Controversial and/or Unpopular, Personal/Political opinions
funeralxempire
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N0TTATW1ZTY wrote:
I firmly believe that once the MAGA cult destroys itself and all the old people clinging to power (including Trump) die out the younger far left crazies getting into power will destroy what's left of the US.
This feels to me like a repeat in history. A cross between the Soviets taking over East Germany after the Nazis were crushed in World War 2 and Mao Zedong manipulating China's naive young population into turning on their elders and academics, violently, during the Cultural Revolution.
I never believed this kind of BS could happen to my country.
This feels to me like a repeat in history. A cross between the Soviets taking over East Germany after the Nazis were crushed in World War 2 and Mao Zedong manipulating China's naive young population into turning on their elders and academics, violently, during the Cultural Revolution.
I never believed this kind of BS could happen to my country.
There's another potential way things could go wrong.
The far-left "crazies" enact some extreme policies like single payer healthcare for all or other policies like they advocate for and the reaction from certain sectors of the population destroys what's left.
There's some pretty big differences from the analogies you make, mostly that if the left come to power in the US, it will likely be via the ballot box and that tends to tame authoritarian tendencies compared to the typical situation after an armed revolution.
The American Revolution played a huge role in driving early Anglo settlement in my country; the violence towards loyalists resulted in an exodus of the United Empire Loyalists to Canada and the Maritimes. This is likely why so much of Canadians national identity even now is specifically tied to not being American.
_________________
There's no such thing as a free market.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.
funeralxempire wrote:
N0TTATW1ZTY wrote:
I firmly believe that once the MAGA cult destroys itself and all the old people clinging to power (including Trump) die out the younger far left crazies getting into power will destroy what's left of the US.
This feels to me like a repeat in history. A cross between the Soviets taking over East Germany after the Nazis were crushed in World War 2 and Mao Zedong manipulating China's naive young population into turning on their elders and academics, violently, during the Cultural Revolution.
I never believed this kind of BS could happen to my country.
This feels to me like a repeat in history. A cross between the Soviets taking over East Germany after the Nazis were crushed in World War 2 and Mao Zedong manipulating China's naive young population into turning on their elders and academics, violently, during the Cultural Revolution.
I never believed this kind of BS could happen to my country.
There's another potential way things could go wrong.
The far-left "crazies" enact some extreme policies like single payer healthcare for all or other policies like they advocate for and the reaction from certain sectors of the population destroys what's left.
There's some pretty big differences from the analogies you make, mostly that if the left come to power in the US, it will likely be via the ballot box and that tends to tame authoritarian tendencies compared to the typical situation after an armed revolution.
The American Revolution played a huge role in driving early Anglo settlement in my country; the violence towards loyalists resulted in an exodus of the United Empire Loyalists to Canada and the Maritimes. This is likely why so much of Canadians national identity even now is specifically tied to not being American.
It's funny that you bring up the loyalists and American Revolution. My homestate happens to be Georgia, a state that was once one of the original 13 colonies named after King George II.
And Georgia was originally a 'loyalist' state to the crown. But got suckered into fighting for the American side I guess.
Also another weird thing I read somewhere online is that when Georgia was first founded as a colony they were originally against slavery and had banned it but somehow became pro-slavery shortly after it was founded.
I guess human greed ruins everything.
funeralxempire
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N0TTATW1ZTY wrote:
I guess human greed ruins everything.
100%, whether it's greed for wealth or for power.
I can see a colony initially opposing slavery because they wish to be egalitarian, only for a few people to realize they can get a lot richer if they start relying on slavery, putting everyone who doesn't participate in it at an economic disadvantage that effectively coerces more people into degrading themselves through the ownership of their fellow man.
Loyalists made up like a third of the population of the colonies at that time so there were a lot of them. I feel like in some ways Manifest Destiny was doomed by the same act that enabled it (the revolution both enabled that mindset to sink in, but also created a population that were bound to resist it).
_________________
There's no such thing as a free market.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.
Yugoslav1945
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Joined: 28 Dec 2023
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Gender: Male
Posts: 590
Location: Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia
funeralxempire wrote:
How much power did the proletariat actually wield in any of the Leninist bureaucratic dictatorships? It sure seems like in practice all of the power was concentrated in the hands of party apparatchiks who neither represented the workers nor were able to be held responsible by the workers.
This is one of the core shortcomings of Leninism and why it inevitably ends up as something that would more fairly be described as red fascism than as anything resembling socialism. You can't have a state that's aligned with the workers interests if it's ran by a party with zero responsibility to the workers and that instead dictates to the workers what their interests are.
