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Donald Trump is not a Bigot or Racist..

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Shahunshah
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07 Jan 2017, 7:56 pm

wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
When men (or women, because women contribute to it too) are being sexist towards me, when they say or do something sexist to me that makes my life harder and more stressful, I don't really care if they actively hate women or not--I only care that they are being sexist to me and making my life harder. Their intentions don't matter to me, the impact of their actions on me is what matters to me. You can not actively hate women and still contribute to sexism and making women's lives harder.

If you're bullying me because you hate me or bullying me because you think it's amusing, either way you are bullying me and I want it to stop. One's intentions matter less than the consequences of one's actions. This is a reality that everyone has to deal with if they are not a sociopath completely lacking empathy: whatever your intentions, your actions towards others have consequences, and dealing with and being responsible for those consequences is called being an adult.
No one denying Trump's idiocy. But sexist is a strong word to through towards someone. I think all of your grievances are legitimate and I certainly don't like Trump.

But the thing I think intent defines a person's thinking not actions. Intentions define what the person ultimately wants to do. Actions are just the result of it.

I personally like it that people like you are not afraid to bash Trump. I think we need people like you to show that those kinds of behaviours are bad.


My point is that even if you don't believe sexist things, if you behave in a sexist way towards people then you might as well have those beliefs because the end result is the same for the people whom you behave in a sexist way towards. I don't understand why this is difficult to grasp.

Say you are a manager and you make your workplace toxic by making racist jokes all the time--maybe you don't actually believe your race is superior to others, you just find racist jokes funny because they are taboo. If you have people of other races in your workplace, they are going to experience more stress and less productivity because of the racist jokes, even though you don't actually think you are better than them. They are still going to feel unwelcome in the workplace, and possibly afraid of their coworkers who laugh along with the racist jokes. The result (toxic environment) is the same for other people whatever your intentions are when your behaviour is racist.

Intention matters very little in regards to actions and their impact on others. This is something you need to grasp when you go out in the world and you interact with others--your intentions might matter a lot to you, but they don't matter much to everyone else, it's your behaviour and its consequences that matter and that is how life works.
I agree with most of what you say. But I just don't think we should throw around the word racist lightly. Its like saying someone is a terrible person when in actual fact they may just be careless.

That's why we need people like you to point out these things. But if we use racist as a word to throw around to those people we risk mislabelling and condemning those who just lacked a bit of self awareness.


People react to the word that way not because it's not an accurate description of their behaviour, but because they have an irrational fear of the word itself. That's not a legitimate reason to stop using it to identify racist/sexist behaviour. Like, many guys (about a third) will admit to using force to make a woman have sex with them, but they will not admit to it if the word "rape" is used in the question. This does not change the nature of what they did (forcing someone to have sex with you is rape), it just means they can't handle an accurate label of their behaviour because they don't want to accept the truth about themselves--that they are rapists. If you've raped, you're a rapist. Accurate language is important, even when it makes people uncomfortable. If you don't want to be called a racist, don't act like a racist and you won't have to worry about people calling you that. Being afraid of the word itself is irrational and avoiding labelling behaviour accurately to spare irrational feelings helps no one.


Rape is different. Rape is horrible crime that takes a lack of emotional empathy to do.

Unintentionally undermining someone by racist jokes is different. It is nowhere as damaging and people often say them not with a desire to undermine others but rather when they don't understand the impact of their actions and to get approval for telling something funny.



wilburforce
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07 Jan 2017, 8:03 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
When men (or women, because women contribute to it too) are being sexist towards me, when they say or do something sexist to me that makes my life harder and more stressful, I don't really care if they actively hate women or not--I only care that they are being sexist to me and making my life harder. Their intentions don't matter to me, the impact of their actions on me is what matters to me. You can not actively hate women and still contribute to sexism and making women's lives harder.

If you're bullying me because you hate me or bullying me because you think it's amusing, either way you are bullying me and I want it to stop. One's intentions matter less than the consequences of one's actions. This is a reality that everyone has to deal with if they are not a sociopath completely lacking empathy: whatever your intentions, your actions towards others have consequences, and dealing with and being responsible for those consequences is called being an adult.
No one denying Trump's idiocy. But sexist is a strong word to through towards someone. I think all of your grievances are legitimate and I certainly don't like Trump.

But the thing I think intent defines a person's thinking not actions. Intentions define what the person ultimately wants to do. Actions are just the result of it.

I personally like it that people like you are not afraid to bash Trump. I think we need people like you to show that those kinds of behaviours are bad.


