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Donald Trump is not a Bigot or Racist..

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Shahunshah
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08 Jan 2017, 5:27 pm

feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.


Why did you support Hillary?
The Clintons had experience working with a Republican congress from the 1990s. Bernie Sanders may be progressive but all of that is meaningless because he wouldn't be able to get a bill passed. When you take that away what you need is raw experience and skill to do a good job as president and that is what Hillary had.



feral botanist
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08 Jan 2017, 5:32 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.


Why did you support Hillary?
The Clintons had experience working with a Republican congress from the 1990s. Bernie Sanders may be progressive but all of that is meaningless because he wouldn't be able to get a bill passed. When you take that away what you need is raw experience and skill to do a good job as president and that is what Hillary had.



Fair enough. I couldn't vote for her. To me, she just seems like a middle of the road Republican from the 90s.

I would have liked to see Warren run.



Shahunshah
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08 Jan 2017, 5:35 pm

feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.


Why did you support Hillary?
The Clintons had experience working with a Republican congress from the 1990s. Bernie Sanders may be progressive but all of that is meaningless because he wouldn't be able to get a bill passed. When you take that away what you need is raw experience and skill to do a good job as president and that is what Hillary had.



Fair enough. I couldn't vote for her. To me, she just seems like a middle of the road Republican from the 90s.

I would have liked to see Warren run.
Remember that Clinton fought for Universal Healthcare in the 90s.

I would have supported not necessarily Warren but Jerry Brown or Biden over Clinton by a wide margin.

Tammy Duckworth and John Bel Edwards seem good for 2020.



feral botanist
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08 Jan 2017, 5:39 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.


Why did you support Hillary?
The Clintons had experience working with a Republican congress from the 1990s. Bernie Sanders may be progressive but all of that is meaningless because he wouldn't be able to get a bill passed. When you take that away what you need is raw experience and skill to do a good job as president and that is what Hillary had.



Fair enough. I couldn't vote for her. To me, she just seems like a middle of the road Republican from the 90s.

I would have liked to see Warren run.
Remember that Clinton fought for Universal Healthcare in the 90s.

I would have supported not necessarily Warren but Jerry Brown or Biden over Clinton by a wide margin.

Tammy Duckworth and John Bel Edwards seem good for 2020.


I do not know enough about them.

It seems like she has become a hawk, and a corporatist.

why did she give up on Universal Health Care, when she was in a place to push it forward? That would have swung a lot of votes.



Shahunshah
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08 Jan 2017, 5:53 pm

feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.


Why did you support Hillary?
The Clintons had experience working with a Republican congress from the 1990s. Bernie Sanders may be progressive but all of that is meaningless because he wouldn't be able to get a bill passed. When you take that away what you need is raw experience and skill to do a good job as president and that is what Hillary had.



Fair enough. I couldn't vote for her. To me, she just seems like a middle of the road Republican from the 90s.

I would have liked to see Warren run.
Remember that Clinton fought for Universal Healthcare in the 90s.

I would have supported not necessarily Warren but Jerry Brown or Biden over Clinton by a wide margin.

Tammy Duckworth and John Bel Edwards seem good for 2020.


I do not know enough about them.

It seems like she has become a hawk, and a corporatist.

why did she give up on Universal Health Care, when she was in a place to push it forward? That would have swung a lot of votes.

She faced too much opposition to the proposal. She ultimately couldn't pass it but she had an in depth developed plan for it and went to countries to learn about how their system could do a good job. Bernie Sanders is not to progressive himself. He voted against the Brady Bill which would allow for background checks for people purchasing firearms. Its weird that now he wants us to support him.



adifferentname
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08 Jan 2017, 5:54 pm

feral botanist wrote:
I'm sorry, I forgot you are mental contortionist. Any shape to be right.


Amazing counter-argument. Stunningly persuasive.

feral botanist wrote:
I love it! One data point to disprove all others. You my friend seem to have these magic data points, that carry so much more weight than all others. Bravo!


