23 Jul 2023, 11:23 am
23 Jul 2023, 11:24 am
funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2023, 11:28 am
funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2023, 11:30 am
Fnord wrote:
Again, most people seem to have no idea how much effort goes into being successful -- they only see the rewards.
Everyone likes to ignore that luck contributes to their successes, even when they can recognize that luck contributes to others successes.
23 Jul 2023, 11:31 am
funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2023, 11:32 am
23 Jul 2023, 11:34 am
funeralxempire wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Again, most people seem to have no idea how much effort goes into being successful -- they only see the rewards.
Everyone likes to ignore that luck contributes to their successes, even when they can recognize that luck contributes to others successes.
Luck has gone into mine but to utilize it I still had to put the work in and by work I mean........a lot.
Luck is mostly only one of many factors. Lottery winners are a good example. Many of them are as lucky as can be, we all dream of winning the lottery afterall but that being said, many lottery winners end up bankrupt because they just didn't know how to make to keep money.
Keeping money is perhaps more important than making money.
funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2023, 11:46 am
Nades wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Again, most people seem to have no idea how much effort goes into being successful -- they only see the rewards.
Everyone likes to ignore that luck contributes to their successes, even when they can recognize that luck contributes to others successes.
Luck has gone into mine but to utilize it I still had to put the work in and by work I mean........a lot.
Luck is mostly only one of many factors. Lottery winners are a good example. Many of them are as lucky as can be, we all dream of winning the lottery afterall but that being said, many lottery winners end up bankrupt because they just didn't know how to make to keep money.
Keeping money is perhaps more important than making money.
The two compliment each other. Hard work is always part of how one takes advantage of luck, but that doesn't mean that luck isn't an important factor.
Being born into one household vs. another one is a matter of luck. Being in the right place for certain career paths is a matter of luck. Being charismatic, attractive or both is a matter of luck. Being brighter than average is a matter of luck, so is being below average.
All of those factors help contribute to one's outcomes, but none of them are the result of hard work.
Even if 'there's programs for the disabled' there's always a question of who counts and who doesn't. How profoundly disabled does one need to be? What if they're more profoundly disabled than has been recognized? Do we just ignore everyone who's below average, but not enough below to be profoundly disabled?
It seems like we're expected to ignore that we're not all actually equal and that as a result, outcomes aren't simply a matter of how hard one worked. Anyone who struggles must be at fault, and no matter how hard they actually work they just need to work a little harder because there couldn't possibly be more to their failures, they're just lazy.
It's a childishly naive mindset that shows a deep ignorance of actual peoples realities.
23 Jul 2023, 11:49 am
23 Jul 2023, 11:51 am
funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2023, 11:52 am
TenMinutes wrote:
I'll put my hard work up against a capitalist any day. I've worked a hard, stressful job for decades. In the first three years of my highest-paid employment I saved my employer enough money to employ me my entire carreer.
But now I get to be lectured about hard work by people.
But now I get to be lectured about hard work by people.
Don't you know, dismissing your entire lifetime of hardwork isn't a person attack.
But dismissing that (uninformed and personally insulting) opinion as unfounded is a personal attack.
Totally reasonable.
funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2023, 11:56 am
23 Jul 2023, 11:58 am
Relevant lol.
23 Jul 2023, 12:00 pm
funeralxempire wrote:
Nades wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Again, most people seem to have no idea how much effort goes into being successful -- they only see the rewards.
Everyone likes to ignore that luck contributes to their successes, even when they can recognize that luck contributes to others successes.
Luck has gone into mine but to utilize it I still had to put the work in and by work I mean........a lot.
Luck is mostly only one of many factors. Lottery winners are a good example. Many of them are as lucky as can be, we all dream of winning the lottery afterall but that being said, many lottery winners end up bankrupt because they just didn't know how to make to keep money.
Keeping money is perhaps more important than making money.
The two compliment each other. Hard work is always part of how one takes advantage of luck, but that doesn't mean that luck isn't an important factor.
Being born into one household vs. another one is a matter of luck. Being in the right place for certain career paths is a matter of luck. Being charismatic, attractive or both is a matter of luck. Being brighter than average is a matter of luck, so is being below average.
