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Mitrovah
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07 Jun 2014, 4:22 pm

So I am going to community college to become a network and systems administrator, I worked odd jobs and I am tired of being paid dirt without being respected.

Do people who work in IT get respect for what they do? I understand that at some companies you may have really stupid people who expect too much from technology but I am willing to deal with that since that is true about almost anything else.

I realize being a system and network admin may require odd hours but could I avoid that by working for a company where the hours are strictly from 9am to 5pm instead of places like a hospital that are open 24 hrs. I really like having free time during the night to do whatever.



Meistersinger
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07 Jun 2014, 6:41 pm

Mitrovah wrote:
So I am going to community college to become a network and systems administrator, I worked odd jobs and I am tired of being paid dirt without being respected.

Do people who work in IT get respect for what they do? I understand that at some companies you may have really stupid people who expect too much from technology but I am willing to deal with that since that is true about almost anything else.

I realize being a system and network admin may require odd hours but could I avoid that by working for a company where the hours are strictly from 9am to 5pm instead of places like a hospital that are open 24 hrs. I really like having free time during the night to do whatever.


Believe me when I tell you that IT departments anywhere get little or no respect. I've been in IT, in one form or another, since 1986. The attitude with most executives is that sales is the biggest money maker, while IT is a money pit. You will be continually second-guessed by managers whose knowledge of anything wouldn't even fit on the head of a pin. The comic strip Dilbert describes what goes on in most companies. Scott Adams, Dilbert's creator, is an IT pro, and has been through the wringer. A lot of times, you might be better off being the infamous Bastard Operator From Hell in order to get anything done. Google BOFH and read some of those stories, and you'll quickly realize how little respect IT gets within an organization.



Mitrovah
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07 Jun 2014, 7:11 pm

Great my last avenue as a career option is just a different level of hell then? What if I'm not with a company that does sales, or like a library, I would be willing to work at a hospital and endure odd hours as the system admin if that happnened only once and a while



Meistersinger
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07 Jun 2014, 7:56 pm

Mitrovah wrote:
Great my last avenue as a career option is just a different level of hell then? What if I'm not with a company that does sales, or like a library, I would be willing to work at a hospital and endure odd hours as the system admin if that happnened only once and a while


Most hospitals and libraries are run by government entities, which means the stress level is even worse. When you're dealing with any level of government, you serve at the pleasure of the elected officials, most of who are even less of a pinhead than the Pointy-Haired Boss in Dilbert. Like I said in a different thread regarding educators:

Those who can, do.
Those who can't, teach.
Those who can't teach, teach phys. Ed.
Those who can't teach phys. Ed., end up in school administration.
The who can't run a school, end up in politics.



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08 Jun 2014, 11:09 pm

Meistersinger wrote:
Mitrovah wrote:
Great my last avenue as a career option is just a different level of hell then? What if I'm not with a company that does sales, or like a library, I would be willing to work at a hospital and endure odd hours as the system admin if that happnened only once and a while


Most hospitals and libraries are run by government entities, which means the stress level is even worse. When you're dealing with any level of government, you serve at the pleasure of the elected officials, most of who are even less of a pinhead than the Pointy-Haired Boss in Dilbert. Like I said in a different thread regarding educators:

Those who can, do.
Those who can't, teach.
Those who can't teach, teach phys. Ed.
Those who can't teach phys. Ed., end up in school administration.
The who can't run a school, end up in politics.


Dunno, I've worked in a hospital and a financial services company. I think the hospital was a heck of a lot less stress, as things change a lot more slowly and the front line caregivers bear the brunt of the stress.



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19 Jun 2014, 12:33 pm

I think it depends where you work. I feel like I get respect where I work, although it is true that our department is somewhat under-funded because we are not a "revenue-generating unit". It is also true that higher-ups sometimes make technology decisions without consulting us when they don't even understand the issues. Those are negatives, but not deal-breakers. I do feel that my work is appreciated by my fellow employees however. That is one thing I really enjoy about my job- I fix problems for people and make their lives easier, and they appreciate it. I think it's better at smaller companies, where employees get to know each other. If you work in a big anonymous company, you are probably less likely to get respect.


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BlankReg
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19 Jun 2014, 1:12 pm

II have worked for some of the Forbes "top 100 companies to work for," and had a nightmarish time. I've worked for companies that I know sucked rocks, and had a great time. What really matters, IMO, are three things in this order: 1 - your immediate co-workers; 2 - your immediate supervisor/manager; and 3 - your manager/supervisor's supervisor.

