Do you think overpopulation is a problem and what is your so

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TheDarkMage
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12 Mar 2012, 6:10 am

Vigilans wrote:

Worldwide one child policy could halve the human population in less than a century, completely nonviolently.

the one and only and truest answer. ive been moaning about this for years. it is the only way.

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Declension
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12 Mar 2012, 6:22 am

Every single global problem that we face would be easier to tackle if there were fewer people. Every single one of them.

It's not so much that overpopulation is a problem. It's more that reducing the population growth is a universal solution. There are no drawbacks, massive benefits, and it's an extremely easy thing to do.

donnie_darko
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12 Mar 2012, 6:38 am

Declension wrote:

It's not so much that overpopulation is a problem. It's more that reducing the population growth is a universal solution. There are no drawbacks, massive benefits, and it's an extremely easy thing to do.

Maybe for us autistics since (very generally speaking) we aren't as interested as the average person in having children, but for many, if not most people, having children is a psychological need. It would be impossible to stop people from having children altogether, save by force, though modern development encourages people to have fewer children.

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12 Mar 2012, 6:51 am

"I do not think it's a problem, I think overconsumption, inequality, and waste of resources is the problem. "

QFT.

Honestly, it is going to become a problem but I think there are much less dramatic ways to deal with it.

The fact that they are not taking any action now to stop it from happening and would rather deal with it that way down the road using such stupid methods rather than place controls to stop it from happening tells me a lot (that they're stupid).

If you simply looked at the food and agriculture policies of nations alone, particularly focusing on national food security and really encouraging local farmers to local consumers and by cutting out all the middlemen (especially multination corporations who are supermarkets), I think you would be well on the way to dealing with the population issue as a by-product (and for those in the western world, the obesity problem). If you were going to do that then it would be wise to focus on sustainable and organic framing while you were at it.

A country can only grow so much food (and therefore has a population limit). It you figure out the feasible limit and much controls in place so you never reach it, then nobody will have a problem. The thing is that countries are not going to get together and agree to something like this, they'll wait until it's too late to do anything about it. Following example is a good one.

Cuba is an excellent example. At one point they were importing 80% of their food and at the time there were a lot of hungry people, the only reason they did not have more deaths because of it is due to the socialist system. Had that happened in a capital country... well you can imagine the results.

And as you can imagine, Importing that much food that drove food prices through the roof, and as a by product - the overall cost of living. Currently they are really pushing local farmers to local consumers where ever it's possible and also focusing on organic and sustainable farming while they are at it. Things aren't changing overnight but it is a big step forward for them.

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Last edited by Kjas on 12 Mar 2012, 7:24 am, edited 2 times in total.

Declension
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12 Mar 2012, 6:54 am

donnie_darko wrote:

It would be impossible to stop people from having children altogether,

There's no need to do that! Assuming monogamous couples, they can all have two children each and the world population will shrink.

donnie_darko
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12 Mar 2012, 6:58 am

Declension wrote:

donnie_darko wrote:

It would be impossible to stop people from having children altogether,

There's no need to do that! Assuming monogamous couples, they can all have two children each and the world population will shrink.

Yes, but very slowly and not at the rate the Malthusian-minded would like.

ruveyn
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12 Mar 2012, 7:13 am

donnie_darko wrote:

I do not think it's a problem, I think overconsumption, inequality, and waste of resources is the problem.

What is "waste"? Do you think the human race should take an Oath of Poverty?

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12 Mar 2012, 7:14 am

donnie_darko wrote:

not at the rate the Malthusian-minded would like.

I apologise for not living up to your expectations. I promise that I will try harder to be a member of a secret cabal bent on destroying humanity.

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12 Mar 2012, 9:19 am

Burzum wrote:

puddingmouse wrote:

Where is this elite cabal of worse-than-Nazi Malthusians?