Again, brilliant points. You sure showed me!

feral botanist wrote:
adifferentname

One data point to rule them all, my precious! Don't through that one into Mount Doom!


The sad part is, you're never going to appreciate the irony.

Campin_Cat wrote:
This part is "sticky", for me----cuz, I've never understood when someone uses "monolith", in this regard. An -ist, to me, is someone who lumps lots of people / things together; so, does "monolith" mean, in this regard, something solid from which individual pieces can't be removed (as in, can't separate individual PEOPLE, from the mass)?


Pretty much, yep. It's one thing for (e.g.) black people to come together in unity as a sign of solidarity, but another entirely to tarnish them all as criminal because of the actions of some black people. Identitarians clearly understand this, yet choose to ignore it as it applies to positive traits in the supposedly advantaged group - because they can only be advantaged collectively if you treat them as a collective.

Quote:
No disrespect, intended, adifferentname----but, I gotta show my appreciation for this reference.


I might have joined you were it not shoe-horned clumsily into a p*ss-poor ad hominem.



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08 Jan 2017, 5:58 pm

adifferentname wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
I'm sorry, I forgot you are mental contortionist. Any shape to be right.


Amazing counter-argument. Stunningly persuasive.

feral botanist wrote:
I love it! One data point to disprove all others. You my friend seem to have these magic data points, that carry so much more weight than all others. Bravo!


Again, brilliant points. You sure showed me!

feral botanist wrote:
adifferentname

One data point to rule them all, my precious! Don't through that one into Mount Doom!


The sad part is, you're never going to appreciate the irony.

Campin_Cat wrote:
This part is "sticky", for me----cuz, I've never understood when someone uses "monolith", in this regard. An -ist, to me, is someone who lumps lots of people / things together; so, does "monolith" mean, in this regard, something solid from which individual pieces can't be removed (as in, can't separate individual PEOPLE, from the mass)?


Pretty much, yep. It's one thing for (e.g.) black people to come together in unity as a sign of solidarity, but another entirely to tarnish them all as criminal because of the actions of some black people. Identitarians clearly understand this, yet choose to ignore it as it applies to positive traits in the supposedly advantaged group - because they can only be advantaged collectively if you treat them as a collective.

Quote:
No disrespect, intended, adifferentname----but, I gotta show my appreciation for this reference.


I might have joined you were it not shoe-horned clumsily into a p*ss-poor ad hominem.



:lol:



feral botanist
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08 Jan 2017, 5:59 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.


Why did you support Hillary?
The Clintons had experience working with a Republican congress from the 1990s. Bernie Sanders may be progressive but all of that is meaningless because he wouldn't be able to get a bill passed. When you take that away what you need is raw experience and skill to do a good job as president and that is what Hillary had.



Fair enough. I couldn't vote for her. To me, she just seems like a middle of the road Republican from the 90s.

I would have liked to see Warren run.
Remember that Clinton fought for Universal Healthcare in the 90s.

I would have supported not necessarily Warren but Jerry Brown or Biden over Clinton by a wide margin.

Tammy Duckworth and John Bel Edwards seem good for 2020.


I do not know enough about them.

It seems like she has become a hawk, and a corporatist.

why did she give up on Universal Health Care, when she was in a place to push it forward? That would have swung a lot of votes.

She faced too much opposition to the proposal. She ultimately couldn't pass it but she had an in depth developed plan for it and went to countries to learn about how their system could do a good job. Bernie Sanders is not to progressive himself. He voted against the Brady Bill which would allow for background checks for people purchasing firearms. Its weird that now he wants us to support him.


I was talking about this election, if she had put UHC as part of her platform, I might have voted for her.

Bernie generally votes his conscience not necessarily what is popular.



Shahunshah
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08 Jan 2017, 6:02 pm

feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.


