For those of you against BLM

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How was I ever derogatory to Holmes? All I said was that he was young, and that his opinions will evolve over time. As mine have evolved over time.

Never called him a "white activist," either. Just expressed hope that he wasn't one. No implication there.

If he had said that he hopes I'm not a liberal or even a Communist, I wouldn't have objected. I would have defended myself, though, for I'm no Communist, and am only somewhat of a liberal.

You just don't like me because I don't agree with you on things. You calling me a troll is a rhetorical device. You just want to defend your buddy.

And of course I can depend upon a cherry-picking here....go for it, Sir!

Of course there is no relationship between people's prejudices and the places they grow up in! But, oh, we can certainly say blacks are all potentially violent because they stereotypically hail from violent neighborhoods!

Case in point.

Okay, here we go. From this thread alone:

"Hey buddy-boy, that's no way to talk to somebody."
"Come back here in ten years. I wonder what you would think then."
"Why can't you at least consider another viewpoint other than your own? That's part of being an intelligent person."
"You don't bother to read much of what I write."

I'll refrain from quoting examples from the other thread, seeing as Walrus saw fit to shut it down, but these are examples of the tone of condescension that has been a feature of your dealings with L_Holmes.



You still haven't satisfactorily explained what you meant by "an advocate for "white rights".". As mentioned, I consider myself an advocate for the rights of people of all hues, see nothing intrinsically wrong with being such, so I must assume you were imploring him not to be a specific type of advocate.

N.B.Yes, you implored rather than "expressed hope". There's a world of difference between the two.



You have literally no idea what my opinion is of you personally. What you can be certain of, however, is that I find fault with your belittling of another user on the grounds of age or presumed inexperience. I have repeatedly challenged the opinions you have expressed as that is where my sole interest lies.



Me pointing out that your actions resemble trolling is most certainly not a rhetorical device. Much as it may pain your ego to do so, I must advise that you "consider another viewpoint other than your own" in this matter.

This is my perspective. You have repeatedly targeted L_Holmes posts without offering anything in the way of a rebuttal beyond "I know black people because I know black people", repeatedly spoken to him in a derogatory manner, questioned the validity of his perspective based on supposition, and then responded as you did when you finally provoked him into responding in an emotional manner.

Collectively, your interactions with L_Holmes have been entirely consistent with the behaviour known as "concern trolling". The guy is trying to discuss an issue that is of clear import to him, and your contribution has effectively been "look, I'm sort of on your side, but I think you're wrong because ad hominem, ad hominem, ad hominem".

As for characterising him as my "buddy". I don't know L_Holmes from Adam. I can, however, empathise with the plight of someone whose views are discarded on the grounds of age and inexperience. Were I to approach that subject in the manner you have approached this one with L_Holmes, I might suggest that you're simply too old to remember what that's like.



You can depend upon further scoffing at the unfounded assertion. One of the benefits of my habit of Fisking is that it is impossible for anyone to reasonably assert that I am in the habit of cherry-picking or skimming. If you have even the slightest doubt on that score, I invite you to read through my entire post history.

Hilarious. Do I need to report you too?

Well then it is my personal experience that you are being incredibly condescending and are making no point. You are not addressing any of my arguments, and instead are making ad hominem attacks, and are trying to give me your stupid advice. You are totally ignorant. That is my honest experience, so you cannot just dismiss it out of hand, can you?


How childish can you get? "I hope somebody calls you stupid!" Well, I'm sure it will happen at some point, so congratulations.


That is actually genuinely hilarious Logic only goes so far... perhaps, but you seem to think it doesn't even extend into reality. Nobody cares about your personal experience. It is worthless in this discussion. But you can't handle that, so instead you whine about how it SHOULD matter, how we're being mean, bla bla bla. "Stop invalidating my subjective experience with facts and logic! My feelings matter more than making valid arguments!"


Yes, cling to your irrational beliefs, and take them somewhere else. They don't belong here.

You're making ad hominem attacks against me. Much more extreme than any supposed ones that I made toward you,

You called me stupid and ignorant in your anger. I would NEVER call a person those things. I don't know why I upset you so much.

You don't know me, Sir....who are YOU to call me those things?

Why don't we call it a day? We just have a difference of PHILOSOPHY. And you took it to extremes.

Life is like that.

I am out of this discussion....truly. No purpose is served.

I'm not holding you back.

Sure, I've been lucky to have been born in, and continue to reside in, a very progressive state.

Not stereotypically, statistically. That is undeniable. Can you show me the statistic that proves your assertion that people from Missouri are racists?

Most people from Missouri are not racists.

It's partially my fault for keeping this thing alive--but I find that this thread should fade away gracefully, like Douglas McArthur desired for himself.

You're about to be very disappointed.


Obviously it was a rhetorical question, so I wasn't actually asking for any statistic or answer. Kraichgauer's comment about me was utterly moronic, and I find it interesting that many of the supposed anti-racists here don't seem to care about his racism all that much.

So stereotyping a person is only really wrong if it's done to a person of color, right? Don't criticize the guy who is making completely unfair judgements based on my skin color. I'm white, so judging me based on my race is more acceptable. That's the unspoken rule, isn't it?

Seriously, the level of hypocrisy here. If I was a black guy being told, "a certain someone's upbringing in the ghetto has colored their perception of white Americans", or something similar, you and many others would have a much stronger reaction to that statement than the equivalent one made about me. It would be completely different. Even though both comments are equally unfair and irrelevant to the discussion, one color of racism always seems to get way more attention than any other.

And do you know why it gets more attention? I'll tell you: it's called RACISM. Hey, how's that for irony? White people are so riddled with white guilt, they constantly feel the need to reaffirm to themselves that they are not a racist. So how do they do that? They do it by being condescendingly and vehemently defensive of black people regardless of the situation or circumstances, and treat blacks like they are children, or as if they are disabled in some way. They look down on them and pity them. They talk about how facts invalidate the experience of these poor, poor blacks. They think they know what most black people experience and think, simply because they have a few black friends.

And of course, they love race-baiting. Case in point:


Hint: he's referring to me, a 20-year-old white liberal who has said nothing racist whatsoever. If it still somehow isn't clear what is going on here: a man who claims to be anti-racism is openly stating that, in his view, because I am white and live in Missouri... I must be racist towards blacks. No mention of anything I said; my skin color and general location are apparently the only things that matter here.

Yeah, f**k whites.

Kraichgauer: Find something better to do with your time; you are adding nothing of value to this discussion. Hey, here's a suggestion: why don't you go jerk off to some black or mixed race porn? Maybe it will help you cope with your white guilt. Don't watch the BDSM though; seeing a person of color being whipped by a muscle-bound skinhead might be too much for you to handle.

Well, it looks like this discussion has run its course and descended into personal squabbling. I don't think there's any chance of this getting back on-topic. I'm going to review the whole thing now.