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thinkinginpictures
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08 Jul 2014, 1:06 am

Kurgan wrote:
YippySkippy wrote:
And I'm sure the Danish media are NEVER biased, and never sensationalize a story. Please.

Nobody made him come live in America. He chose to be here, and had every opportunity to educate himself about our laws and customs. When in Rome...


If the Danish media is anything like the Norwegian media, it's extremely biased.


And the American media is never biased?

Each and every single Danish newspaper (and I assure you, they usually write different versions of the same story), in this particular case, they report of the same story.

It seems as that you believe that the more henious crimes you are accused of, the more guilty of them you are too.

But let me give you a fact: It is not the accusations that makes you a criminal, it is the actual guilt (wether or not you actually committed the crime).

For some reason, people have a hard time figuring that out.



drh1138
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08 Jul 2014, 4:22 am

Quote:
I hate America


Given the general tone of your posts in PPR and the nightmarish political and social policies advocated within them, that absolutely doesn't surprise me one bit.



heavenlyabyss
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08 Jul 2014, 4:56 am

starvingartist wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Quoted: "A judge, partly based on a confession, said there was probable cause to believe Thomsen committed the crimes".

The guy confessed ?


He did not confess.
The prosecutor says so, but he was forced to "confess"
http://nyhederne.tv2.dk/2014-07-07-advo ... %C3%A5else

(article in Danish).

Translation:

Quote:
-
He signed a declaration which the police and the prosecutor percieve as a confession. But according to his lawyer, it was a trap, setup by the New York Police. According to his lawyer,
they told him they had video recordings of his alleged abuses - recordings they don't have.

In this way, the police, has trapped him into believing he was guilty. In the declaration he always says "if". He never ever said "Yes, I did so".


how is that possible, to trap you into believing you're guilty if you know you're not? i mean, if i know i didn't do something and a cop tells me "hey i can prove you committed a crime, i have video of you doing it" i would say "show me this video" because i would know he was full of sh**. i would know he couldn't possibly have a video of me committing a crime i didn't commit, so there would be no reason for that "tactic" to work. it only works if the guy did it and believes someone could have actually caught him doing it on tape--because he did it.


This is wrong. Innocent people do frequently commit to crimes due to police coercion.

Not sure US is worth specifically targeting though.



Misslizard
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08 Jul 2014, 8:00 am

If we could just get more people to hate America that would solve our immigration problems.


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GGPViper
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08 Jul 2014, 8:47 am

starvingartist wrote:
how is that possible, to trap you into believing you're guilty if you know you're not? i mean, if i know i didn't do something and a cop tells me "hey i can prove you committed a crime, i have video of you doing it" i would say "show me this video" because i would know he was full of sh**. i would know he couldn't possibly have a video of me committing a crime i didn't commit, so there would be no reason for that "tactic" to work. it only works if the guy did it and believes someone could have actually caught him doing it on tape--because he did it.

According to the Innocence project, 30 percent of those innocent convicts exonerated by DNA evidence in the project (93 so far) made incriminating statements, delivered outright confessions or pled guilty.
http://www.innocenceproject.org/underst ... ssions.php
http://www.innocenceproject.org/know/Se ... =&x=33&y=5



kraftiekortie
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08 Jul 2014, 8:50 am

People tend to plead guilty because they don't want the hassle of a protracted court battle (they have to stay in court all day for their case to be heard, they have to miss work, etc,)

They also might get intimidated by interrogators.



YippySkippy
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08 Jul 2014, 9:32 am

Quote:
And the American media is never biased?


American media is quite biased. All media is biased, as all people are biased.

Quote:
Each and every single Danish newspaper (and I assure you, they usually write different versions of the same story), in this particular case, they report of the same story.


I'll take your word for that.

Quote:
It seems as that you believe that the more henious crimes you are accused of, the more guilty of them you are too.


Hubba wha?? That statement is not based on anything I've said.

Quote:
But let me give you a fact: It is not the accusations that makes you a criminal, it is the actual guilt (wether or not you actually committed the crime).


Obviously. :roll:

Quote:
For some reason, people have a hard time figuring that out.


Not this person.



Janissy
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08 Jul 2014, 10:29 am

From the linked articles:

What the prosecution has

1)Allegations from a co-worker

Quote:
Thomsen was arrested June 27 after he was accused of sexually abusing the students in various ways between May 27 and June 4. According to authorities, he placed the hands of nine kids on his genitals over his clothing.

Another three children had their buttocks rubbed by the teacher, while a 13th victim had his head placed against the intern?s clothed crotch on three occasions, officials said.


2)a confession
Quote:
'You?re telling me you have a video, he says, so I guess it happened but I have no memory of it.'