My point is that even if you don't believe sexist things, if you behave in a sexist way towards people then you might as well have those beliefs because the end result is the same for the people whom you behave in a sexist way towards. I don't understand why this is difficult to grasp.

Say you are a manager and you make your workplace toxic by making racist jokes all the time--maybe you don't actually believe your race is superior to others, you just find racist jokes funny because they are taboo. If you have people of other races in your workplace, they are going to experience more stress and less productivity because of the racist jokes, even though you don't actually think you are better than them. They are still going to feel unwelcome in the workplace, and possibly afraid of their coworkers who laugh along with the racist jokes. The result (toxic environment) is the same for other people whatever your intentions are when your behaviour is racist.

Intention matters very little in regards to actions and their impact on others. This is something you need to grasp when you go out in the world and you interact with others--your intentions might matter a lot to you, but they don't matter much to everyone else, it's your behaviour and its consequences that matter and that is how life works.
I agree with most of what you say. But I just don't think we should throw around the word racist lightly. Its like saying someone is a terrible person when in actual fact they may just be careless.

That's why we need people like you to point out these things. But if we use racist as a word to throw around to those people we risk mislabelling and condemning those who just lacked a bit of self awareness.


People react to the word that way not because it's not an accurate description of their behaviour, but because they have an irrational fear of the word itself. That's not a legitimate reason to stop using it to identify racist/sexist behaviour. Like, many guys (about a third) will admit to using force to make a woman have sex with them, but they will not admit to it if the word "rape" is used in the question. This does not change the nature of what they did (forcing someone to have sex with you is rape), it just means they can't handle an accurate label of their behaviour because they don't want to accept the truth about themselves--that they are rapists. If you've raped, you're a rapist. Accurate language is important, even when it makes people uncomfortable. If you don't want to be called a racist, don't act like a racist and you won't have to worry about people calling you that. Being afraid of the word itself is irrational and avoiding labelling behaviour accurately to spare irrational feelings helps no one.


Rape is different. Rape is horrible crime that takes a lack of emotional empathy to do.

Unintentionally undermining someone by racist jokes is different. It is nowhere as damaging and people often say them not with a desire to undermine others but rather when they don't understand the impact of their actions and to get approval for telling something funny.


Rape (especially acquaintance rape) happens for the same reason that racism happens--someone is not thinking about the consequences of their actions for those around them and is behaving thoughtlessly and selfishly. If rapists thought of the women they hurt and how their actions might impact them, they wouldn't rape--if a racist boss took the time to think about how his racist jokes might make people of other races feel, he wouldn't tell the racist jokes. These behaviours stem from a lack of empathy and a lack of willingness to examine the consequences of one's actions.


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Shahunshah
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07 Jan 2017, 8:07 pm

wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
When men (or women, because women contribute to it too) are being sexist towards me, when they say or do something sexist to me that makes my life harder and more stressful, I don't really care if they actively hate women or not--I only care that they are being sexist to me and making my life harder. Their intentions don't matter to me, the impact of their actions on me is what matters to me. You can not actively hate women and still contribute to sexism and making women's lives harder.

If you're bullying me because you hate me or bullying me because you think it's amusing, either way you are bullying me and I want it to stop. One's intentions matter less than the consequences of one's actions. This is a reality that everyone has to deal with if they are not a sociopath completely lacking empathy: whatever your intentions, your actions towards others have consequences, and dealing with and being responsible for those consequences is called being an adult.
No one denying Trump's idiocy. But sexist is a strong word to through towards someone. I think all of your grievances are legitimate and I certainly don't like Trump.

But the thing I think intent defines a person's thinking not actions. Intentions define what the person ultimately wants to do. Actions are just the result of it.

I personally like it that people like you are not afraid to bash Trump. I think we need people like you to show that those kinds of behaviours are bad.


My point is that even if you don't believe sexist things, if you behave in a sexist way towards people then you might as well have those beliefs because the end result is the same for the people whom you behave in a sexist way towards. I don't understand why this is difficult to grasp.

Say you are a manager and you make your workplace toxic by making racist jokes all the time--maybe you don't actually believe your race is superior to others, you just find racist jokes funny because they are taboo. If you have people of other races in your workplace, they are going to experience more stress and less productivity because of the racist jokes, even though you don't actually think you are better than them. They are still going to feel unwelcome in the workplace, and possibly afraid of their coworkers who laugh along with the racist jokes. The result (toxic environment) is the same for other people whatever your intentions are when your behaviour is racist.

Intention matters very little in regards to actions and their impact on others. This is something you need to grasp when you go out in the world and you interact with others--your intentions might matter a lot to you, but they don't matter much to everyone else, it's your behaviour and its consequences that matter and that is how life works.
I agree with most of what you say. But I just don't think we should throw around the word racist lightly. Its like saying someone is a terrible person when in actual fact they may just be careless.

