Buddhism

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ruveyn
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20 Mar 2009, 11:07 am

Shadowgirl wrote:

Read the Bible you'll see.

Read the Bible and you'll see a collection of stories, very few of which are based on fact.

ruveyn

TallyMan
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20 Mar 2009, 11:41 am

Shadowgirl wrote:

And no I'm not joking here. I am doing this under the direction of God himself.
So if your listening to me so far turn away and choose Jesus who is life.
To be a child of God pray this prayer but mean it with you heart

"Lord, thank you for sending Jesus Christ to die for my sins and rise from the dead so that I can know your forgiveness and live with you forever. Right now I ask him to be my savior so that I can live as the special creation that you intended me to be".

If you prayed that let me know so I can give you some resources in which to learn more.

I am impressed that you have bothered to reply. However, you seem to be under the impression that Buddhism is idolatry? Nothing could be further from the truth. Do you know anything about Buddhism?

Regarding Christianity and the Bible I was brought up a Christian and read the bible many years ago. Frankly Christianity is full of so many holes and illogic that I rejected it with good reason. I got sick of the excuses made by Christians for the truth discovered through scientific process, for example evolution is a fact, life wasn't created on Earth 6,000 years ago.

The God of the bible sounds like an ego maniac, psychotic almost, dolling out pain and punishment to all and sundry.

Another thing to bear in mind, when you quote the bible you are assuming that it even has any authority or truth in it. As far as I'm concerned it is just a collection of history, legends and myths all mixed up together. Christianity (and Islam) are just Santa and the tooth fairy for adults. People "believe" because it gives them a meaning in life, a sense of purpose and a sense of hope that there is more than this life, and maybe if they behave according to the bible there will be some reward in a place called heaven for them. Some people fall for this stuff, if it makes them feel better fine, however, it is still all just make believe. Belief or faith is just that - the denial of reason and the embracing of make-believe.

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twoshots
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21 Mar 2009, 9:45 pm

Well if it's good enough for the Mandelbrot set...

*click to embiggen!

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greenblue
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21 Mar 2009, 9:48 pm

ruveyn wrote:

Shadowgirl wrote:

Read the Bible you'll see.

Read the Bible and you'll see a collection of stories, very few of which are based on fact.

Read the Bible and you'll see the only truth worth believing.

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greenblue
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21 Mar 2009, 9:54 pm

Kilroy wrote:

probably the most interesting-and most realistic religion out there-any thoughts on it?

I don't know much about it, just a vague idea of it, but the ideas of karma and reincarnation didn't seem to be that much 'more realistic' compared to few aspects of Christianity to me to be honest, but given that I am not into it, to understand the aspects of Buddhism in general I very well may be getting it wrong, if I'm not mistaken, not all buddhists share the same views regarding these issues with reincarnation and karma, though it seems most may believe in karma as something mystical or metaphysical at least.

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Averick
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21 Mar 2009, 10:06 pm

twoshots wrote:

Well if it's good enough for the Mandelbrot set...

*click to embiggen!

Aw, the cookie monster. C is for cookie, yum enough for me..

TallyMan
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22 Mar 2009, 4:11 am

greenblue wrote:

if I'm not mistaken, not all buddhists share the same views regarding these issues with reincarnation and karma, though it seems most may believe in karma as something mystical or metaphysical at least.

Reincarnation is not part of Buddha's teachings. Reincarnation was the common view of Hinduism and the people at the time and place of Buddha's teaching; it has just got tagged on by the masses. Buddha himself made no assertions one way or the other; and rightly so. There is a famous conversation between a Zen master and a student that goes something like this:

Student: Master is there a life after death?
Zen master: I don't know.
Student: But you are a Zen master! How can you not know?
Zen master: I'm a Zen master, not a dead Zen master!

Regarding Karma I personally view this similar to the Christian view of treat others as you would have them treat you. Or in more prosaic language "What goes around comes around". In other words if you are kind and positive towards others then they tend to reciprocate. If you are mean and nasty with others then that is how they will treat you.

