Did Jesus or His followers start a new religion?

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Ragtime
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09 Apr 2012, 5:35 pm

mushroo wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

mushroo wrote:

I'm off to celebrate Good Friday; God bless!

Ooooo, you are so... so... weird.

I should have said "observe" and not "celebrate."

No, I meant you asking me not to call you Jewish. Why would I?

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Kraichgauer
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09 Apr 2012, 6:34 pm

How the hell young is this thread? I ask, because it's spread like wildfire!

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Joker
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09 Apr 2012, 6:36 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

How the hell young is this thread? I ask, because it's spread like wildfire!

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Ragtime
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09 Apr 2012, 7:45 pm

Joker wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

How the hell young is this thread? I ask, because it's spread like wildfire!

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

I even let it start to die, too! No one responded for about a day, and I thought it was done, but then someone did. I decided I wasn't going to "bump" the thread -- that if it dies, it dies. But it didn't.

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Christianity is different than Judaism only in people's minds -- not in the Bible.

Ragtime
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09 Apr 2012, 7:48 pm

Guybrush_Threepwood wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

My theologian friend just showed me a couple days ago that, from the words on the sign over Jesus' head on the cross can be taken this acronym: YHVH, which is God's name. "Yeshua haNazarei v'melech haYehudim" (Yeshua, king of the Jews).

I always wondered what that was...thank you

I ceased debating religion when a friend of mine became quite angry when I suggested that the Koran had been written by Mohammed (pbuh). Islam was in fact just a continuance of the religious beliefs held by Arabs since Abraham's time. I have since discovered that this is a falsehood perpetuated by some, yet easily proven false. Strange that it came from a christian, but religion has a strange effect on some. As long as religion can be twisted for the benefit of the few and the suffering of the many, I'll have no part in it...

And Allah can be clearly shown to have originated from a pantheon of pre-Islamic deities. He was the moon god. This Muslims deny furiously.

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Ragtime
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09 Apr 2012, 7:49 pm

Grebels wrote:

Hi Ragtime, Corinthians certainly, but also Paul speaking at Mars Hill. I don't think he was just buttering them up by agreeing up to a certain point. Now here's a fact half of Romans 6 is it, is almost identical to some writing of the Stoic Senneca. I also think some of Paul's writing is Stoic in tone. How is it that John refers to Jesus as the Logos? Was that influence from Philo? At least we know that part of Israel ay the time was Hellenistic.

I asked my theologian friend about your claims, and he shed some interesting light on the matters addressed:

Quote:

While there is some similarity with the idea of Logos in Greek Philosophy, the big difference between the Philo/Hellenistic use and John's use of the logos concept is that Philo uses it in the sense that the Logos was the Demiurge or first created vehicle by which God created the rest of the universe, whereas John is using it to show the Logos was and is God the Son who was with God the Father from eternity past and created with Him and is not created Himself since He is the eternal Creator (John 1:1-4), much in keeping with the Hebraic concept of the Memra, Dabar, or personified wisdom of God as revealed in Proverbs 8:22-31. John's Logos is the eternal God in the person of the preexistent Son who then became flesh at the incarnation--far different from the Philonic or Greek idea of the logos.

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Christianity is different than Judaism only in people's minds -- not in the Bible.

Last edited by Ragtime on 09 Apr 2012, 7:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Joker
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09 Apr 2012, 7:49 pm

Ragtime wrote:

Guybrush_Threepwood wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

I always wondered what that was...thank you

And Allah can be clearly shown to have originated from a pantheon of pre-Islamic deities. He was the moon god. This Muslims deny furiously.

Allah is another name for God who has many I some times call him El La his Aramaic name.

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09 Apr 2012, 7:51 pm

Ragtime wrote:

Guybrush_Threepwood wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

I always wondered what that was...thank you

And Allah can be clearly shown to have originated from a pantheon of pre-Islamic deities. He was the moon god. This Muslims deny furiously.

Almost all gods originate from earlier gods

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You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do

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09 Apr 2012, 7:53 pm

Not in native american religions they do not.

Kraichgauer
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09 Apr 2012, 10:33 pm

Joker wrote:

Not in native american religions they do not.

Well, perhaps the later Native American religions had been based on earlier forms, that have since been lost to prehistory.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

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09 Apr 2012, 10:33 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

Joker wrote:

Not in native american religions they do not.

Well, perhaps the later Native American religions had been based on earlier forms, that have since been lost to prehistory.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Exactly. They certainly did not come into existence spontaneously

Joker
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09 Apr 2012, 10:50 pm

Vigilans wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

Joker wrote:

Not in native american religions they do not.

Well, perhaps the later Native American religions had been based on earlier forms, that have since been lost to prehistory.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Exactly. They certainly did not come into existence spontaneously

At the time the Cherokee people worship the land they lived on and called it the great giver and they worship the moon and the sun.

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09 Apr 2012, 10:58 pm

Joker wrote:

Vigilans wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

Joker wrote:

Not in native american religions they do not.

Well, perhaps the later Native American religions had been based on earlier forms, that have since been lost to prehistory.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Exactly. They certainly did not come into existence spontaneously

At the time the Cherokee people worship the land they lived on and called it the great giver and they worship the moon and the sun.

That is probably the archetype of a proto-religion

Joker
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09 Apr 2012, 11:04 pm

Vigilans wrote:

Joker wrote:

Vigilans wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

Joker wrote:

Not in native american religions they do not.

Well, perhaps the later Native American religions had been based on earlier forms, that have since been lost to prehistory.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Exactly. They certainly did not come into existence spontaneously

At the time the Cherokee people worship the land they lived on and called it the great giver and they worship the moon and the sun.

That is probably the archetype of a proto-religion

It was something very common of the Indians to worship the Buffalo and the land they lived on the mountians to it was a very peacful one and the Cherokee where the most peaceful native americans.

ruveyn
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10 Apr 2012, 12:16 pm

Sylkat wrote:

Any teaching outside of the Bible cannot accurately be categorized as 'Christian' if that teaching contradicts Jesus' words. Anti-semitism taught/encouraged by any church or any spokesperson contradicts Jesus' love for His people. He came TO the Jews, He loved the Jews, He died FOR the Jews, and He loved them and all of us.
:

Joshua bar Yosef WAS a Jew. Properly circumcised on the 8 th day of his life. He attended the synagogues and the Temple (which still stood in his time). Joshua bar Yosef spoke Aramaic on a daily basis and Hebrew when praying. He probably never ate pork although he made some non-Kosher friends.

Joshua bar Yosef unfortunately is portrayed in art work as a Gentile by later European artists who could not bear the thought of a Jewish looking Jesus.

ruveyn

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10 Apr 2012, 1:11 pm

Jesus started a new religion.

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