That's why we need people like you to point out these things. But if we use racist as a word to throw around to those people we risk mislabelling and condemning those who just lacked a bit of self awareness.


People react to the word that way not because it's not an accurate description of their behaviour, but because they have an irrational fear of the word itself. That's not a legitimate reason to stop using it to identify racist/sexist behaviour. Like, many guys (about a third) will admit to using force to make a woman have sex with them, but they will not admit to it if the word "rape" is used in the question. This does not change the nature of what they did (forcing someone to have sex with you is rape), it just means they can't handle an accurate label of their behaviour because they don't want to accept the truth about themselves--that they are rapists. If you've raped, you're a rapist. Accurate language is important, even when it makes people uncomfortable. If you don't want to be called a racist, don't act like a racist and you won't have to worry about people calling you that. Being afraid of the word itself is irrational and avoiding labelling behaviour accurately to spare irrational feelings helps no one.


Rape is different. Rape is horrible crime that takes a lack of emotional empathy to do.

Unintentionally undermining someone by racist jokes is different. It is nowhere as damaging and people often say them not with a desire to undermine others but rather when they don't understand the impact of their actions and to get approval for telling something funny.


Rape (especially acquaintance rape) happens for the same reason that racism happens--someone is not thinking about the consequences of their actions for those around them and is behaving thoughtlessly and selfishly. If rapists thought of the women they hurt and how their actions might impact them, they wouldn't rape--if a racist boss took the time to think about how his racist jokes might make people of other races feel, he wouldn't tell the racist jokes. These behaviours stem from a lack of empathy and a lack of willingness to examine the consequences of one's actions.


When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.



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07 Jan 2017, 8:35 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.

I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.






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07 Jan 2017, 8:55 pm

Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.
I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.
True. Equating rape and racist jokes is disrespectful to rape victims.


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07 Jan 2017, 8:57 pm

RetroGamer87 wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.
I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.
True. Equating rape and racist jokes is disrespectful to rape victims.


I am a rape survivor--not all rape is overtly painful, many women freeze when it happens and the guy has no idea if she is in pain or not. Don't tell me what is disrespectful to me. Interesting that many people who haven't experienced rape are telling me what rape is all about like they know better than me who has experienced it, but that's not disrespectful. :roll:

Also, if my boss is sexist in the workplace I don't have a choice not to hear it and not be "offended" by it. It's not about offense, it's about making the workplace toxic. Please stop telling me what I can and cannot "choose" to be effected by--I cannot choose to not be effected negatively by sexism as a woman any more than I could choose not to be raped.


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Last edited by wilburforce on 07 Jan 2017, 9:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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07 Jan 2017, 8:58 pm

Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.

I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.


That's not true, someone can choose whether or not to talk about it, but not how much something bothers them.


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07 Jan 2017, 9:00 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
When men (or women, because women contribute to it too) are being sexist towards me, when they say or do something sexist to me that makes my life harder and more stressful, I don't really care if they actively hate women or not--I only care that they are being sexist to me and making my life harder. Their intentions don't matter to me, the impact of their actions on me is what matters to me. You can not actively hate women and still contribute to sexism and making women's lives harder.

If you're bullying me because you hate me or bullying me because you think it's amusing, either way you are bullying me and I want it to stop. One's intentions matter less than the consequences of one's actions. This is a reality that everyone has to deal with if they are not a sociopath completely lacking empathy: whatever your intentions, your actions towards others have consequences, and dealing with and being responsible for those consequences is called being an adult.
No one denying Trump's idiocy. But sexist is a strong word to through towards someone. I think all of your grievances are legitimate and I certainly don't like Trump.

But the thing I think intent defines a person's thinking not actions. Intentions define what the person ultimately wants to do. Actions are just the result of it.

I personally like it that people like you are not afraid to bash Trump. I think we need people like you to show that those kinds of behaviours are bad.


My point is that even if you don't believe sexist things, if you behave in a sexist way towards people then you might as well have those beliefs because the end result is the same for the people whom you behave in a sexist way towards. I don't understand why this is difficult to grasp.

Say you are a manager and you make your workplace toxic by making racist jokes all the time--maybe you don't actually believe your race is superior to others, you just find racist jokes funny because they are taboo. If you have people of other races in your workplace, they are going to experience more stress and less productivity because of the racist jokes, even though you don't actually think you are better than them. They are still going to feel unwelcome in the workplace, and possibly afraid of their coworkers who laugh along with the racist jokes. The result (toxic environment) is the same for other people whatever your intentions are when your behaviour is racist.