Somehow this principle has got etched into some cosmic principle called karma. Those who believe in reincarnation believe good or bad deeds can perpetuate beyond death and into their next life. However, as I say, reincarnation is more of a cultural add-on to Buddhism rather than a teaching.

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anna-banana
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22 Mar 2009, 7:28 am

ruveyn wrote:

Shadowgirl wrote:

Read the Bible you'll see.

Read the Bible and you'll see a collection of stories, very few of which are based on fact.

ruveyn

a good lie/gossip is always loosely based on facts. it's still no evidence though.

witness testimony is worthless evidence, just ask O.J.Simpson =p

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ThatRedHairedGrrl
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22 Mar 2009, 2:04 pm

What Tallyman said - the Buddha wouldn't answer questions on how the world got here, whether there was a God, or what happened after death, because, to use his metaphor, they were no more relevant to liberation than asking lots of questions about how some guy got a poison arrow in his foot was relevant to actually taking it out.

The absolute basics of Buddhism are the Four Noble Truths -

1 - Life is full of suffering and dissatisfaction.

2 - The reason we find it that way is because we try to hold on to stuff that's not permanent.

3 - We can overcome our suffering by realizing that nothing (including ourselves) is permanent, and so ceasing to hold on to it.

4 - Certain ways of thinking and behaving (known in Buddhism as the Eightfold Path) can help us to do this.

There's nothing there that requires any kind of belief. There's nothing in the first three that a little honest thought by anyone about their life and the world in general won't prove to be self-evident. And the fourth requires actual action, which is its own proof.

By the way, worshiping words in a book - without acknowledging, as Buddhism at least does of its images, that they're merely symbols of an infinite and inexpressible Reality - is idolatry.

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22 Mar 2009, 2:33 pm

I see ThatRedHairedGrrl just said most of what I wanted to say. If ShadowGirl wants to understand what she attacks, she could try listening to a podcast on the doctrine of no self.

Shadowgirl wrote:

Read the Bible you'll see.

Whenever I hear or read that advice, I think of this:

Quote:

Good point well made, Mr. Duncan. As you clearly say, it states in Leviticus Chapter 18 Verse 22 that homosexuality is an abomination. Which reminds me—there are a couple of things I need guidance on. Firstly, If I wanted to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7, how much could I expect to make from such a deal? Also, my colleague Pete insists on working on the sabbath. Exodus clearly says he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or is it OK to get some outside help? Lastly, does the whole city really have to be together to stone my brother John for planting different crops side by side? And when I burn my mother for wearing garments made from two different threads, do I torch her whole or just a bit?

The Book of Joshua also comes to mind, all about God the All Merciful instructing His Chosen People to evict those pesky squatters from the Promised Land by killing them all, and even stopping the sun and the moon for a day and a night so none could escape slaughter under cover of darkness. I see all three Abrahamic religions as inherently violent, because that's hard to avoid when claiming to have the one and only truth that all must believe.

greenblue wrote:

the ideas of karma and reincarnation didn't seem to be that much 'more realistic' compared to few aspects of Christianity

Strip away from Buddhism all the supernatural stuff, like karma, reincarnation, hells and heavens, which seems to have been added on after the Buddha's time anyway, and you have something sensible left. Buddhism then makes only a limited, realistic and testable claim, that you can make your own and other people's lives better if you apply the recommended methods.

DrizzleMan
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22 Mar 2009, 5:28 pm

Shadowgirl wrote:

Read the Bible you'll see.

Why don't you read the Dhammapada and tell me which part you disagree with?

This is the first chapter:

Buddha wrote:

What we are is the result of what we have thought,
is built by our thoughts, is made up of our thoughts.
If one speaks or acts with an impure thought,
suffering follows one,
like the wheel of the cart follows the foot of the ox.

What we are is the result of what we have thought,
is built by our thoughts, is made up of our thoughts.
If one speaks or acts with a pure thought,
happiness follows one,
like a shadow that never leaves.