All of those factors help contribute to one's outcomes, but none of them are the result of hard work.
Even if 'there's programs for the disabled' there's always a question of who counts and who doesn't. How profoundly disabled does one need to be? What if they're more profoundly disabled than has been recognized? Do we just ignore everyone who's below average, but not enough below to be profoundly disabled?
It seems like we're expected to ignore that we're not all actually equal and that as a result, outcomes aren't simply a matter of how hard one worked. Anyone who struggles must be at fault, and no matter how hard they actually work they just need to work a little harder because there couldn't possibly be more to their failures, they're just lazy.
It's a childishly naive mindset that shows a deep ignorance of actual peoples realities.
I think the problem is that people are not really on a spectrum but more like a giant radar chart. Some disabled people can do far better than some non-disabled people. Some with a great education might go nowhere while others who dropped out of high school might become millionaires. Others who are shy and placid might do financially really well while others who are the opposite of shy and placid who appear, at first glance at least like they will go far might end up burning all their bridges with everyone before they even get off the starting blocks.
There are so many factors from personality traits, education, location, flexibility (a good education might actually be counterproductive if it results in that person being stuck on a narrow career path), inherited wealth, immediate social circle, planning a robust strategy to invest, having kids at a young age.....the list is almost endless.
I noticed from my personal observations however that the main stumbling blocks are moving out of the parents home too early, not sharing bills, not learning to drive (deceptively important) and not doing enough hours. It's surprising how far ticking all these off the list can get people provided they don't sink into a low end job.
23 Jul 2023, 12:05 pm
funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2023, 12:09 pm
Nades wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Nades wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Again, most people seem to have no idea how much effort goes into being successful -- they only see the rewards.
Everyone likes to ignore that luck contributes to their successes, even when they can recognize that luck contributes to others successes.
Luck has gone into mine but to utilize it I still had to put the work in and by work I mean........a lot.
Luck is mostly only one of many factors. Lottery winners are a good example. Many of them are as lucky as can be, we all dream of winning the lottery afterall but that being said, many lottery winners end up bankrupt because they just didn't know how to make to keep money.
Keeping money is perhaps more important than making money.
The two compliment each other. Hard work is always part of how one takes advantage of luck, but that doesn't mean that luck isn't an important factor.
Being born into one household vs. another one is a matter of luck. Being in the right place for certain career paths is a matter of luck. Being charismatic, attractive or both is a matter of luck. Being brighter than average is a matter of luck, so is being below average.
All of those factors help contribute to one's outcomes, but none of them are the result of hard work.
Even if 'there's programs for the disabled' there's always a question of who counts and who doesn't. How profoundly disabled does one need to be? What if they're more profoundly disabled than has been recognized? Do we just ignore everyone who's below average, but not enough below to be profoundly disabled?
It seems like we're expected to ignore that we're not all actually equal and that as a result, outcomes aren't simply a matter of how hard one worked. Anyone who struggles must be at fault, and no matter how hard they actually work they just need to work a little harder because there couldn't possibly be more to their failures, they're just lazy.
It's a childishly naive mindset that shows a deep ignorance of actual peoples realities.
I think the problem is that people are not really on a spectrum but more like a giant radar chart. Some disabled people can do far better than some non-disabled people. Some with a great education might go nowhere while others who dropped out of high school might become millionaires. Others who are shy and placid might do financially really well while others who are the opposite of shy and placid who appear, at first glance at least like they will go far might end up burning all their bridges with everyone before they even get off the starting blocks.
There are so many factors from personality traits, education, location, flexibility (a good education might actually be counterproductive if it results in that person being stuck on a narrow career path), inherited wealth, immediate social circle, planning a robust strategy to invest, having kids at a young age.....the list is almost endless.
I noticed from my personal observations however that the main stumbling blocks are moving out of the parents home too early, not sharing bills, not learning to drive (deceptively important) and not doing enough hours. It's surprising how far ticking all these off the list can get people provided they don't sink into a low end job.
Unfortunately a huge segment of the population 'sink into a low end job' out of necessity. Life doesn't wait around for people to get their affairs sorted out, meaning a lot of people don't have the option of waiting until they're able to put a good foundation for the rest of their lives in place before having to start on the rest of their lives.