Intention matters very little in regards to actions and their impact on others. This is something you need to grasp when you go out in the world and you interact with others--your intentions might matter a lot to you, but they don't matter much to everyone else, it's your behaviour and its consequences that matter and that is how life works.
I agree with most of what you say. But I just don't think we should throw around the word racist lightly. Its like saying someone is a terrible person when in actual fact they may just be careless.

That's why we need people like you to point out these things. But if we use racist as a word to throw around to those people we risk mislabelling and condemning those who just lacked a bit of self awareness.


People react to the word that way not because it's not an accurate description of their behaviour, but because they have an irrational fear of the word itself. That's not a legitimate reason to stop using it to identify racist/sexist behaviour. Like, many guys (about a third) will admit to using force to make a woman have sex with them, but they will not admit to it if the word "rape" is used in the question. This does not change the nature of what they did (forcing someone to have sex with you is rape), it just means they can't handle an accurate label of their behaviour because they don't want to accept the truth about themselves--that they are rapists. If you've raped, you're a rapist. Accurate language is important, even when it makes people uncomfortable. If you don't want to be called a racist, don't act like a racist and you won't have to worry about people calling you that. Being afraid of the word itself is irrational and avoiding labelling behaviour accurately to spare irrational feelings helps no one.


Rape is different. Rape is horrible crime that takes a lack of emotional empathy to do.

Unintentionally undermining someone by racist jokes is different. It is nowhere as damaging and people often say them not with a desire to undermine others but rather when they don't understand the impact of their actions and to get approval for telling something funny.


Rape (especially acquaintance rape) happens for the same reason that racism happens--someone is not thinking about the consequences of their actions for those around them and is behaving thoughtlessly and selfishly. If rapists thought of the women they hurt and how their actions might impact them, they wouldn't rape--if a racist boss took the time to think about how his racist jokes might make people of other races feel, he wouldn't tell the racist jokes. These behaviours stem from a lack of empathy and a lack of willingness to examine the consequences of one's actions.


When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.


It can depend on society like in the past where it was acceptable to rape your wife they may not have seen it as the women being in pain. There are also some rapists who have a condition where they believe the women are enjoying it.

The way I see it is racism isn't equivilent to rape. In such a way that sexism used to make rape more acceptable racism can however make hate crimes more acceptable.

The difference here is that Trump is in a powerful and authorative position. His jokes compared to others bare more weight and can unintentionally cause already racist people to think it is more acceptable

Even if it isn't his intended outcome his jokes contribute to racism, sexism, and discrimination against disabled people.



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07 Jan 2017, 9:01 pm

wilburforce wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.
I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.
True. Equating rape and racist jokes is disrespectful to rape victims.
I am a rape survivor--not all rape is overtly painful, many women freeze when it happens and the guy has no idea if she is in pain or not. Don't tell me what is disrespectful to me. Interesting that many people who haven't experienced rape are telling me what rape is all about like they know better than me who has experienced it, but that's not disrespectful. :roll:
Well how was I supposed to know that?

Interesting that you think you're an expert on the effects of racism when you're not a member of an ethnic minority.


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07 Jan 2017, 9:31 pm

wilburforce wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.
I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.
True. Equating rape and racist jokes is disrespectful to rape victims.


I am a rape survivor--not all rape is overtly painful, many women freeze when it happens and the guy has no idea if she is in pain or not. Don't tell me what is disrespectful to me. Interesting that many people who haven't experienced rape are telling me what rape is all about like they know better than me who has experienced it, but that's not disrespectful. :roll:

Also, if my boss is sexist in the workplace I don't have a choice not to hear it and not be "offended" by it. It's not about offense, it's about making the workplace toxic. Please stop telling me what I can and cannot "choose" to be effected by--I cannot choose to not be effected negatively by sexism as a woman any more than I could choose not to be raped.
Trauma and fear can both count as pain. What I say on this is from what others have said.

Besides almost everyone in society is taught that rape is horrible for the individual. The individual who does it therefore most likely knows and doesn't care.



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07 Jan 2017, 9:33 pm

RetroGamer87 wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.
I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.
True. Equating rape and racist jokes is disrespectful to rape victims.
I am a rape survivor--not all rape is overtly painful, many women freeze when it happens and the guy has no idea if she is in pain or not. Don't tell me what is disrespectful to me. Interesting that many people who haven't experienced rape are telling me what rape is all about like they know better than me who has experienced it, but that's not disrespectful. :roll:
Well how was I supposed to know that?