That's it. If your immediate superiors up two levels and your co-workers all feel like they're in the same boat with you and handle issues cooperatively and with a sense of humor, almost any job can be rewarding and enjoyable to go to. If any of those elements are missing, it easily falls apart. Of course there are other issues like turnover. I was hired by a manager who definitely "got" me (even when I sometimes didn't), but then he was immediately replaced by someone who was a complete and total a**hole to me. To this day I still refer to him as "weasel boy."

So looks for the three things and relative stability in IT personnel. There are no guarantees, but that will give you the best chance.



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20 Jun 2014, 8:44 am

BlankReg wrote:
II have worked for some of the Forbes "top 100 companies to work for," and had a nightmarish time. I've worked for companies that I know sucked rocks, and had a great time. What really matters, IMO, are three things in this order: 1 - your immediate co-workers; 2 - your immediate supervisor/manager; and 3 - your manager/supervisor's supervisor.


I absolutely agree with this.


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Tori0326
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25 Jun 2014, 6:21 pm

I'm a database developer for some pretty ambitious projects that our CEO has cooked up. I have a very hard time getting any useful information out of anybody above me on the chain of command.
All I get is generalities and vague concepts and they expect me to build databases around that because they have no concept of what I do or how important my role is in the scheme of things. Out of the soon to be 5 of us crammed into our little IT department I'm quite certain I am the least paid and the hardest to replace.
The CEO and VP actually drove 6 hours to Atlanta to recruit this latest "IT Director" who really has no clue about anything but can convince management she does because they're clueless. So she gets the big check and to be buddy-buddy with upper management and us underlings get to do the real work and to be treated like children who need supervision.
Maybe I'm supposed to step up and get on the BS train with her and the other managers in order to get anywhere (I'm actually the only one out of all of them, including the CEO, who actually has a Business Management degree) but that's not me. I tell the truth and I don't flap my jaws 24/7. It probably is my Aspergers because I they sound like they're all just talking jibberish to me. I've been getting headaches almost every day since she's started with the company 2 weeks ago.



Mitrovah
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25 Jun 2014, 7:28 pm

Tori0326 wrote:
I'm a database developer for some pretty ambitious projects that our CEO has cooked up. I have a very hard time getting any useful information out of anybody above me on the chain of command.
All I get is generalities and vague concepts and they expect me to build databases around that because they have no concept of what I do or how important my role is in the scheme of things. Out of the soon to be 5 of us crammed into our little IT department I'm quite certain I am the least paid and the hardest to replace.
The CEO and VP actually drove 6 hours to Atlanta to recruit this latest "IT Director" who really has no clue about anything but can convince management she does because they're clueless. So she gets the big check and to be buddy-buddy with upper management and us underlings get to do the real work and to be treated like children who need supervision.
Maybe I'm supposed to step up and get on the BS train with her and the other managers in order to get anywhere (I'm actually the only one out of all of them, including the CEO, who actually has a Business Management degree) but that's not me. I tell the truth and I don't flap my jaws 24/7. It probably is my Aspergers because I they sound like they're all just talking jibberish to me. I've been getting headaches almost every day since she's started with the company 2 weeks ago.


Do you think you could sabotage her without getting fired? Actually do not deliver because she is liar who doesn't know anything and make a point of saying I will be difficult to replace?



Tori0326
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26 Jun 2014, 12:34 am

Mitrovah wrote:
Tori0326 wrote:
I'm a database developer for some pretty ambitious projects that our CEO has cooked up. I have a very hard time getting any useful information out of anybody above me on the chain of command.
All I get is generalities and vague concepts and they expect me to build databases around that because they have no concept of what I do or how important my role is in the scheme of things. Out of the soon to be 5 of us crammed into our little IT department I'm quite certain I am the least paid and the hardest to replace.
The CEO and VP actually drove 6 hours to Atlanta to recruit this latest "IT Director" who really has no clue about anything but can convince management she does because they're clueless. So she gets the big check and to be buddy-buddy with upper management and us underlings get to do the real work and to be treated like children who need supervision.
Maybe I'm supposed to step up and get on the BS train with her and the other managers in order to get anywhere (I'm actually the only one out of all of them, including the CEO, who actually has a Business Management degree) but that's not me. I tell the truth and I don't flap my jaws 24/7. It probably is my Aspergers because I they sound like they're all just talking jibberish to me. I've been getting headaches almost every day since she's started with the company 2 weeks ago.


