What do you think about abortion

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nurseangela
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14 Apr 2016, 2:20 pm

pcuser wrote:

Tim_Tex wrote:

nurseangela wrote:

Yigeren wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

due to our puritanical heritage, the bulk of us tend to take "freedom of religion" to mean "freedom of religion to shove it down everybody else's throat."

Yes, I think that some people do take it to mean that. Someone basically told me the other day that I was going to hell because I am an agnostic atheist instead of a Christian, and that if I let God into my life he'll cure me of everything and fix all of my problems. Completely unsolicited religious dogma being shoved down my throat.

I don't go around telling people that they shouldn't pray because God doesn't exist, and that they are brainwashed fools. But then some others use every opportunity possible to mention God during conversations, and tell me that everything I believe is wrong, and only their way of thinking could be correct. Honestly, I just want to be left alone. I don't need to be "saved."

I'm not a brainwashed fool. I don't appreciate that. Thank you.

How come anti-theists only use those terms for Christians, rather for anybody who believes in a higher power/life force? Is it really anti-establishment, rather than anti-theism?

Anyway, there are times where I think abortion is appropriate, and times where it isn't.

The reason Christians are called out in this culture is because they are the ones in this country who are trying to pass laws forcing us to live as they see fit. That goes for you too, nurseangela. You want abortion to be illegal because you believe in a soul. We don't. How dare you try to force us to do as you see fit? This 'attack' is based on what you have written in this thread and others. It isn't a personal attack as you like to claim. So, go ahead and turn me in. I know you enjoy that...

I'm not addressing you after this because all you want to do is argue - AND DON'T SEND ME ANYMORE PM'S. I'm not forcing you to do anything - just what is it that I am FORCING you to do? I must have more power than I thought. You choose to be Atheist and for abortion and that is YOUR CHOICE. I DO NOT go around calling you or any other Atheist on this site names or degrading you in any way because it is your PERSONAL CHOICE to have those beliefs. CHRISTIANS should get the same respect. I don't think that's too much to ask. Now you have a good day.

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nurseangela
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14 Apr 2016, 2:26 pm

Yigeren wrote:

nurseangela wrote:

I'm not a brainwashed fool. I don't appreciate that. Thank you.

I never said that you were. But that's the equivalent of Christians telling me that I'm essentially stupid (at least the last time it happened) for not believing in God, and not wanting to be a Christian, and also that I'm going to Hell for my lack of belief, even though I explained that I don't believe in hell.

I was being preached to that all of my problems, including physical ailments, could be solved by "letting God into my life," and when I explained that I'm an agnostic atheist, then this person tried to "save" me.

My explanation that Christianity doesn't make sense to me, and that I believe in science and what can be proven (or at least my own experiences) was not good enough. The reaction I got was basically "It's so obvious that God exists. And it's perfectly obvious that Christianity is the only real religion. How can you be so foolish?" So I was being disrespected, and the equivalent to what I had to deal with would by my going around harassing Christians and telling them that their beliefs are foolish, and that the only rational thing for them to do would be to become agnostic atheists.

I don't like when people push their religious beliefs onto others. I respect your beliefs as an Atheist. It's those people that said those things to you that need to be dealt with - not the group of Christians as a whole.

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Yigeren
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14 Apr 2016, 2:38 pm

I wasn't trying to refer to Christians as a whole. Just those who are trying to force others to abide by their rules, and to believe what they believe. And I was actually originally just talking about religious people in general who do this. I don't agree with it.

I guess if people who are all of a particular religion want to form a society based upon their beliefs, and have everyone abide by rules based on the religion, then that's fine. Like the Amish. They all have their own rules based upon their interpretation of the Christian bible, and everyone there must abide by the rules. But then there are problems when people born into the community don't share those beliefs. They usually have to leave and don't get to see their families. So I don't know how well the whole idea really works.

Edenthiel
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14 Apr 2016, 2:40 pm

Tim_Tex wrote:

...Anyway, there are times where I think abortion is appropriate, and times where it isn't.

Hey, now - We'll have none of that, "getting back on-topic" malarkey around here!

