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Tim_Tex
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09 Sep 2014, 3:45 pm

AspE wrote:
Raptor wrote:
:roll: :roll:
The more I hear you people complain about the Pledge of Allegiance the more I like it, especially the One Nation Under God part.

Not all Americans believe in God, and this isn't a theocracy.


"Under God" was used as a psychological tool against the Soviet Union (it was added in the early years of the Cold War), because atheism was associated with communism. No theocratic intentions were implied.


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naturalplastic
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09 Sep 2014, 3:50 pm

Raptor wrote:
:roll: :roll:
The more I hear you people complain about the Pledge of Allegiance the more I like it, especially the One Nation Under God part.
Image

Besides the fact that it floats your emotional boat to annoy people that you don't like- do you have any actual reason for thinking that the Pledge serves any purpose? Especially for the "under God" part?

I admit that if I heard in the news that the head honcho of ISIL just came down with ebola it would kinda brighten my day. Lol!

But that doesnt mean that I'm FOR the ebola virus!



AspE
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09 Sep 2014, 4:27 pm

Tim_Tex wrote:

"Under God" was used as a psychological tool against the Soviet Union (it was added in the early years of the Cold War), because atheism was associated with communism. No theocratic intentions were implied.

I understand, but their intentions are irrelevant. There is the perception that it promotes a non-secular state. And this is a secular state.



Jacoby
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09 Sep 2014, 4:29 pm

The state shouldn't be promoted period



AspE
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09 Sep 2014, 4:43 pm

Jacoby wrote:
The state shouldn't be promoted period

Yes it should, in my school we called it civics. It stressed the importance of participation in government and voting.



Jacoby
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09 Sep 2014, 4:50 pm

AspE wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
The state shouldn't be promoted period

Yes it should, in my school we called it civics. It stressed the importance of participation in government and voting.


Pledging allegiance to the state isn't any different that pledging it to god, learning about its functions isn't the same as pledging your undying and unthinking allegiance to it.



naturalplastic
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09 Sep 2014, 4:58 pm

Tim_Tex wrote:
AspE wrote:
Raptor wrote:
:roll: :roll:
The more I hear you people complain about the Pledge of Allegiance the more I like it, especially the One Nation Under God part.

Not all Americans believe in God, and this isn't a theocracy.


"Under God" was used as a psychological tool against the Soviet Union (it was added in the early years of the Cold War), because atheism was associated with communism. No theocratic intentions were implied.

Translation into plain English: They purposely breached the separation of church and state by adding that phrase as propaganda purposes during the Cold War to oppose "Godless Communism".

Same thing.

you're making a distinction without a difference.

It may not be the worse thing in the world. But the phrase is both anachronistic, and it is a touch of theocracy.



AspE
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09 Sep 2014, 5:02 pm

Jacoby wrote:
AspE wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
The state shouldn't be promoted period

Yes it should, in my school we called it civics. It stressed the importance of participation in government and voting.


Pledging allegiance to the state isn't any different that pledging it to god, learning about its functions isn't the same as pledging your undying and unthinking allegiance to it.

It's secular, so it's legal, no matter how it seems to approach the philosophy of a religion.



Jacoby
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09 Sep 2014, 5:17 pm

AspE wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
AspE wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
The state shouldn't be promoted period

Yes it should, in my school we called it civics. It stressed the importance of participation in government and voting.


Pledging allegiance to the state isn't any different that pledging it to god, learning about its functions isn't the same as pledging your undying and unthinking allegiance to it.

It's secular, so it's legal, no matter how it seems to approach the philosophy of a religion.


I think by just objecting to that aspect of it you're not seeing the forest for the trees.



Raptor
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09 Sep 2014, 10:42 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
Besides the fact that it floats your emotional boat to annoy people that you don't like- do you have any actual reason for thinking that the Pledge serves any purpose? Especially for the "under God" part?

Um......I'm a flag waver. :D
And the more you try to rationalize why I shouldn't be or try to half-ass psychoanalyze me or whatever the harder I'll wave the flag.


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Raptor
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09 Sep 2014, 10:43 pm

AspE wrote:
Raptor wrote:
:roll: :roll:
The more I hear you people complain about the Pledge of Allegiance the more I like it, especially the One Nation Under God part.

Not all Americans believe in God, and this isn't a theocracy.

Sounds like a personal problem for them.
Read and take to heart my reply to naturalplastic.


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09 Sep 2014, 10:46 pm

Raptor wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Besides the fact that it floats your emotional boat to annoy people that you don't like- do you have any actual reason for thinking that the Pledge serves any purpose? Especially for the "under God" part?

Um......I'm a flag waver. :D
And the more you try to rationalize why I shouldn't be or try to half-ass psychoanalyze me or whatever the harder I'll wave the flag.

Sounds like oppositional defiant disorder to me. :P


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naturalplastic
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09 Sep 2014, 11:11 pm

Raptor wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Besides the fact that it floats your emotional boat to annoy people that you don't like- do you have any actual reason for thinking that the Pledge serves any purpose? Especially for the "under God" part?

Um......I'm a flag waver. :D
And the more you try to rationalize why I shouldn't be or try to half-ass psychoanalyze me or whatever the harder I'll wave the flag.


I'm not trying to- do whatever that goobledygook is you're saying Im doing.
I just repeated what you yourself said. If you didnt like what you said then why did you say it?

You said yourself that its floats your emotional boat to annoy certain people. I asked you if you know any purpose to the pledge besides floating your own emotional boat. you're admitting here that there is none. Im not saying you dont have the right to piss off folks. Just asking you for some other purpose to the pledge.

Jeeze!



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10 Sep 2014, 1:27 am

we said the pledge every day in kindergarten, and in high school, but not at all in elementary and jr high.
huh.


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AspE
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10 Sep 2014, 11:55 am

Raptor wrote:
AspE wrote:
Raptor wrote:
:roll: :roll:
The more I hear you people complain about the Pledge of Allegiance the more I like it, especially the One Nation Under God part.

Not all Americans believe in God, and this isn't a theocracy.

Sounds like a personal problem for them.
Read and take to heart my reply to naturalplastic.

It's an erosion of the separation between church and state. That's something even religious people should be concerned about.



0_equals_true
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10 Sep 2014, 1:18 pm

Tim_Tex wrote:
"Under God" was used as a psychological tool against the Soviet Union (it was added in the early years of the Cold War), because atheism was associated with communism. No theocratic intentions were implied.

That is a bit naive and contradictory.

But that is a reality it is based on the cold war Propaganda, it is is the same category as McCarthyist policies. and belongs in the past.