Do you think you could sabotage her without getting fired? Actually do not deliver because she is liar who doesn't know anything and make a point of saying I will be difficult to replace?


I have a feeling she will sabotage herself. Won't take long until all those promises she's making won't be getting delivered. The things she promised today alone will set us back months.
I've semi gone off on her a few times already, I'm sure it won't take much more for me to really go off on her including pointing out the fact that I've been out in the working world since she was in diapers. I hope we can ride this out to witness her exodus but I may not have that kind of patience.



beer1982
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26 Jun 2014, 7:15 am

Hi
I cannot talk for all people within IT since it is so broad. I am working as a programmer in a research institute in denmark and people are looking up to me for my work.Some of the post docs have pleage that I should not leave my job because they are so much depended on my work. That makes me happy.

I think that if you are working with humans as a support units then it might have another view.



Mitrovah
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30 Jun 2014, 5:19 pm

beer1982 wrote:
Hi
I cannot talk for all people within IT since it is so broad. I am working as a programmer in a research institute in denmark and people are looking up to me for my work.Some of the post docs have pleage that I should not leave my job because they are so much depended on my work. That makes me happy.

I think that if you are working with humans as a support units then it might have another view.


This kind of blows, I don't really think I have the talent to be a programmer but I think I can definitely work as the network administrator and I don't mind being the support role but I am sort of getting tired of dealing with unreasonable or impossible requests from people. The other threads have made the me think this is not a good idea but its the only thing I believe I could do well.
I really have to make sure I pick the right company to work for, definitely avoid any company that is involved with sales like a telemarketing firm.

Maybe a hospital, university, a public radio network I think be the three best places to be or a company where the database does not absolutely have to be available at 3 am in the morning like in telemarketing.



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16 Jul 2014, 9:25 pm

Mitrovah wrote:
So I am going to community college to become a network and systems administrator, I worked odd jobs and I am tired of being paid dirt without being respected.

Do people who work in IT get respect for what they do? I understand that at some companies you may have really stupid people who expect too much from technology but I am willing to deal with that since that is true about almost anything else.

I realize being a system and network admin may require odd hours but could I avoid that by working for a company where the hours are strictly from 9am to 5pm instead of places like a hospital that are open 24 hrs. I really like having free time during the night to do whatever.


I've been in IT for well over 10 years and believe me when I tell you, you will be treated like the bottom of the barrel. IT professionals are often the first to be laid off, downsized, or what have you. If you still want to go towards IT, be a software engineer or programmer. Don't do systems administration or engineering. Software engineers are generally given more respect.



Mitrovah
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16 Jul 2014, 9:50 pm

mattschwartz01 wrote:
I've been in IT for well over 10 years and believe me when I tell you, you will be treated like the bottom of the barrel. IT professionals are often the first to be laid off, downsized, or what have you. If you still want to go towards IT, be a software engineer or programmer. Don't do systems administration or engineering. Software engineers are generally given more respect.


What if I can't do programming of any sort? I never really tried it but I don't think I am really cut out for coding. I have the worst time finding materials in a library, so I am not sure If I can code if I can't even follow the dewey decimal system.

Im not particularly passionate about the idea either, I don't sit in front of a computer or reading books how to code.



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17 Jul 2014, 9:09 am

Mitrovah wrote:
What if I can't do programming of any sort? I never really tried it but I don't think I am really cut out for coding. I have the worst time finding materials in a library, so I am not sure If I can code if I can't even follow the dewey decimal system.

Im not particularly passionate about the idea either, I don't sit in front of a computer or reading books how to code.


I was never particularly drawn to that either... until I realized applications for it in my work. I started programming within AutoCAD, to speed up repetitive drafting tasks. I had to ask other programmers what they did, and got all sorts of ideas from them.

By the time I went to Uni for a CS degree, I had a few years of work experience where I could find some real-world application for the tasks we were doing. I only did vb.net and sql there, but, my interest was there because I knew where I could use it and how much time it would save me.

So, programming just for the sake of programming? Still not there for me. But, programming to make my job easier? I'm all about it.
I just signed up for a javascript class to help (in my job as a system administrator).