Why did you support Hillary?
The Clintons had experience working with a Republican congress from the 1990s. Bernie Sanders may be progressive but all of that is meaningless because he wouldn't be able to get a bill passed. When you take that away what you need is raw experience and skill to do a good job as president and that is what Hillary had.



Fair enough. I couldn't vote for her. To me, she just seems like a middle of the road Republican from the 90s.

I would have liked to see Warren run.
Remember that Clinton fought for Universal Healthcare in the 90s.

I would have supported not necessarily Warren but Jerry Brown or Biden over Clinton by a wide margin.

Tammy Duckworth and John Bel Edwards seem good for 2020.


I do not know enough about them.

It seems like she has become a hawk, and a corporatist.

why did she give up on Universal Health Care, when she was in a place to push it forward? That would have swung a lot of votes.

She faced too much opposition to the proposal. She ultimately couldn't pass it but she had an in depth developed plan for it and went to countries to learn about how their system could do a good job. Bernie Sanders is not to progressive himself. He voted against the Brady Bill which would allow for background checks for people purchasing firearms. Its weird that now he wants us to support him.


I was talking about this election, if she had put UHC as part of her platform, I might have voted for her.

Bernie generally votes his conscience not necessarily what is popular.
Why should she that would be manipulating the people with an unrealistic promise.

Well riddle me with this why has Bernie changed his positions from the 90s. Is he flip flopping?

If so is he a hypocrite.



Shahunshah
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08 Jan 2017, 6:05 pm

Hey adifferentname you see women ruled over men but here is the deal. 99.9% of women at the time were subjugated to men and Queen Victoria had no power.



feral botanist
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08 Jan 2017, 6:08 pm

feral botanist wrote:

I was talking about this election, if she had put UHC as part of her platform, I might have voted for her.

Bernie generally votes his conscience not necessarily what is popular.
Why should she that would be manipulating the people with an unrealistic promise.

Well riddle me with this why has Bernie changed his positions from the 90s. Is he flip flopping?

If so is he a hypocrite.[/quote]

I meant that as a promise to pursue

I can not say if he is or not. Did he change his beliefs because it a true change in beliefs or a change to get votes.



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08 Jan 2017, 6:10 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.

Well, I don't like to put what my EXACT political philosophy is, so that I'm free to argue both sides----but, I did NOT vote for EITHER Hillary OR PE Trump; and, I most CERTAINLY wouldn't vote for a self-proclaimed socialist (even-though, admittedly, I DID like him, a little).

I know everyone's free to argue both sides; but, IMO, if one labels themselves, then it's always gonna be: "Oh, you only think that, cuz you're a....."----and, why would I want to jeopardize the HOURS of entertainment I get, from the terribly unobservant / unimaginative that think they've got me pegged!! LOL

So----sorry----I know Aspies prefer exacts (myself, included)----but, I'm not willing to give ya, THIS one. FWIW, I really appreciate your asking, though----I'd much-Much-MUCH rather someone ASKS, than ASSUMES.




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08 Jan 2017, 6:14 pm

feral botanist wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Mikah wrote:
All this talk about averages and statistics yet people forget that Eastern Asians and Jews regularly top those tables, far outperforming whites. Yet no talk (at least not from the Left) about Asian Privilege and Jew Privilege. Perhaps, dear virtue-signaling progs, your cross hairs need realignment, or (just between you and me) admit your true motivations.



Asian privilege, is this all Asians? Do people of Philippino heritage have the same privilege as Korean heritage?

How about people of the Hmong heritage, do they have the same privilege as people of Japanese heritage?

I am not even going to touch "Jew privilege", whatever that is.

How do you mean ""out performing whites"? In bed? In the Olympics? At poker? That is a vague statement. Please lay out the specifics.


"I am not even going to touch "Jew privilege", whatever that is."

Why? Can't criticise people with lots of power I guess. Jews are the most privileged ethnic group in the US and 3 of the 4 most richest countries in the world are Asian/Arab, yet all we get poured into us is the myth of 'white privilege'.


First we are talking inside the US.

