Moderators are losing credibility

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leejosepho
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23 Feb 2011, 1:20 pm

TOGGI3 wrote:

You can rest a fair deal of that blame on me. I have to clarify, we hold no grudges against lee. but I (and alex and others) feel some of his vocal opinions are counter to the core ethics of wrongplanet, I wont get into details of how and where. Otherwise lee was great.

we all put a lot of hard work into this site. I have not put nearly as much work in as those before me and those current, and I respect their efforts. We aren't keeping score of who has had it the hardest however. We just want people to enjoy the site.

I hope you dont stay too mad at us, leejosepho.

Here is what I had sent to Alex:

leejosepho wrote:

Not a problem. Just turn off my buttons and that will be the end of that, my fellow and friend.

Joseph Lee

alex wrote:

I'm thinking it would be better if you resigned as a moderator. I am sorry to ask this of you.

For a guy like me, I consider it a privilege to have been invited, able and allowed to serve for whatever length of time.

Peace!

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League_Girl
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23 Feb 2011, 1:46 pm

Jono wrote:

leejosepho wrote:

Edit: Alex has just asked me to resign, and I have told him to just turn off my buttons ... but I am quite sure the WP mods will in some way respond to any question posted to them either here or anywhere.

Well, that's a pity. I think you would of been a good mod if you just got some more experience.

I agree there. Sorry that happened. I think you went overboard with the power but you are still a nice guy.

leejosepho
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23 Feb 2011, 2:03 pm

League_Girl wrote:

I agree there. Sorry that happened. I think you went overboard with the power but you are still a nice guy.

I thank you, and please know my use of mod power was actually very minimal. I only ever gave out one actual warning, as I recall, and only once on my very first day did I ever not defer to the majority opinion behind the curtain.

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Quatermass
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23 Feb 2011, 6:53 pm

Great, so that's, what, only two actual active moderators?

There should be a minimum of three active moderators. Preferably in different time zones.

The membership doesn't seem to fully appreciate how much consideration went into the vast majority of moderating decisions. Personal biases and preconceptions had to be pushed aside. No decision to ban, unless it was of an out-and-out scammer or spammer or a sock-puppet, was ever undertaken lightly. Restraint was shown even if, occasionally on my part, diplomacy wasn't. Pressures from above and below were felt. So before anyone accuses the moderators of abuse of power and such, just think seriously about what it is like to be a moderator, and not what some of you seem to think being a moderator is like. It's more like garbageman than policeman.

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leejosepho
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23 Feb 2011, 6:55 pm

Quatermass wrote:

Great, so that's, what, only two actual active moderators?

The last time I was behind the curtain, there was evidence of "Tink" also helping out.

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MidlifeAspie
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23 Feb 2011, 6:57 pm

Thank you QM

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leejosepho
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24 Feb 2011, 3:52 am

Quatermass wrote:

There should be a minimum of three active moderators. Preferably in different time zones.

One thing surprised me a bit while just watching from behind the curtain: membership self-moderation. Where mods are the only ones who actually have the sanitary wipes, there are still many others out here being sure sticky/slippery spots on the floor are marked with safety cones.

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Dox47
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24 Feb 2011, 4:09 am

I'm (gasp!) in agreement with QM, there really need to be more mods working on a forum this size. I completely recognize the difficulty in selecting appropriate candidates and trying to enforce certain standards of action, but with 5 digit membership it would seem that there should be a few good choices out there. Personally I think 1000/1 should be a minimum staffing level, perhaps grown gradually over a period of months and then maintained as the site grows. At the least that would provide a better cushion for when moderators retire, and would also make it much more likely that a mod was always available to help members with their concerns. I'm not sure how many active members WP actually has, but at the small end I think 10 mods would be a good start; or maybe start making them somewhat forum specific so that they're familiar with the people they'll be working with?

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Quatermass
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24 Feb 2011, 4:33 am

Dox47 wrote:

Three is a good absolute minimum, providing that the moderators are on for enough hours, or at least drop in to WP enough times per day. Dox47, I doubt that there are more than a few thousand active members at any one time. Ten...I reckon would lead to a 'too many cooks' situation. Five or six would be just right. This is my opinion, mind, and borne out by experience.

