Beat Up Today

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DS8 got beat up after school today, for the first time. Two boys who have been bullying him for a while (one of them threatened to beat him with a bat last week) jumped him after school. The school has been aware of the bullying in the past, and the fact that DS has social deficits. He does not have an official diagnosis, and the school won't have him tested for an IEP because he does well on academic tests (he is failing his classwork but acing his tests).
So, as this attack happened after school (less than five minutes after classes ended) but on school grounds, where do I stand in demanding any sort of action? Does the school have any liability in this situation? Is there anything I can do or say about this? I have already left a note for the principal.
I don't feel like the school ever takes me seriously.

If it occurred on School grounds during business hours, I would think they have some liability, but you'd have to ask a lawyer about that.

If you want to claim any kind of protection under the Americans With Disabilities Act (assuming you're in the US), you're going to have to get that diagnosis made official. Academic Performance has nothing to do with High Functioning Autism, that's why it's called "High Functioning."

" . . . beginning to be a problem."

Saying this, even though it's obviously already a problem and has been a problem for some time, is at times almost singularly effective. It's a show of quiet strength. It's like flashing an ace without yet playing it.

Now, that said, it might work and it might not. Actually, it depends on how skilled and quick on the uptake the principal is. But it might be good as an opening gambit.

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Please note, I am not a parent. But I do live life on the Spectrum. And I try and be a good guy and help out where I can.

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And the next step, if the principal is anything less than really on the ball, might be to have a lawyer send a letter on his or her letterhead, " . . . will hold the school responsible any future incidents . . "

A lot of parents verbally state they're going to get a lawyer. But I think an actual letter sent is a rarer thing. And please don't couch it in terms of a threat for that kind of plays into a negative dynamic. If the principal really seems to be trying and the two of you seem to have an okay working relationship, then maybe something like, I'm going to do what I need to protect my son, I'm having a lawyer send a letter, I'm giving you a heads up, out of respect, Please understand that, Yes, out of respect I am giving you a heads up. But I'm doing exactly what you would do to protect your child.

And walk away from a potential fight to an area of more people. This may seem patently obvious. But really, I think this is a skill which needs to be practiced. Maybe because of movies which show a person fleeing to a more deserted area, which is crazy, maybe movies show it for the sake of drama or something.

If the principal is good . . . will give each of the two boys some kind of punishment like in-school suspension and will do it in a way so that the boys do not end up getting viewed as some kind of celebrities. Maybe in talking with the two boys, he or she will say, 'Okay, so maybe he's different. That's fine. It's okay for a person to be different. And for the two of you to start a fight two on one, that's not so cool.' And just let that be there, let them feel that. Assume they will feel bad for it being very unsporting and unfair for the two of them to attack one person. And the whole conversation should best be less than a minute, although they may be waiting in the office significantly longer than that.

And assuming the principal has a pretty good idea who the ringleader is and who the follower is, talk privately to the follower, 'Now, as his friend, when he has a bad idea, it is your job to tell him that it's a bad idea.'

Now, in point of fact, the most serious part seems to be when the one boy threatened to beat him with a bat last week. I mean, Wow! And as two adults talking, we can say, yes, absolutely that's the most serious part. But, you don't want to entrench and magnetize this, and that's where I recommend being very strategic. Getting a matter-of-fact in-school suspension for an actual fight, both boys can accept that. Being punished for something he "merely" said (even though very serious!) might feel unfair and then the situation might continue or escalate.

And I do recommend giving your son the option of marital arts lessons. Now, your son may feel embarrassed. He may feel exurberant that he weathered the storm and had this big league experience. Or, any combination of emotions in between.

I took judo as a boy, which is really more of a sport than a self-defense. Anyway, this is something I've thought about and written about a fair amount.

Ideally, in a fight, you almost prefer a draw, because you don't want to embarrass someone you're likely to see again. Meaning, that almost every karate movie is wrong. And you don't want the kind of friends you'd make by "winning" a fight. And you don't want people to brag on your behalf either.
Tight, defensive boxing to a draw. One week. <-- and okay, sure, the one week might be somewhat optimistic
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp3154051.html&highlight=

A few private boxing lessons over a couple of weeks, you can really learn a lot of blocks. And it does make a difference. And please don't take a bunch of blows to the head during training because all that stuff about post-concussion syndrome, and even cumulative lesser blows, is largely true. And just like football helmets don't really protect, presumably neither does boxing headgear. And if an instructor is not willing to go along on this point, with all the information now known, find another instructor.