"Cannibalism is a radical but realistic solution to the problem of overpopulation." - Lyall Watson, The Financial Times

"If I were reincarnated, I would wish to be returned to Earth as a killer virus to lower human population levels." - Prince Phillip, World Wildlife Fund

"To feed a starving child is to exacerbate the world population problem." - Lamont Cole

"I suspect that eradicating smallpox was wrong. It played an important part in balancing ecosystems." - John Davis, Earth First

"If radical environmentalists were to invent a disease to bring human populations back to sanity, it would probably be something like AIDS" - Earth First Newsletter

Okay, point taken.

The whole movement for population control isn't like that, though.

Also, you seem to be employing a slippery slope argument. First we give out free contraception in developing nations and eventually we'll end up with Gene Plague Alpha (anyone else played Fate of the World?) - all because the cabal of misanthropists than includes Prince Philip (lol) have set up the slope this way.

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12 Mar 2012, 10:02 am

chinatown wrote:

I think it is a problem.

The only good solution is improving the standard of living (especially, as the OP mentioned, women's rights) in Third World countries. As you probably know, birth rate plummets when conditions improve.

.

I am a woman with a decent job and one child. The first caused the second, as it is doing in many industrialized countries. This is the least painful path forward.

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12 Mar 2012, 10:26 am

enrico_dandolo wrote:

The population will eventually stabilize at a reasonnable and stable level, whatever that is. The point until then is to avoid unnecessary suffering. "Overpopulation" is something that should be avoided, not for itself, but for the ills it will cause during the stabilization process.

I don't know if the Earth as a whole is overpopulated. In any case, probably not very much. However, population growth happens in some of the least developped regions, which least capable to cope with it, because there the changes that happened were too rapid and brutal. The first thing I would do to "fight" it would be to break all barriers to immigration and (ideally) citizenship. If Africa and parts of Asia are overpopulated and growing, Europe and North America could house millions more, and won't without immigration -- + it would help with the mentalities.

Sounds good. Except for covert and overt racism in America and Europe, that would be a huge block to overcome when concerning massive non-white immigration.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

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12 Mar 2012, 10:44 am

yay another thread doomed to senseless hyperbole, from both sides.

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enrico_dandolo
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12 Mar 2012, 12:49 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

Sounds good. Except for covert and overt racism in America and Europe, that would be a huge block to overcome when concerning massive non-white immigration.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Meh. You're right. I forgot that people are bigotted and unreasonable.

But then, as I heard say a Somalian refugee in Greece (yes, of all places), it is still better to be poor in Greece than to be poor in Somalia.

Declension wrote:

donnie_darko wrote:

It would be impossible to stop people from having children altogether,

There's no need to do that! Assuming monogamous couples, they can all have two children each and the world population will shrink.

With two children, world population will stabilize, not shrink.

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12 Mar 2012, 2:34 pm

Overpopulation is an issue, but I didn't vote in the poll because I have a different view entirely. For me, I believe overpopulation is an issue and that we need to let the natural world take it's course. All throughout human history we have tried to eradicate disease and try to block away what is mostly natural from our lives. And this causes problems, drug resistance viruses and bacteria, etc. Overpopulation causes a decline in resources as well. The more of a population, the more resources they will use.

My belief is the very same belief of the natural world, a deer population is overpopulated, they starve, they strip the land, they get more disease, and they die. Now either they die and that naturally cuts the population into a more balanced situation or they completely die off. I feel like we should be allowing this to occur as well. And stop sending aid for those populations that are facing those problems. We need to stop playing a "God" whom can change the course of the natural world. Because the natural rules and laws will come back and we'll have worse shocks becuase of it.

Robdemanc
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12 Mar 2012, 2:50 pm

I think it is a big problem and I reckon the consequences will be ones we have not even thought about. We cannot go on multiplying on this planet indefinately while having the same lifestyle we enjoy in the west.

We are always at war so that is one solution, viruses are another, and I reckon we are in for a big cull this century. Those in charge will be thinking of this, even if at the same time they are riduculing the whole idea of overpopulation.

androbot2084
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12 Mar 2012, 9:03 pm

I think if running out of land is the problem then we should colonize Mars.

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