What the defense has

1)Nobody else corroborates the coworkers allegations, not the children, or a monitor also in the room at the time of the allegations

Quote:
No one else reported the 6-foot-3, 280-pound native of Denmark, according to his lawyers and a July 2 letter from the school. They added that a monitor was in the room during the time of the alleged abuse and found nothing wrong.


No children have come forward with allegations, but then again children often don't. However, parents do. And parents notice if there is a sudden uptick in stress behaviour from their kids such as crying spells, bedwetting and nightmares. That no parent came forward with reports of stress reactions from their kids- let alone actual allegations- even after they found out about this makes it less likely to have actually happened. Kids may not put things into words but they do have visible stress reactions and no parent has come forward saying that their child had stress reactions and they never knew why but it happened right after that time period.

2)the confession is rather weak
Quote:
'You?re telling me you have a video, he says, so I guess it happened but I have no memory of it.'


There was no video. The police wanted to see what he would say if they claimed there was. "so I guess it happened" is technically a confession- enough of one to get him held pending further investigation and trial- but it could just as easily be a guy suddenly wondering if he violated a cultural norm because his country has different norms.

His mother said
Quote:
'In Denmark, we don?t have this fear of touching. It?s normal and common if a child is sad, you put him on your lap,' she said.
so his supposed confession may have been him wondering if non-sexual touching (putting a kid in your lap) got misinterpreted as sexual touching by people watching a video (no actual video exists). Of course there is a gigantic difference between putting a kid in your lap (or on your shoulders as in a linked picture of him and a kid) and
Quote:
Prosecutors say Thomsen placed the hands of nine different children on his genitals over his clothing and that he pressed the head of a 10th victim against his clothed genitals. He also allegedly touched several children on the buttocks.
. But then again he didn't confess to doing those specific actions but rather "so I guess it happened" which could also be him wondering if non-sexual things he did got misinterpreted as sexual.

My suspicion is that he's innocent. This suspicion is based on the singular nature of the allegations (a co-worker who says these things happened even though there was a monitor in the room in who says they didn't) but mostly on the lack of parents coming forward. School officials could conspire to cover up a crime so they won't get sued. But if it happened, the odds are that the parents of the kids would be calling for his blood and stating their child's previously inexplicable bedwetting, crying spells and nightmares as circumstantial evidence. But none of them are. If any of them had but it wasn't being reported, you'd see them unleashing fury in the comments section of any article they could find. But they aren't.*

I am confident he will be found innocent.

However I don't see his arrest as some damning indictment of the American judicial system. Such allegations have to be taken seriously and the confession- weak though it is- does make for probable cause to hold him. But it is only holding him. He hasn't been convicted, nor is he likely to be on these flimsy allegations.

*I'm a parent myself and hypervigilant about this sort of thing. It is the norm for parents to go on high alert if their child has a sudden uptick in stress behaviours, even without the child spelling out exactly the source of stress. That high alert would go to defcon 1 after the arrest of somebody taking care of my child. That no parent has come forward corroborating a stress reaction in their child or an actual allegation either in the media or in comments on the media stories is very telling. Believe me, those parents quizzed and crossed examined their children as soon as they found out about this. That is a parental norm.



ZenDen
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08 Jul 2014, 11:45 am

Danish media is biased and not to be trusted. I say this because of the deliberate action of enraging Muslims over the depiction of Muhammed which caused deaths and destruction, just as they knew and intended.

Who would trust such warped minds?

It isn't that the U.S. media isn't biased, but all governments have their blundering fingers in and on the news media.

Media today doesn't seem designed to bring people together, instead it drives them apart. This is the way politicians protect their fiefdom.

And people are sooooooo gullible.

(Did I forget to mention glass houses?)



trollcatman
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08 Jul 2014, 11:56 am

ZenDen wrote:
Danish media is biased and not to be trusted. I say this because of the deliberate action of enraging Muslims over the depiction of Muhammed which caused deaths and destruction, just as they knew and intended.

Who would trust such warped minds?


You're not serious with this? The warped minds are the people who went all medieval when they heard about the Mohammed cartoons. The Danes apparantly have freedom of the press and if foreigners don't like that, too bad for them.
The man who made the cartoons now has to live under police protection because of crazy fundies who want to kill him over a cartoon. These barbarians are the real enemies, not the press. Why isn't anyone stopping these madmen from killing and rioting over nothing? Same crap happened when that pastor burned a Koran. The radical idiots attacked and killed UN personal in retaliation. These people are so far out there and they go berserk over nothing. We can't just censor the press because somewhere someone is going to find offence anyway. Haters gonna hate.



YippySkippy
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08 Jul 2014, 12:32 pm

Quote:
I am confident he will be found innocent.


I believe so, too.

Quote:
However I don't see his arrest as some damning indictment of the American judicial system.


Neither do I. I feel the OP's hate-mongering is completely unjustified.