Speaking personally, I learn a lot more and a lot faster from private athletic lessons, of almost any type, than from group lessons.

Now, here's the trickery part, you don't want to put this big burden on your son that he 'should' win the fight or have the fight in the first place. It is a feel and texture decision whether to walk away from a fight or to stand up for yourself. He doesn't need to impress a parent.

And fighting someone your own size, you'll win some, you'll lose some. I mean, how could it be different?

And with someone bigger, or two people against you, you'll probably lose the fight. Although skill and practice in blocks can limit the damage.

(I don't know how much of this you can tell the principal, and that's also a tricky part. And it might be an assistant principal who is more directly involved with the kids and is more of a heads-up, can-do type of person.)

Last edited by AardvarkGoodSwimmer on 17 Dec 2013, 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I don't know what kind of liability they could have to protect one kid from another after school. Lots of schools have teachers outside, and parents as well. Were there any adults around to break it up? How bad was he hurt? Did he have to go to the ER?

If you have the other boys parents numbers then I'd definitely call them tonight. If you don't, then go to the school first thing in the morning and demand that they be called or you be given the number. While the school knew that he was being bullied, they honestly can't keep an eye on every student, and that's probably what they will tell you and other students are probably bullied too, so they probably didn't think this would happen, but it did. I really don't know how I'd feel about suing the school if I were you, unless he was hurt pretty bad. A few scrapes and bruises probably wouldn't win a lawsuit and without a dx, even though you have been asking for an IEP they probably are just required to treat it like any other incident.

As much as you are angry at the school, I think you should save some anger for the boys and possibly their parents. They may have raised them right and the boys just did what they wanted to do, but then again, they might not have ever thought to talk to them about going around picking on people and starting fights - that you don't do that and if you do then you are gonna be in a world of trouble when you get home. I'd talk to the boys parents and see what they plan on doing and how they sound. Then go from there.

My youngest son used to get beat up quite a bit at school when he was in elementary school. That's the one that I now suspect may have mild AS, although he's fine socially he's got some issues about things. He's not interested in knowing though. He's also got ADHD that's better now than it used to be but still medicated for it, and completely deaf from birth in his left ear. I do know how you feel. He's said that boys were planning this or that, and it was so often that eventually you just tune it out when it doesn't happen. Then when it does you feel terrible. If this helps at all, he eventually started getting better at defending himself and the last year he was in high school before he dropped out for GED classes, when this one boy punched him in the face in the hall, my son hit him back and broke his jaw. My son didn't get in any trouble either because it was right in front of the office. The two boys are friends now though, at 18. Although for a year or so he was still after him. Now they hang out.

It can pass. It does. It's hard on a parent, and a kid. I'm not saying do nothing or blow it off. I'm just saying wait until you cool down before you do something. Things may look very different to you in the morning. (This is if he's not hurt bad or anything). I'm not saying it's acceptable at all. It's not. He was picked on and that's different than two boys getting into a fight over something one did to the other. He was jumped. Unfair. Very unfair. We live in a small town in rural Alabama. Way out in the country. They treat things differently here, and so that's where my perspective is coming from. I didn't stand up to my first bully until I was 13, so it can take some time. Just make sure he knows that he didn't cause this and that the other boys were in the wrong. That you don't jump somebody like that and that it's the cowards way. Make sure you tell him not to mention to them about the cowards though, that'll just drag this out longer.

Good luck. It really will be ok. I do understand your anger. While the situation wasn't exactly the same, it always sucks when your kid is hurt and it sucks worse when it was unfair and preventable. Especially since you tried to prevent it.

Let us know how it turns out. I'm also very interested in what the parents of those boys have to say too.

I feel really lucky right now. My kids' school's antibullying policy expands past school hours and school grounds. It includes cyberbullying. Everyone and their parents has to sign off on a policy that states bullying is not tolerated. Period. And if it happens anywhere, at any time, the guilty parties will be held accountable.

Anyway, that is beside the point.

I would find a lawyer and have him/her draft a strong letter. I find the fact that the school did not have adults around as kids (8 year olds? My gosh...when have 8 year olds ever been left unattended?) as they dispersed after school deplorable.