An inversion of democracy isn't democratic and the end result is just replacing one self-serving ruling class (capitalists, landlords and oligarchs) with another ruling class (apparatchiks and bureaucrats).
This is one of the core shortcomings of Leninism and why it inevitably ends up as something that would more fairly be described as red fascism than as anything resembling socialism. You can't have a state that's aligned with the workers interests if it's ran by a party with zero responsibility to the workers and that instead dictates to the workers what their interests are.
An inversion of democracy isn't democratic and the end result is just replacing one self-serving ruling class (capitalists, landlords and oligarchs) with another ruling class (apparatchiks and bureaucrats).
1. Stalin tried to resign multiple times from his position as the General Secretary but was unanimously rejected. In 1927, he said: "What could I do? Desert my post? That is not in my nature; I have never deserted any post, and I have no right to do so, for that would be desertion. As I have already said before, I am not a free agent, and when the Party imposes an obligation upon me, I must obey.". It was not an act to garner sympathy, it was an act of dignity because he was embarrassed by the "will" that was read in the 13th Congress in May 1924. He tried to resign two more times in 1926 and 1927, and one more time in 1952 which was also rejected. These were no mindless "party apparatchiks" as the opposition (liberals, anarchist, and the West) claims.
2. The unified power of the state of the USSR belonged to the Supreme Soviet which was the highest supreme state organ of the power (Article 30, 1936 constitution). Politburo was the highest executive authority elected by the Central Committee. Day-to-day micromanagement was conducted by the Secretariat. Each Union Republic had its own Constitution, which took into account the specific features of the Republic and was drawn up in full conformity with the all-Union Constitution (Article 16). Legislative elections were held in the USSR from 1922 to 1989, regional ones from 1938 to 1990, local ones from 1922 to 1927.
3. In March 17th, 1991, an union-wide referendum was held in which the populace were asked about preserving the USSR. 77% of the people voted "Yes" on preserving the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. However, after that, Gorbachov tried to host a ceremony in decentralizing the USSR which led to an attempt to save USSR one last time in August 1991 by the loyalists to the Motherland who put Gorbachov under house arrest (should have executed him on spot there though). The people wanted USSR preserved, not regressed as Gorbachov intended. In the end, the Western-backed nationalists triumphed in the USSR and it was dissolved. Russia is far worse without socialism and many people in Russia are very nostalgic about the USSR because of the socioeconomic hardship Russia underwent in 1990s and now is going in the 2020s due to an oligarchy created as a result of pro-Western Yeltsin.
4. The last part you concern of tells me that you think socialism will inevitably lead to just capitalism again. You've called the socialist ideal "fascistic" (red fascism) and have defined socialism in a liberal framework and not within its own framework established by Marx, Engels, Lenin, and Stalin. Socialism does not rely on core principles from Joe Biden or Barack Obama or Jens Stoltenberg or Keir Starmer (as right-wingers and far-right tend to label) that you think are more valid than Marx, Engels, Lenin, and Stalin.
_________________
"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."
- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)
funeralxempire
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Yugoslav1945 wrote:
The last part you concern of tells me that you think socialism will inevitably lead to just capitalism again. You've called the socialist ideal "fascistic" (red fascism) and have defined socialism in a liberal framework and not within its own framework established by Marx, Engels, Lenin, and Stalin. Socialism does not rely on core principles from Joe Biden or Barack Obama or Jens Stoltenberg or Keir Starmer (as right-wingers and far-right tend to label) that you think are more valid than Marx, Engels, Lenin, and Stalin.
I'm not sure what the liberals you name have to do with socialism, given that they're not socialists by any worthwhile definition. You're claiming that 'I think they're more valid than Marx, etc' without any basis whatsoever.
As for Lenin, Stalin, Mao, etc, they're also not worthwhile thought leaders considering what they established is a deformed parody of socialism at best and can more fairly be viewed as state capitalism. In practice they're no more useful as role models for socialism than the liberals you mentioned.
Leninism isn't the socialist ideal, it's a disaster. Only Leninists would insist that Leninism is the socialist ideal or that Leninism is the only correct path for socialists to consider. You should read what Emma Goldman had to say about Lenin's failed experiment, considering that she lived under it for many years and was initially enthusiastic to participate in it.
I understand your special interest is nostalgia for an authoritarian dictatorship, but that doesn't mean an authoritarian dictatorship is a desirable society to live under for anyone who isn't viewing it through the lens of a special interest.
_________________
There's no such thing as a free market.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.
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