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Dox47
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24 Feb 2011, 4:45 am

Quatermass wrote:

I can respect your experience in the matter, 4 always seemed like too few but for as long as I've been here that's been the standard. I know the actual number of users has been under debate before, so I was using 10k as a sort of baseline; sounds like you think even that's pretty high. Even 6 active mods would be a real improvement IMHO, having a good mix of ages, locations, opinions and temperaments on the mod team just feels like it would work better meet the needs of the forum.

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leejosepho
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24 Feb 2011, 4:49 am

Quatermass wrote:

Three is a good absolute minimum, providing that the moderators are on for enough hours, or at least drop in to WP enough times per day.

We all agree ... and now for those who have never been behind the curtain:

"... providing that the moderators are on for enough hours, or at least drop in to WP enough times per day."

As I am sure Quatermass would agree: Nothing ever can or even should be demanded of any WP moderator. Mods do their work as a "labor of love", voluntarily, gaining nothing more than a bit of personal satisfaction for serving the rest of us and getting an occasional kudo in return. And since we WP members have no ability to tell Alex what he needs to do or how he should do that and make it stick anyway, our only remaining option is to "join sides" with our WP mods and help police ourselves.

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superboyian
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24 Feb 2011, 9:15 am

It would make so much sense if one of the active members who has a very good reputation to become a moderator in nature and out.

Although the scariest thing is, what would that mod be like?

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leejosepho
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24 Feb 2011, 9:25 am

superboyian wrote:

It would make so much sense if one of the active members who has a very good reputation to become a moderator in nature and out.

Although the scariest thing is, what would that mod be like?

I can only guess here, but I suspect many already-qualified members here are leery of the mod job because of how so many previous "mod retirements" have come about ... and that is why I suggest we all do well at policing ourselves a bit more to help lower the pressure on any and all mods so they can do their stuff in relative peace with having to wonder when the next "big blow" might come through. The recent one was/is a good example of over-aggressive action in PPR drawing an otherwise-friendly crowd.

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superboyian
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24 Feb 2011, 9:41 am

leejosepho wrote:

superboyian wrote:

It would make so much sense if one of the active members who has a very good reputation to become a moderator in nature and out.

Although the scariest thing is, what would that mod be like?

But some may have troubles policing for themselves and it is well known that the PPR is known for tons of conflicts and disagreements (hence why I don't bother post in there), a huge blow will then happen and it's mostly with sexuality and religion wise unfortunately.

So I'm not too sure how that would work tbh.

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sartresue
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24 Feb 2011, 10:01 am

superboyian wrote:

leejosepho wrote:

superboyian wrote:

It would make so much sense if one of the active members who has a very good reputation to become a moderator in nature and out.

Although the scariest thing is, what would that mod be like?

My PPR rules topic

1 Think before you post. You could be banned. I made only one mistake, three years ago (not in PPR), and was warned. My lighthearted alliterations got out of hand and I offended a mod.

It was very thoughtless, not intentionally cruel, and I apologized via PM.

2 Respect other posters.

3 Know your audience. I have been here long enough to Understand Orwell, kxmode, Visagrunt, Dox, Ska, AG, Inuyasha, Iamnotaparakeet, etc. Know who is Right, Left, and Centre. Do not get sucked into dumb arguments.

4 The Mods are there to help. I have encountered some really nasty forum trolls here (who no longer post) and I complained to the mods, and said trolls were sent packing. There is a difference between disseminating hate and disagreement. Know this, as it is the beginning of wisdom.

5 Develop a sense of humour. But remember your audience. :wink:

The above are rules I keep in mind as I peruse PPR. They work.

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leejosepho
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24 Feb 2011, 10:02 am

superboyian wrote:

Sure ... and I am making these kinds of posts as what TallyMan -- I can be a name-dropper! -- might have called "propaganda"! Really.

See, here is the deal:

There will likely never be too many mods here, and there may never be whatever "perfect number of mods" to match whatever need might be present at any given moment. So, let us turn that around ...

The better we do amongst ourselves here, the less it matters as mods come or go or take vacations or take their children to the circus or whatever else mods do when they are not doing what they do here. In the idealized world of WP ... why, mods might not even be needed at all!

That is not ever going to happen, of course, but at least everyone here should have an opportunity to "be a 'mod' for a day" even if only in relation to oneself.

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