Interesting that you think you're an expert on the effects of racism when you're not a member of an ethnic minority.


I can speak about bigotry like sexism and racism and what it is like to experience because I am a member of a class that is effected by bigotry.


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07 Jan 2017, 9:35 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.
I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.
True. Equating rape and racist jokes is disrespectful to rape victims.


I am a rape survivor--not all rape is overtly painful, many women freeze when it happens and the guy has no idea if she is in pain or not. Don't tell me what is disrespectful to me. Interesting that many people who haven't experienced rape are telling me what rape is all about like they know better than me who has experienced it, but that's not disrespectful. :roll:

Also, if my boss is sexist in the workplace I don't have a choice not to hear it and not be "offended" by it. It's not about offense, it's about making the workplace toxic. Please stop telling me what I can and cannot "choose" to be effected by--I cannot choose to not be effected negatively by sexism as a woman any more than I could choose not to be raped.
Trauma and fear can both count as pain. What I say on this is from what others have said.

Besides almost everyone in society is taught that rape is horrible for the individual. The individual who does it therefore most likely knows and doesn't care.


Actually, most guys who rape don't think of themselves as rapists by avoiding using that word, and by avoiding the word they avoid feeling bad because they can convince themselves that what they did wasn't rape. Most men only consider a stranger jumping out of the bushes with a knife is rape, they don't see date-rape as hurtful or traumatic because they have done it and they are not bad people so it can't be all that bad.

http://www.salon.com/2015/01/15/the_ugl ... l_it_rape/


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07 Jan 2017, 9:41 pm

wilburforce wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.
I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.
True. Equating rape and racist jokes is disrespectful to rape victims.
I am a rape survivor--not all rape is overtly painful, many women freeze when it happens and the guy has no idea if she is in pain or not. Don't tell me what is disrespectful to me. Interesting that many people who haven't experienced rape are telling me what rape is all about like they know better than me who has experienced it, but that's not disrespectful. :roll:
Well how was I supposed to know that?

Interesting that you think you're an expert on the effects of racism when you're not a member of an ethnic minority.
I can speak about bigotry like sexism and racism and what it is like to experience because I am a member of a class that is effected by bigotry.
Which class would that be?


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Shahunshah
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07 Jan 2017, 9:45 pm

wilburforce wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
wilburforce wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
When a woman is being raped it is obvious to the perpetrator that she is in pain they just don't care. When someone tells a racist joke they might think their being funny and not understand the implications of their actions.
I agree with this----I don't think these two equate, because, also, a person who is offended by a racist comment can choose NOT to be offended / ticked-off / whatever.
True. Equating rape and racist jokes is disrespectful to rape victims.


I am a rape survivor--not all rape is overtly painful, many women freeze when it happens and the guy has no idea if she is in pain or not. Don't tell me what is disrespectful to me. Interesting that many people who haven't experienced rape are telling me what rape is all about like they know better than me who has experienced it, but that's not disrespectful. :roll:

Also, if my boss is sexist in the workplace I don't have a choice not to hear it and not be "offended" by it. It's not about offense, it's about making the workplace toxic. Please stop telling me what I can and cannot "choose" to be effected by--I cannot choose to not be effected negatively by sexism as a woman any more than I could choose not to be raped.
Trauma and fear can both count as pain. What I say on this is from what others have said.

Besides almost everyone in society is taught that rape is horrible for the individual. The individual who does it therefore most likely knows and doesn't care.


Actually, most guys who rape don't think of themselves as rapists by avoiding using that word, and by avoiding the word they avoid feeling bad because they can convince themselves that what they did wasn't rape. Most men only consider a stranger jumping out of the bushes with a knife is rape, they don't see date-rape as hurtful or traumatic because they have done it and they are not bad people so it can't be all that bad.

http://www.salon.com/2015/01/15/the_ugl ... l_it_rape/
Look and you know that is considered rape as well by most standards. Before you do an action like that you are taught it is wrong by everyone in society and what a terrible crime it is. It takes not carrying to want to carry it out.

Please stop comparing it to racism just don't. A fairly normal person can make a racist joke because they think it is funny and will be received as such. No one can think committing that crime is okay without being tremendously screwed up. The two people are so far apart.



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07 Jan 2017, 9:47 pm

wilburforce wrote:
Interesting that many people who haven't experienced rape are telling me what rape is all about like they know better than me who has experienced it, but that's not disrespectful.

How do YOU know what people have / haven't experienced rape? Men can be raped, TOO!! One can't know, until that person, says----talk about reading minds.






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07 Jan 2017, 9:49 pm

All crimes are equal!

Image


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