"They insulted me; they hurt me;
they defeated me; they cheated me."
In those who harbor such thoughts,
hate will never cease.

"They insulted me; they hurt me;
they defeated me; they cheated me."
In those who do not harbor such thoughts,
hate will cease.

For hate is never conquered by hate.
Hate is conquered by love.
This is an eternal law.
Many do not realize that we must all come to an end here;
but those who do realize this, end their quarrels at once.

Whoever lives only for pleasures,
with senses uncontrolled,
immoderate in eating, lazy, and weak,
will be overthrown by Mara,
like the wind throws down a weak tree.

Whoever lives not for pleasures,
with senses well controlled,
moderate in eating, has faith and the power of virtue,
will not be overthrown by Mara,
any more than the wind throws down a rocky mountain.

Whoever would put on the yellow robe
without having cleansed oneself from impurity,
disregarding self-control and truth,
is not deserving of the yellow robe.

But whoever has cleansed oneself from impurity,
is well grounded in all the virtues,
and is possessed of self-control and truth,
is deserving of the yellow robe.

Those who imagine truth in untruth
and see untruth in truth
never arrive at truth but follow vain desires.
Those who know truth as truth and untruth as untruth
arrive at truth and follow true desires.

As rain makes its way into a badly roofed house,
so passion makes its way into an unreflecting mind.
As rain does not make its way into a well roofed house,
so passion does not make its way into a reflecting mind.

Wrong-doers grieve in this world,
and they grieve in the next; they grieve in both.
They grieve and are afflicted
when they see the wrong they have done.

The virtuous find joy in this world,
and they find joy in the next; they find joy in both.
They find joy and are glad
when they see the good they have done.

Wrong-doers suffer in this world,
and they suffer in the next; they suffer in both.
They suffer when they think of the wrong they have done.
They suffer even more when going on the wrong path.

The virtuous are happy in this world,
and they are happy in the next; they are happy in both.
They are happy when they think of the good they have done.
They are even happier when going on the good path.

Even if the thoughtless can recite many of the scriptures,
if they do not act accordingly,
they are not living the holy life,
but are like a cowherd counting the cows of others.

Even if the faithful can recite
only a few of the scriptures,
if they act accordingly,
having given up passion, hate, and folly,
being possessed of true knowledge and serenity of mind,
craving nothing in this world or the next,
they are living the holy life.

http://www.san.beck.org/Dhammapada.html

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Strangerthanfiction
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24 Mar 2009, 9:26 am

Hi, new Aspie user, and a Buddhist in the Tibetan traditions for the last 25 years.

Tallyman has it right; many of the ideas that people have of Buddhism are really just reflections of how it's seen through the awful 'western occult' teachings, promoted by Theosophy. Despite what some are trying to do in the west in terms of trying to make comparisons between Christianity and Buddhism, the two are in no way compatible. The moralisitc teachings of basic Mahayana are far from being indicative of Buddhist thought, and are simply one approach of many to the path.

STF

TallyMan
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24 Mar 2009, 11:16 am

Strangerthanfiction wrote:

Hi, new Aspie user, and a Buddhist in the Tibetan traditions for the last 25 years.

Welcome to WP.

There are one or two on here with Buddhist inclinations.

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monkees4va
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25 Mar 2009, 10:32 am

I admire the religion of buddhism. I think it takes a great personal commitment. If I decided to follow a faith, this would be it.

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25 Mar 2009, 6:30 pm

hi there recommend you read the dhammapada.Buddhism is a philosophy not a religion there is no god and the buddha didnt profess to be different to anyone.

Strangerthanfiction
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28 Mar 2009, 4:30 am

TallyMan wrote:

Strangerthanfiction wrote:

Hi, new Aspie user, and a Buddhist in the Tibetan traditions for the last 25 years.

Welcome to WP.

There are one or two on here with Buddhist inclinations.

Thanks:) What tradition do you follow yourself?

STF

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