James Brady Dead At 74.

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And what would your reason be? Be sure to actually show how your ideas would achieve what you want, not just make claims and appeals to emotion/"common sense".

Also, if the Dems are gun controllers because they think it gets them votes, they're even dumber than I thought, as it's a political loser with a massive passion gap that's been costing them elections since the early 90s, at least the GOP gets votes out of their sops to social conservatism.



Yeah, after I rubbed your nose in it for months and dragged that agreement out of you with hot pliers...



You have a very different definition of the word 'fact' than most people. I'd ask you what makes him better, but you'd just lie and distort and draw moral equivalencies, like you always do.



Lincoln actually took risks, he didn't hem and haw and hedge until the political winds got so clear that he couldn't help but go along with them; Obama was. at best, a fair weather friend to the LGBT movement, though he probably did better than Hillary would have. Of course Dick Cheney was way ahead of him years ago when that was actually a risky position for a high ranking Republican to hold, gay kid or not, but at least Barry got their eventually, right?

Jesus, you're trying grades school psychology on me now?

You think I haven't? I've repeatedly mentioned over the years that I came from an anti-gun household and repeated all the tropes right up until my mid teens, when I actually started to learn about guns and form my own opinions, which involved investigating the arguments for gun control and realizing that they were all BS. In fact, I've regularly solicited gun controllers here on WP to post their best ideas in hopes of actually finding someone who's actually thought the issue through, all in vain.



In case you haven't noticed, that's why I argue against their premise, going through point by point and explaining how/why things wouldn't work, and pointing out when ideas are based on a lack of knowledge or faulty information; what I do not do is say "gun controllers are bad people who only want to take everyone's guns so the state can take over", which is more in your style. That's my biggest problem with gun control advocates, they don't argue rationally, they argue from emotion, they use loaded language, they attempt to manipulate people, and they don't know their subject, and yet expect to be taken seriously by those of us who do know and who argue correctly. It's telling that you can't seem to make the distinction.



I find your posts useful for making an example of, as they so elegantly demonstrate all the pitfalls of partisanship, and how factually bankrupt the anti-gun position is.

Don't flatter yourself and that is all now in the past tense, anyway.


There is again. You're taking a very small minority of kooks that just happen to also own guns and lowering the bar for all gun owners. I just had RO duty today so where were all the kooks?


Oh f**k the far right. Why does everyone that's right of left have to be labeled a zealot? We're not all as partisan as you.

Dox-

As for rubbing my nose in anything - -don't flatter yourself.
And the gun rights crowd doesn't use emotion? Really? Even if you don't personally think the government is going to take our guns to impose tyranny, plenty of gun rights activists do - to the point of paranoia.
As for the Democrats being stupid to support gun control to counter the Republicans on that point - if so, it's no more stupid than Republicans and libertarians opposing gay rights, and having an abysmal record on civil rights for minorities, just because the Democrats support them.
Now, what is conceivably wrong with keeping guns out of the hands of unqualified people (the mentally ill, those with felony convictions)? Because THAT IS ALL I ADVOCATE!

Why, I'm positively heartbroken you don't really think highly of me.
And sure, most Republicans are not affiliated with the far right of their party - but the obvious fact is, it's the far right that has gotten out of their straight jackets and are running your party at the moment. The rest of you seem content to just say, "Well, that's those loonies over there, it's not me," and pretend they have no bearing on the life of the nation. Boehner and McConnel have tried to harness the right's populace power, only to find their allies purged from the party, and have put their own positions of power in danger. It's not that all Republicans are insane - far from it - but too many Republicans refuse to take responsibility for their party's new masters by refusing to stand up to them.

This one isn't addressed to me but tuff s**t, I'm gonna field it anyway.....

Believe it or not, it's not uncommon for new gun owners to entertain that question. However, most of them reason it out and come to the conclusion that gun control is BS for all the reasons we've been hashing out over and over on this forum for several years now.


Are you daft? Go back though all these gunz-r-bad threads we've had and find one rational argument in favor of gun control. I dare you.
By your logic someone could rationalize not only mandatory voter picture ID cards but a written test to determine whether someone's intellect was up to the task of voting. Hey, democracy is nothing to take lightly and voting plays a big part in that you know so we have to make sure everyone is legit and up to the task.
That sounds like obstructionist BS to me the same as gun control but you're too partisan to agree that both are.


You don?t offer a well thought out response is what it is. I?ve been hammered for this numerous times but at least I make an effort and I don?t just tag everything liberal = 100 % bad conservative = 100% good.

Last edited by Raptor on 10 Aug 2014, 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Whatever....


And the democrats are clean and beyond reproach?
I wonder how many hits I'd get if I just googled "dirty democrat". Some of them would be BS but only some of them.

2005: New Orleans after Katrina comes to mind.
As for the anti's just on WP, the emotion about gun control has entered the realm of absolute hysteria in some cases. And don't pull the Asperger's card for them, either. They knowingly entered a political discussion forum and voluntarily put their two cents worth in. You know we dont have these debates in the Open Autism forum or The Haven.


So two wrongs now make a right is what you're saying?


Learn the existing laws first before making yourself look foolish by asking for what already exists.

