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monty
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27 Jan 2009, 12:54 pm

ruveyn wrote:
What you are saying in effect is that Jews shouldn't exist. Why aren't we extinct? Why are we still around bothering people like you? Why don't we just disappear? Right?


I didn't read it that way - unlike you, he doesn't equate Israel with Jewish survival or existence. NYC and Miami have more Jews than Jerusalem, but there is no problem there because the normal rules of civilization apply to everyone - if a Jewish person wants to move next door or buy my house, OK ... but if he tries to drive me out while waving some scroll and claiming God says it is ok, it would become a real problem.

Israel, on the other hand, continues to expand outside it's legally recognized boundaries, continues to take land and water and other resources, based on some mystical claim that is thousands of years old and rather dubious. Only a fool would try to disconnect the rockets that are launched from Gaza from the past 50 years of violent Jewish activity in Israel and the occupied territories.



Last edited by monty on 27 Jan 2009, 1:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Bea
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27 Jan 2009, 12:59 pm

Ruveyn, the world would be bereft, and grieving, if the Jews all disappeared.

As for the scriptures that say God promised that land to "his very special people,"
I recall something in the scriptures that says "Thou shalt not kill."

From what I have heard and read, the only basis for Israel's claim to that land
(other than the military might that backs up the current occupation) is a religious
belief that the land was promised to the Jews by God. The Palestinians also have
religious beliefs, such as the oddly marked stone that for centuries was believed to
hold the footprint of the prophet Mohammed's daughter Fatima. This stone was
buried beneath tons of rubble by Israeli bulldozers. (Now, was that a neighborly thing to do?)

As I understand it, a Jewish civilization flourished in that area for a short 200 years
a couple of thousand years ago. That civilization was driven out by Christians.
The Christians were replaced by Muslims. The Muslims have continuously occupied
that land now for several hundred years - much longer than the Jewish civilization.
And they have religious beliefs about their homeland, too. Can you tell me why the world
should show more respect to the religious beliefs of the Jews than those of the Palestinians?



Last edited by Bea on 27 Jan 2009, 3:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Bea
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27 Jan 2009, 1:37 pm

The following is from an email I received from a friend. Please watch the "60 Minutes" segment referred to here.
Bea


Quote:
Dear Friends,

Please watch this important segment online of the January 24, 2009 "CBS 60 Minutes" television program about the mistreatment of Palestinian people, including the expansion of Israeli settlements, evictions, humiliating checkpoints, 'Apartheid' roads and wall, and families imprisoned in their own homes:

[url=http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=4752349n]


THEN, please send a thank you to CBS for last night’s “60 Minutes” program that outlined in detail the injustices suffered by the Palestinian people at the hands of the Israelis.

The 13-minute report by journalist Bob Simon showed the damage to the cause of peace caused by the ever-expanding and illegal Israeli settlements, the evictions of Palestinians from their homes, the humiliation they experience at Israeli checkpoints, the “Apartheid” roads and wall built by Israel, and the bizarre experience of Palestinian families imprisoned in their own homes by Israeli soldiers.

Thank CBS and the producers of ’60 Minutes’ for having the courage to show the American people the truth about the injustices that are at the core of the Middle East conflict. This powerful report shows clearly that the only way to resolve the conflict and bring peace and stability to the region is to address the fundamental issues of justice that have been ignored by the world community for far too long.


IMMEDIATE ACTIONS REQUESTED:

1. CONTACT “60 Minutes” - They are getting a lot of “heat” from the vocal minority which support Israel’s brutal and counterproductive actions. It is important that those who value peace with justice in the region make the effort to support balanced media coverage.
Tel: 212-975-2006
Fax: 212-975-2019
E-Mail: [email protected], [email protected]

OR Mail:
60 Minutes
555 West 57th St.
New York, NY 10019

2. COMMENT ONLINE about the segment. (Always be polite and respectful.) Hundreds of people have already made their views known.

3. SHARE this important alert with your colleagues, friends and family. Post to personal blogs.

4. CONTACT YOUR ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES to ask that they view the CBS report



MR_BOGAN
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27 Jan 2009, 4:55 pm

ruveyn wrote:
MR_BOGAN wrote:
Israel shouldn't exist and they know it, legally and morally they have not got a leg to stand on. That is why they are oppressing the people they stole the land from into submission. Which in turn is where the hatred comes from. :roll:

When Jesus does come back like you think, it will be a good idea not to tell him about the 4 million Palestinian refugees. Best just to say something else and avoid that one. :wink:


What you are saying in effect is that Jews shouldn't exist. Why aren't we extinct? Why are we still around bothering people like you? Why don't we just disappear? Right?


No I'm not saying Jews shouldn't exist.

My problem with Israel is that they have taken someone elses land(still taking their land with settlements :roll: ) to make their state.

Over 4 million Palestinians live in refugee camps and living in 22% of the remaining land they used to live in.

The whole thing is completely unfair.

Don't get dismissive of me either, I'm not Jewish or Arab, I don't have any reason for supporting one side over the other, I'm completely netrual. This is how I see it.

ruveyn wrote:
By the way if there is anything to the Scriptures (I doubt it) Jesus will remember that He promised the Land to His very special and treasured people.

And for Christ's sake stop blaming Israel and the Jews for 9/11. It was done by Muslims whose extreme form of their religion drove them crazy.

ruveyn


I'm not relgious so I don't read any scriptures. Ragtime believes that once the jews are returned to Israel jesus will return. I'm pretty sure that is what he believes from a post he did ages ago.

I have never blamed Israel and the Jews for 9/11.