Moral inconsistencies, incest, abortion, homosexuality?
Incest is a very strong taboo. It, in fact, is the ur-taboo, and often the most important and strongest taboo a society has. It controls who can marry who and who can reproduce with who. There are very basic genetic facts that others on this thread have mentioned. In addition, an incestuous relationship can't ever be considered fully consensual due to the power differential between family members. simply put, in close incestuous relationships there will always be an element of coercion. Incestuous relationships can be catastrophic to the psyche-there is a strong correlation between incest and Avoidant Personality Disorder, probably due to the insane warping of primary relationships.
Homosexuality is exogamous. It's a choice. It ain't hurting nobody.
And abortion? Fetuses aren't people. Even if you consider them people, nobody has the right to demand to use the organs of another person.
Mar000, what exactly is the problem with "homosexuals" (not the word we like to use!) raising children? I'd LOVE to hear your rationale on why my raising a child with another woman would be wrong. Keep in mind that it's been shown that gay couples are far less likely to abuse their kids.
http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/h ... ation.html
http://feministing.com/2010/11/11/new-s ... rate-of-0/
http://www.apa.org/about/governance/cou ... nting.aspx
http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/Articles/000,002.htm
I'll have to ask you to read allll the way down on the first and last links. And I know this is thread-derailing (mar00, you can PM me if you'd like), but I really need to know why someone would think that. I just don't understand.
Apparently you read selectively. I felt this opinion of my was necessary to mention for a complete profile. Obviously in my weird fantasies I was imagining someone from the other camp jumping out of place and arguing about this. It is completely irrelevant regarding this thread, there is a ton of people who share my views all over the world and many arguments were produced. I am obviously not claiming that I am right and given our current demographic situation I do not mind this happening, however, hypothetically I do not consider it to be moral from a perspective of a child. This is completely subjective and hypothetical. I see no reason for you to attack me like that in this situation. I really do admire gay people to be fighting for themselves like that, however, in many cases it is just too much.
The simplest argument is that such family is not natural. It is so easy to understand this. And there is a lot of studies most of them funded by those who needed them: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16613625 . Another question is if it should be legal and I say yes b/c, pardon the language, people suck anyway.
I presume the incestuous relationship that is being discussed here is only about parent/offspring or siblings?
I'm not sure how I feel for this subject. I generally go through life saying as long as what you do doesn't harm anyone else, go for it. I support cousin marriage, but have never really even considered anything else. If you are attracted to someone that you didn't know was your sibling or parent, is it still as bad? I recently read about a case where non-identical twins were seperated at birth. They found each other as adults later in life and got married, had kids and lived together. They didn't know they were related, and neither did anyone else until the woman was tested to see if she was a donor match for her sick husband. As soon as all this was uncovered they were forced to seperate and their children (who were perfectly healthy) taken away. I find this wrong.
_________________
I'm a girl people!
"Do or do not; there is no try." -Yoda
Your Aspie score: 157 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 65 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie
I just saw a film that many of you may like, and that is relevant (tangentially) to the present discussion
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G957jPEHe28&feature=related[/youtube]
It is called Le Beau Père, and deals with the love that develops between a man and his 14 year old stepdaughter, after her mother dies in a car accident.
Well, I'll put it this way. If you subscribe to strictly utilitarian moral precepts, there is no greater wrong in an incestuous couple reproducing than there is in an autistic couple reproducing or two people who suffer from multiple sclerosis reproducing. In that case, it should also be wrong for two people who have HIV to reproduce. This is getting seriously difficult to make a call on, isn't it?
Therefore, how do we really justify any moral judgment? Squeamishness? Stupid. If you subscribe to the idea that you should outlaw anything that you get a bit squeamish over, I would gladly shoot you in your useless head based on the idea that I have a right to execute anyone whose behavior throws me into a fit of rage. Neither my gut feelings nor yours are valid pretexts on which to make moral judgments that may have widespread repercussions.
Squeamishness eliminated with extreme contempt, perhaps we could turn to religion. Now, if you subscribe to a religious belief and choose to make laws based on that religious belief, I think I'll just outlaw your religion based on the fact that it's not only an outrageous bother but ret*d and stupid to begin with. I would sooner murder you with a garroting cord than be governed according to your abysmally stupid and useless superstitions. For theocracy to even come close to working, everyone would have to unerringly believe in it and agree on it, and I have my doubts even then.
Having done away with theocracy, let's just try thinking like engineers. You shouldn't have any difficulty with this if you have any degree of autism and sufficient remaining common sense to access a forum and write in clear and distinct English, though I do acknowledge the limitations of statistical models in assessing the abilities of individuals:
Since the incestuous couple in question is clearly unhappy with the laws in Germany pertaining to incest, let's approach their situation like problem-solvers (it is pivotally important to the discussion that I intend this term to be constructive toward my intended meaning of "thinking like engineers" and intend to use the terms as roughly synonymous in the local context of this post). I personally am motivated to do so because I have heard what they have to say and regard them as nice and likable people to whom I feel sympathetic. One possible approach to their situation would be to offer them some literature about the genetic problems associated with incest, state very firmly our interest in preventing those kinds of problems, and offer them the full gamut marriage and adoption rights in exchange for having themselves sterilized. I would gladly even put them at the front of the line for adopting a child of their choosing.
If that didn't alleviate the problem to most people's satisfaction, I would simply try to come up with another solution. Either way, it is a difficult conundrum, and I think that it would help us a great deal if we were to simply acknowledge that it is indeed a moral dilemma.
Some twins (of the same gender) do work together in the porn industry.
Speaking of which, aren't Japanese twins on every man's bucket list?
Usually those girls seem pretty careful about not touching each-other in no-no places.
And, uh, yes?
Hmmmm.... Okay, now that you mention it, let's watch some more of those videos with twins a little more closely....
I thought of another (non-porn) movie though: Incendies
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDf-XuYid1A&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]
Spoiler alert: the movie gets Oedipal.
Because 'moral principal' and 'logical moral reasoning' is nonsense.
Homosexuality is fine because nothing bad occurs in reality. Two men have sex. Two women have sex. Whoop de doo. This is not comparable to incest where inbreds with severe genetic abnormailities result or abortion where you are killing a developing human.
There are exceptions but there is no inconsistency in saying homosexuality is okay and in nearly every situation incest isn't, and in quite a few situations abortion isn't.
Some twins (of the same gender) do work together in the porn industry.
Usually those girls seem pretty careful about not touching each-other in no-no places.
You may wish to review. Twins that I saw were, indeed, touching each other.