But, do all white people have power?


Next, the US has 41% of the worlds wealth. Those other three nations you mentioned are not even close.
http://fortune.com/2015/09/30/america-w ... nequality/

Why do you guys always try to hang your arguments on these misleading absolute numbers.


Oh OK white privilege only exists in the US where Jews are the most privileged ethnic group? Remind me, how much are the US in debt?


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feral botanist
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08 Jan 2017, 6:25 pm

JohnPowell wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
feral botanist wrote:
Mikah wrote:
All this talk about averages and statistics yet people forget that Eastern Asians and Jews regularly top those tables, far outperforming whites. Yet no talk (at least not from the Left) about Asian Privilege and Jew Privilege. Perhaps, dear virtue-signaling progs, your cross hairs need realignment, or (just between you and me) admit your true motivations.



Asian privilege, is this all Asians? Do people of Philippino heritage have the same privilege as Korean heritage?

How about people of the Hmong heritage, do they have the same privilege as people of Japanese heritage?

I am not even going to touch "Jew privilege", whatever that is.

How do you mean ""out performing whites"? In bed? In the Olympics? At poker? That is a vague statement. Please lay out the specifics.


"I am not even going to touch "Jew privilege", whatever that is."

Why? Can't criticise people with lots of power I guess. Jews are the most privileged ethnic group in the US and 3 of the 4 most richest countries in the world are Asian/Arab, yet all we get poured into us is the myth of 'white privilege'.


First we are talking inside the US.

But, do all white people have power?


Next, the US has 41% of the worlds wealth. Those other three nations you mentioned are not even close.
http://fortune.com/2015/09/30/america-w ... nequality/

Why do you guys always try to hang your arguments on these misleading absolute numbers.


Oh OK white privilege only exists in the US where Jews are the most privileged ethnic group? Remind me, how much are the US in debt?


strawman

I made no claims to white privilege outside the US.

How do you know that, as you say " ...jews are the most privileged ethnic group?"

The article does not specifically say that it is subtracting debt, but it does say that
"The jump was largely the result of households pumping up their personal savings efforts. The U.S."
So, if it is including savings, I would hope that it includes debt.



Shahunshah
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08 Jan 2017, 6:34 pm

Campin_Cat wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
Just asking but Campin Cat what are your political leanings? I myself supported Hillary Clinton right from the start even over Bernie Sanders. What about you.

Well, I don't like to put what my EXACT political philosophy is, so that I'm free to argue both sides----but, I did NOT vote for EITHER Hillary OR PE Trump; and, I most CERTAINLY wouldn't vote for a self-proclaimed socialist (even-though, admittedly, I DID like him, a little).

I know everyone's free to argue both sides; but, IMO, if one labels themselves, then it's always gonna be: "Oh, you only think that, cuz you're a....."----and, why would I want to jeopardize the HOURS of entertainment I get, from the terribly unobservant / unimaginative that think they've got me pegged!! LOL

So----sorry----I know Aspies prefer exacts (myself, included)----but, I'm not willing to give ya, THIS one. FWIW, I really appreciate your asking, though----I'd much-Much-MUCH rather someone ASKS, than ASSUMES.
Huh well I can kind of see where some of your political beliefs lie. But then again you might just be playing devil's advocate.

Sometimes I just don't know the answer. Often I have simultaneously argued that a significant part of the Republican party is racist but I have also argued the other way.



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08 Jan 2017, 6:44 pm

Shahunshah wrote:
Remember that Clinton fought for Universal Healthcare in the 90s. I would have supported not necessarily Warren but Jerry Brown or Biden over Clinton by a wide margin. Tammy Duckworth and John Bel Edwards seem good for 2020.

I would've supported VP Biden's nomination----almost ANYBODY, but Hillary!!







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I use caps for emphasis----I'm NOT angry or shouting. I use caps like others use italics, underline, or bold.
"What we know is a drop; what we don't know, is an ocean." (Sir Isaac Newton)