music can itself garner that emotional response to certain people, such as, I assume, yourself, but in doing so, then it becomes subjective, as you really cannot say your emotional response is more valid than anybody else's, and your discussions and opinions are no more 'informed' than the masses of pop-buying sheep that you seem to consider yourself to be better informed than.
On a more friendly note, I'd absolutely love to hear you abusing a DX7, that sounds awesome  I do love some old-school FM sounds! |
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gamefreak
Quit M$ cold turkey and loving it!!!!
Joined: Dec 31, 2006
Age: 19
Posts: 1597
Location: Citrus County, Florida
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| Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2008 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Why I know Depeche Mode isn't sad music. Even the "Black Celebration" Album was kind of serious but not cold. |
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Xanderbeanz
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 09, 2008
Age: 26
Posts: 830
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| Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2008 5:54 pm Post subject: ... |
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| RogueProcess wrote: | | as you really cannot say your emotional response is more valid than anybody else's, and your discussions and opinions are no more 'informed' than the masses of pop-buying sheep that you seem to consider yourself to be better informed than. |
i can, but then again, i'm a complete twat ^.^ x |
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RogueProcess
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jun 22, 2008
Age: 23
Posts: 190
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 1:12 pm Post subject: Re: ... |
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| Xanderbeanz wrote: | | RogueProcess wrote: | | as you really cannot say your emotional response is more valid than anybody else's, and your discussions and opinions are no more 'informed' than the masses of pop-buying sheep that you seem to consider yourself to be better informed than. |
i can, but then again, i'm a complete twat ^.^ x |
No, it's not that you're a complete twat, just that you're doing so without any proper validity or justification. |
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Xanderbeanz
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 09, 2008
Age: 26
Posts: 830
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 3:10 pm Post subject: Re: ... |
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| RogueProcess wrote: | | Xanderbeanz wrote: | | RogueProcess wrote: | | as you really cannot say your emotional response is more valid than anybody else's, and your discussions and opinions are no more 'informed' than the masses of pop-buying sheep that you seem to consider yourself to be better informed than. |
i can, but then again, i'm a complete twat ^.^ x |
No, it's not that you're a complete twat, just that you're doing so without any proper validity or justification. |
yeah, i know, playing 12 instruments, being able to fake any instrument i can't play in cubase to undetectable levels, being able to mix, produce, sing, and master....oh and write and arrange for orchestra...oh and the fact i can hear every layer in a song transparently and replicate it on any of these instruments or timbres...gives me no more of an informed opinion than a 15 year old kerrang listener who knows f**k all.
sh**....i hate human beings.x |
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JohnHopkins
In no way offensive to anybody. Honest.
Joined: Nov 20, 2007
Age: 21
Posts: 2735
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Don't worry, they probably hate you as well. |
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Xanderbeanz
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 09, 2008
Age: 26
Posts: 830
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:45 pm Post subject: ... |
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| i know this to be true ^.^ |
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RogueProcess
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jun 22, 2008
Age: 23
Posts: 190
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 6:06 pm Post subject: Re: ... |
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| Xanderbeanz wrote: | | RogueProcess wrote: | | Xanderbeanz wrote: | | RogueProcess wrote: | | as you really cannot say your emotional response is more valid than anybody else's, and your discussions and opinions are no more 'informed' than the masses of pop-buying sheep that you seem to consider yourself to be better informed than. |
i can, but then again, i'm a complete twat ^.^ x |
No, it's not that you're a complete twat, just that you're doing so without any proper validity or justification. |
yeah, i know, playing 12 instruments, being able to fake any instrument i can't play in cubase to undetectable levels, being able to mix, produce, sing, and master....oh and write and arrange for orchestra...oh and the fact i can hear every layer in a song transparently and replicate it on any of these instruments or timbres...gives me no more of an informed opinion than a 15 year old kerrang listener who knows f**k all.
sh**....i hate human beings.x |
So, you've not listened to a word I said then eh? Yeah, you're a virtuoso, good for you. Damn, I can only play synthesizer. Have yourself a slice of metaphorical cake. But remember, there are computer programs out there that know every single scale, chord, tuning, microtuning, and whatever else that makes up the technical side of music out there that even you could name. I could get even the lowly Fuityloops to generate me a sequence of notes in the most exotic scale you like, turn the tempo up, and hey, I probably sound like Rick Bloody Wakeman. Does that give Fruityloops the emotional capacity to compose a piece of music that truly expresses love, joy, sadness or anger?
No, it doesn't. Like I said before, music without a soul is just mathematics. Music that is generally considered 'good', or 'classic' by people, all the way from primitive folk, to classical, to contemporary pop music, has been so because it has transcended the sum of its parts, because it communicates an idea, a message, a feeling, and that is something with which no amount of classical training or innate ability at however many instruments can hope to bestow upon you the ability to do.
So please go back to your 12 instruments and elite band of virtuoso friends. You claim you have the ability to play instruments extremely well, but you fail to see beyond this.