And somebody correct me if I am wrong...I do not think they can deny you an assessment once you request it. If you ask for your child to be assessed, I think it is your right to have him assessed...though sometimes I get confused between what is federal- and what is state-guided in situations like this. I find it troubling that they do not find the discrepancy between his in-class performance and his test performance troubling. At this young age, they should be intervening to make sure he has the foundation to be successful later on. When my son was young, I lived somewhere else and we were given the same BS that because he was academically on target there was nothing they could do. I now live somewhere else in the same state and I have been told, basically, that I was duped. That he should have been getting services (based on where he is today) probably from kindergarten on. But because he was my second diagnosed, I didn't understand these things when he was younger.

It sounds like it might be time to turn up the fire under this school's rear end. Bullying effects his educational outcomes. He is being bullied, likely because his peers recognize he is different. It is the school's responsibility to address anything that compromises his ability to access an appropriate education.

Sorry this is happening. I think my heart would break.

I thought that, too. I'm not sure if the school is right or wrong on that issue.




I do, too. Frankly, I don't even think anyone is even paying attention. Happily, we are about to move to a new school (and supposedly much better) school district.


Update - The two boys got suspended. However, another student told my son that one of the boys told him he was going to bring a knife to school and stab DS. So, I'm going to keep DS home on what would have been his last day in this school district, as that's the day the bullies return to class. I can't even believe we have to deal with this level of bullying at DS's young age. He's not even out of elementary school!

The school is wrong. If you were staying, I would advise you to make the request in writing, then ask for the refusal in writing and for your procedural safeguards, then follow the process to appeal. But since you're moving, it's moot. . Ask for an IEP eval, IN WRITING, as soon as your son is registered in the new school.

I'd also report the rumor about the knife to the current school principal.

Second that.

Look-- maybe it was another alphabet soup kid with poor verbal impulse control, and it means nothing. For THAT kid's sake, report it and make it clear that your concern is that the child understand that it's inappropriate. When I was a kid, I used figures of speech like "I'll kill ya" inappropriately-- it was pretty clear, from context, that it meant "I'll be real mad..."

...but in this day and age, using those phrases as an adolescent, never mind an adult, would be enough to land me in some really bad places. So-- assuming the best of the bully, he NEEDS to understand that it's not safe or OK to say stuff like that.

Then again, maybe it's an alphabet soup kid with demanding, pugilistic, borderline abusive parent(s) like my father-in-law. In which case, someone needs to teach the kid not to act like that before PRISON is the only place to keep him.

Then again, maybe he's just a nasty, pugilistic little s**t himself (though I don't think kids go that far if they're not having some kind of other issues-- NT kids might taunt and tease and enjoy causing "FreakGirl" to get in trouble, but I think kids that stoop to beating probably have problems of their own that aren't being addressed). In which case, he needs to find out that there's a nasty, punitive big s**t out there who will f**k his s**t up if he keeps taking it out on weaker kids.

Because that s**t ain't OK.

I agree with BuyerBeware about the other kids.

I also agree with other posters about teaching your kid to fight. Once getting beat up in school starts, it's very hard to get it to stopped. I was there. Mine stopped when I was forced to hit the bully back when I was 13. You don't want this to go on that long.

No, he shouldn't have to learn to fight just to get an education, and not be tormented the whole time he's trying to do it, but things aren't always like they should be. I don't agree with the martial arts thing though because in my experience, someone who only knows martial arts fighting and is only using that, just doesn't stand a chance in a regular fight. Now, if he's some kind of high degree black belt, that's different. But, by the time he's that high up he's learned some regular fighting too.

Can his dad teach him any kind of self defense? That would be good if so.

If he defends himself with fighting at school, yes he will get in trouble. So will the other kid though. I dealt with that with my son for a while. He was in ISD a lot. With the kids he had been fighting with, sometimes who won and sometimes who lost. Eventually though, once you kick the crap out of the bully a few times, you will be left alone.

Let him know that while fighting at school will get him in trouble with the school, you will always support him for defending himself. My husband finally told our son that he would be in trouble at home if he DIDNT fight back. That's when it started getting better for him. My youngest son was always annoying to the other kids and a drama king, and was the youngest son in a big family. He was used to bugging the older kids and getting the consequences from it, mainly when I wasn't looking. He did that kind of stuff to the kids at school too, which was mainly why he got beat up a lot. He's the one I now think has mild AS. He's got ADHD and is deaf in one ear from birth too.

I'd also really let the school know about the knife threat so that they can just nip that right in the bud.

Also, have you talked to the other parents and if so, what did they say?