VEEP Debate--Who Won?

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Hillary should tighten her security. She could be the next Ferdinand.

It's not "the trials of pregnancy," reproductive ability is something that is a part of women even when not pregnant (menstruation, mood swings, etc.)
For me being genetically human is not as important as being a "person," that is, self-awareness.

Sorry though I guess I did think of what you just described as factors related to pregnancy.

Correct me if I am wrong describing this, so what you are saying is that in your eyes being a fetus is different from being a full person?

Yes, that is exactly what I am saying.

I wonder if dude has ever cracked a chicken egg open that had been fertilised, that have that little spot of blood-coloured tissue in them--is that a chicken? Does it look anything like a chicken? Do you think it felt any pain when you cracked it's egg open and "killed" it?

A fetus (which is a clump of cells without consciousness) is not a person, just like a fertilised chicken egg is not a chicken.

Their is a difference you see though a chicken egg is just part of an animal. A fetus can be said to be a human in early development that later on will come to make people like you and me. If you think that a fetus is not human then obviously you must feel that a point in time you yourself were beneath any kind of consideration. Their is an ongoing debate over whether the fetus can feel pain during an abortion with some saying that the nerves making a baby able to detect pain are active after 20 weeks.

You know fetuses are in eggs too right? They're just internal.

A chicken egg is no more "just part of an animal" than a human fetus inside a woman is. Yes, it is true at one point I was a clump of cells--how is this relevant? Are you next going to ask me the pointless hypothetical "what if you were aborted when your mom was pregnant with you--wouldn't you be against abortion then?" Because I would never have had the chance to be aware of my existence if my mother had aborted me when I was just a clump of cells so I would have no opinion about being aborted one way or the other because I would not be able to consider anything as a clump of cells. I hope that's not where you're taking this argument, because it really is the most ridiculously moot hypothetical situation. I have a relative who had an abortion and then later went on to have a healthy child. I don't think she made the wrong decision to have that abortion before going on to have her daughter later on and neither does she--she was not ready to be a parent until she was, and when she was ready she did so. I don't think the child that might have resulted from that pregnancy would hold it against her for not bringing him/her into the world because that child is entirely hypothetical. It was a clump of cells that never became a person, so he/she had no feelings or opinions about the situation.

BTW 20 weeks is rather late, I think in most places 5 months (which is what, 22 weeks I think?) is around their limit of when they will perform a voluntary abortion unless there is some kind of health complication for the mother or the discovery of a fatal disease in the fetus in later gestation.

All this information is available out there though, if you want to get yourself informed (though I would recommend getting informed from sources other than right-wing crazy pants "I got my fake degree on the internet" fake experts and try asking maybe an actual doctor/scientist or reading respected medical and science journals instead of random sites written by whoever on the internet that just satisfy your confirmation bias.

Ah abortion, our favourite topic Wilburforce.

Right-wing crazy pants. I imagine I am part of that grouping. We had two good threads on abortion some months ago in which I participated. I think I did fairly well for the anti-abortion side (cleverly renamed anti-women by the pro-abortion side).

I hope you enjoyed them, because they are the last discussions I will have with you on the topic.

I'm curious now.

Just asking but Wilburforce how do you feel when you have these kinds of online debates?

I am fraught and hysterical, I weep for hours and tear my hair and clothes and keen and scream into the void. I can barely type these soul-destroying responses, my fingers tremble so with trauma and suffering. I am totally emotionally destroyed by discussions of abortion, income tax, jewellery made of amber, and/or the life cycle of the common house fly. I am amazed that participating in this thread has not yet prompted me to suicide, I am that psychologically and emotionally disturbed by such discussions. I am a wreck and I may never recover. I am perpetually triggered henceforth.

Honestly?

^^^of course not.

Totally, man. Totally. I'm a flippin' mess over here.

Okay so I knew it was sarcasm I was just wondering.