I'm not talking about corruption which no one approves of, I'm talking about plain insanity, such as denial of science (evolution, climate change, etc.), justification of rolling back voting rights, birtherism, promoting corporate personhood, talk of "legitimate rape," and so much more that calls one's sanity into question.
And Katrina? Please explain that one to me, other than the notion that shooting into the hurricane would somehow help.
And two wrongs don't make a right? While countering the opposite party plank is one thing, the fact remains, gun control still is about keeping bad or mentally infirmed people from having firearms. How is denial of a person to take part in the political system, or denial of the right to marry because of ethnicity or sexual orientation at all morally comparable?
And sure, emotion comes into the issue from both side of the gun control debate. Just because you don't write insane things about the government trying to seize citizens guns in order to introduce a dictatorship hardly means others are completely sane on the subject.
As far as placing the same restrictions on voting as on firearm ownership - the fact is, voting tests and most ID laws have only been used to keep certain groups, like African Americans, away from the polls and powerless. When have gun control laws been used to discriminate against a particular group? Oh, wait, that's right; Ronald Reagan had pushed through gun control laws in the '60's to keep guns out of the hands of black civil rights activists.

Yeah yeah whatever. I'm sure you're right and the GOP is actually the Nazi party re-emerged to take over the world. That's not what this is about.


This. \/. I'll admit upfront that it's an NRA publication but I'm sure you'll dismiss it as staged for propaganda purposes and/or that the confiscations were somehow justified.
[/quote][youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q2BXH0JfOc[/youtube]


Again, go look up the Jim Crow laws and black codes from the old days and note that gun control was a part of that. I don't see much point exerting much more effort on you. You'r partisanship is much worse than I had thought before now and that's no compliment..

who is mentally ill? who decides what it is. there a good number of people who say anyone with aspergers is mentally ill. theres a number of people who feel anyone not normal is mentally ill. there are some polticians that would classify all kinds of people as mentally ill. they try to change the system of revoking rights. currently its by a judge in a court case. but they want to make it so just a doctor can decide. take anti depressants can lead to you losing them even though you pose no threat to yourself or others.

coffee addiction can be considered a mentally illiness.

I don't want dangerous people to have guns, but the problem is how to tell if someone is dangerous. most don't show any signs until they do the act. which is why there are those people who just want to blanket ban anyone with any disorder from having a gun, but that doesn't even hit the core, even normal people can snap, its not a aspie thing its not a depression thing, its a people thing, people do bad things, people snap from emotional troubles. I can't think of a way of stopping them then what we already have. watch for signs, if enough signs show, bring it to a court.

then te problem is the court says the person can't have guns, but it is never put in the system. the left screams that to fix the problem we need to do universal background checks. but all that does is expand the broken system. so now when I sell a gun to the person I do a background check, he comes up clean even though he isn't suppose to have one. the problem wasn't fixed but the left doesn't care until the next shooting where they will scream for gun bans, again ignoring the broken system.

quite a few of the shooters were bared from buying guns but passed background checks.

I also thinkg that just being depressed shouldn't lead to losing gun rights, people can be depressed without being a threat. all this causes is a fear of seeking help. really we need to fix the system and laws we have, but that's real hard work for congress. they would rather just make new useless laws cause it's easier. same reason as why they won't fix problems with ACA its too hard to go back in and try to fix the law. so they try to repeal it or just leave it as is and do executive orders.

as long as we ignore the real problems nothing will change and the fight will continue endlessly.

I was going to respond, and then I realized that I couldn't get much more clear without breaking the ToS, which I feel that I've already pushed to the limit here, so I'm going to let people draw their own conclusions.

I'm with sly on concern about people with mental illness being denied access to a firearm because they "might"be a danger.More mentally ill are the victims of crimes than the perps.Only a few commit serious crimes.I take medication,see a mind doctor,so my concern is I would be singled out to lose my right to protect myself.
I also don't see how all the guns that are out their can be registered,most here just pass from individual to individual,don't see how that can be regulated.Say IF a census taker starts asking people how many guns are in a house people would just lie.
Drugs are illegal,yet there are more of them than ever,so if guns were ever made illegal(I don't believe that will ever happen) they would still be bountiful.
More money for the treatment and diagnosis of the mentally ill would save more lives.Help people before they become a danger to themselves or others,help to end the stigma so people can get help with out feeling shame

This has turned into the forever argument, that is going on and on without end. I've been responding out of ego - that is, I don't want to back down, especially over a stupid argument like this - while others have reasons to continue this war of words for that I think go beyond sanity.. C'mon, lets just say goodbye to James Brady instead of hooping and hollering about political positions.
My fault - I promised I wouldn't get dragged into this argument again, and here I am...

with recent actions in California and NY, and talk of changing tthe laws federally and such . I can't go to a counselor for my issues. not even the abuse ones. I even fear trying to get anxiety meds. better to keep my rights and deal with it like people in the past did then try to get help and lose them.

i'm not as bad as others, but not normal either.

Don't ever mention any mental health issues to your auto insurance provider,on the health part of the form I said I was bipolar,which got me a higher rate. There was no way they would have known if I hadn't been stupidly honest.
I told my therapist I purchased a gun for protection,I've had him for years and he wasn't concerned so no one else should be,he knows there was a home invasion next door,and that I have a squirrelly ex.