(sarcasm. or facetiousness, take your pick)

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pcuser
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14 Apr 2016, 2:50 pm

nurseangela wrote:

Yigeren wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

due to our puritanical heritage, the bulk of us tend to take "freedom of religion" to mean "freedom of religion to shove it down everybody else's throat."

I'm not a brainwashed fool. I don't appreciate that. Thank you.

Just where exactly are you being called a brainwashed fool???

Yigeren
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14 Apr 2016, 3:03 pm

I think she interpreted what I said to mean that I actually think that people who pray are brainwashed fools. That's not what I meant, but I can understand the confusion.

I don't think that people in general who are religious or believe in God are brainwashed fools. It depends on the religion. Some of them do seem to be more like cults than religions.

Like a certain religion that has people such as Tom Cruise as followers. That one seems to be actually brainwashing its believers.

auntblabby
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14 Apr 2016, 3:49 pm

Yigeren wrote:

I don't think that people in general who are religious or believe in God are brainwashed fools. It depends on the religion. Some of them do seem to be more like cults than religions. Like a certain religion that has people such as Tom Cruise as followers. That one seems to be actually brainwashing its believers.

it's founder said the following about the subject of brainwashing-
"THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN CONTROL PEOPLE IS TO LIE TO THEM. You can write that down in your book in great big letters." -- L. Ron Hubbard Technique 88

Yigeren
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15 Apr 2016, 12:16 am

Yes, I'm really not sure why people follow that "religion." It's completely ridiculous, and seems to have been created to get money from stupid rich people. Or else he was crazy. In order to reach higher levels (or whatever they call them), people have to have donated certain amounts of money. I think it is supposed to take years and tons of money before all of the "secrets" are revealed.

I don't know how anyone can follow a "religion" invented by a science fiction writer. I could just as easily make something up, and say that it was "revealed" to me by some spiritual entity, and it would still be more believable than that crap. :roll:

auntblabby
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15 Apr 2016, 12:58 am

the religion was designed to attract wealthy full of themselves alphas and betas who want to be a bigger fish in a smaller pond. they assiduously court such people and treat them like royalty.

pcuser
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15 Apr 2016, 9:25 am

Yigeren wrote:

As long as we are talking crazy religions, we should give an honorable mention to that Utah religion. It was started by a con man just a step ahead of the law. This is factual if you want to look it up. He figured that if he went far enough away from society, he could get away with it. He was right...

MDD123
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15 Apr 2016, 11:52 am

I despise the notion that by making our laws more religious, one can gain favor with their god. That notion is as compatible with democracy as sharia law.

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Yigeren
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15 Apr 2016, 12:55 pm

MDD123 wrote:

I despise the notion that by making our laws more religious, one can gain favor with their god. That notion is as compatible with democracy as sharia law.

I agree.

Jacoby
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15 Apr 2016, 1:27 pm

One doesn't have to believe in any god to think murdering an unborn child is wrong

Yigeren
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15 Apr 2016, 1:49 pm

No, but technically it's not murder. And a child is not a child when it's a fetus.

I don't think it's wrong until the stage of development that would allow the fetus to have consciousness or to be able to survive on its own outside the womb. Until then, it's not a person, but only a potential person.

A current person is much more important to me than a potential person.

Edenthiel
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15 Apr 2016, 5:37 pm

Jacoby wrote:

One doesn't have to believe in any god to think murdering an unborn child is wrong

True, but one does need to *prove* that said life is indeed a child.

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Edenthiel
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15 Apr 2016, 5:42 pm

pcuser wrote:

Yigeren wrote:

I am so volunteering for the first Mars colony. I've studied Christianity my entire life & a fair quad-handful of other minor religions in the last decade or so. And one of my ongoing minor special interests are people who use religion to build their own subculture as well as gather wealth and power for themself. Mostly because I don't trust them to be in charge of America. Only problem I can see is they are all amazingly charismatic, to the point of being sociopaths. I'll need to work on that a bit once we get to the Red Planet and are awakened from our deep sleep...

< / joking! >

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