Oh, and hate to break it to you, but you ARE human  |
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Xanderbeanz
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 09, 2008
Age: 26
Posts: 830
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 6:12 pm Post subject: ... |
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| i'm barely human....i think the thing i regretted to say that adding emotion/lyrical depth (because people can interpret any bloody lyric as something deep half of the time) is great if you've actually got some interesting music going.......pure emotion or lyrical brilliance over a piece of shitty simple music is not gonna impress me, nor should it anyone, they're probably too simple to see through the crude scaffolding that is holding the lyrical concept up.x |
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RogueProcess
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jun 22, 2008
Age: 23
Posts: 190
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 6:35 pm Post subject: Re: ... |
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| Xanderbeanz wrote: | | i'm barely human....i think the thing i regretted to say that adding emotion/lyrical depth (because people can interpret any bloody lyric as something deep half of the time) is great if you've actually got some interesting music going.......pure emotion or lyrical brilliance over a piece of shitty simple music is not gonna impress me, nor should it anyone, they're probably too simple to see through the crude scaffolding that is holding the lyrical concept up.x |
Well, I would entirely disagree with that, and I'm sure a good few other people would, too, which is what I was saying before - you're basically putting down a whole bunch of people for having a differing opinion from you on something that is entirely subjective.
There is no objective standard over what makes a good piece of music, just as there is not one for art, or any other kind of purely creative endeavour. I'm not disagreeing that you feel that consider to be interesting music is better in your eyes, but I fail to understand how you can justify that such music is truly 'better' as an objective truth, as music itself serves no other purpose than to appeal to a listener's senses.
A truly bad piece of music therefore, would be something that appeals to absolutely nobody at all!
Sure, we all think that most of the contemporary emo discussed here 'sucks' - that's why we're all posting in this thread, but you, I nor anybody else could profess to knowing any better than the Kerrang-reading 15-year-old you talk about |
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Xanderbeanz
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 09, 2008
Age: 26
Posts: 830
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 6:55 pm Post subject: ... |
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| i get what you're trying to say....but the fact that i can break down a piece of music whilst listening to it, then play it back on many instruments, change it around, replicate it, take ideas from it, and use it in my own compositional toolbox for later use, must stand for something...lol x |
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JohnHopkins
In no way offensive to anybody. Honest.
Joined: Nov 20, 2007
Age: 21
Posts: 2735
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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f**k.
Would you PLEASE shut the f**k up about your giant musical talent?
In case you hadn't noticed, none of us here give two shits if you can play 500 instruments at once, with your eyes closed using only a drumstick shoved up your ass.
It just doesn't matter. Music is objective and people are different. And no, your opinion is no more valid than a 15 year old kid who listens to Kerrang! radio. And no, mine is no more valid either.
I know my fair share about music as well, but sometimes I envy the layman who can hear a piece of music and think 'oh yeah, that's quite good' rather than thinking 'nice middle eight, I liked the Em9, added an extra air of melancholy to an otherwise straightforward piece.'
Step into someone else's shoes for once. Stop admitting you're a twat and actually realise it instead, and do something about it instead of wallowing in it and acting like it's somehow okay just because you're aware of it.
This is going to get me banned or at least warned, but I really don't care. |
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mouapp
Phoenix
Joined: Mar 21, 2007
Age: 19
Posts: 683
Location: probably not WP
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:49 pm Post subject: Re: ... |
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| Xanderbeanz wrote: | | i get what you're trying to say....but the fact that i can break down a piece of music whilst listening to it, then play it back on many instruments, change it around, replicate it, take ideas from it, and use it in my own compositional toolbox for later use, must stand for something...lol x |
pic or it didn't happen
seriously you've been talking big since your first post and as someone who is still having trouble applying theory to what i listen to i would really like to hear your technical analysis of one of the songs JohnHopkins posted
it wont void anyone's arguments but it would be nice to know exactly what you mean
| JohnHopkins wrote: | | This is going to get me banned or at least warned, but I really don't care. |
i dont think any mods are watching this thread, i didn't get called on my last post
_________________
http://www.last.fm/user/mouapp/
Maybe I don't know either. |
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Paddy789
Sea Gull
Joined: Aug 13, 2008
Posts: 245
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| Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:57 pm Post subject: Re: ... |
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| mouapp wrote: | | Xanderbeanz wrote: | | i get what you're trying to say....but the fact that i can break down a piece of music whilst listening to it, then play it back on many instruments, change it around, replicate it, take ideas from it, and use it in my own compositional toolbox for later use, must stand for something...lol x |
pic or it didn't happen
seriously you've been talking big since your first post and as someone who is still having trouble applying theory to what i listen to i would really like to hear your technical analysis of one of the songs JohnHopkins posted |
I know this guy on another forum, he's decent really. Maybe some people just need to lighten up.
Don't like people classifying the music you like as emo? Piss off and ignore them.  |
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JohnHopkins
In no way offensive to anybody. Honest.
Joined: Nov 20, 2007
Age: 21
Posts: 2735
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| Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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| ...did you actually read any of my posts? |
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