Downloading discontinued media...

Post Reply New Topic

Law=politics. Only reason I placed this thread here. No clue where it goes, move it if you want.

What are your thoughts on this? I don't know what the law states, answer here plus add your opinions.

Is it and should it be legal/illegal to download discontinued media such as music that is completely impossible to obtain with a monetary transaction?

I'm more-so asking about indie stuff where a band had released a full length album independently and then forgetting all about it after they sign onto a major label? Take Old Friends From Young Years for example. I am a fan of everything that Papa Roach has released since their formation, but this album is the only truly decent album I can unbiasedly state they have ever put out. People only care about Infest when speaking of their nu metal period. Most people aren't even aware Old Friends... exists, because this is how it always goes in the industry. You forget about "Orange Drive Palms" and "Liquid Diet" and drool on "Last Resort" and "Between Angels And Insects."

The moral of the story is, you cannot "buy" this album. Except for those few lucky fans who got a limited pressing and signed reissue with a fan club membership, (of which I was unfortunate not to be).

Legal or illegal? Cool or uncool?

I've thought about this a lot because I used to run into the same problem a lot - many of the greatest albums either wholly unavailable or only on 12". At that rate I was kind of stuck and yes, opted to go the downloading route. At least my luck has been better in that I can find a lot of what I want anymore available on mp3 sales sites where I can get them in 320kbps easily enough, and of course with electronic music its strange - dj sets abound galore and its very popular for genre based sites to be loaded with mixes by various dj's, constantly revolved popular tunes in and out, I have to wonder though in the case of say pop/top 40 mixes, if those actually would get around the rules? Typically that seems like its the main target of RIAA (as in if you download some barely heard of Indie artist you may not hit their radar while a couple Eminem albums would raise some eyebrows?). I'm just trying to think logistics of course, they're trying to hit the suppliers, people with huge collections, and mainly the people they're trying to target are those hosting things put on by the major pop labels.

I don't know of course the full extent that the law is being applied, would be an interesting read though and, I can only imagine that they themselves have to realize that the rules of the music communities they're enforcing get fuzzier and fuzzier the further you get away from what typically sits on a record store's shelves (and yes, those too are rapidly going obsolete)

I don't know if you have heard of Creative Commons, I not you can legally download movies music documents
http://creativecommons.org/

This too if you want to go "legally."
http://www.archive.org/
The links at the top.

Generally speaking, no, it is not legal, unless they have since released it under a permissive license (as in abandonware). That is one of the big problems with current laws on licensing intellectual property: once the distributor shuts down, there is no legal avenue for people to obtain it. Enforcement in these cases is likely to be much more lax as no one is losing profit from such "illegal" downloads and so they would have a harder time taking you to court, since in the US, you can only bring a lawsuit if you can demonstrate that you have been directly harmed. So there is a loophole here: it is technically illegal, but no one actually has legal standing to hold you accountable for it in court.

Morally, I can't see a problem with pirating out-of-production stuff. If it's possible to obtain something legally, then there's no excuse for stealing it, but when it's been discontinued there is no strictly legal channel to go through.

USA: AUDIO HOME RECORDING ACT Section 1008
Summary:
Individuals are PERMITTED to build, purchase, and use analog and digital recording devices and analog and digital recording media.
Charging of copyright infringement is PROHIBITED against an individual on the basis of possessing, making, importing, using recording devices and recordable media.

Individuals can't pirate. Anyway, How can one person rob a ship all by their self?

Why can't you download, but you can use a CD RECORDER to copy a CD?
It probably costs the same as an ipod, and sounds better, and lasts longer.
You can record CDs from radio with them too.

Computers are "Consumer Class Products", you consume them and make poopie.
These days even "professional" ones are, unless they are over 15 years old.
Real computers don't get sick and need antivirus medicine.
How the heck can antivirus fix a computer better than who made it anyway?
Anyway, anything you download won't work anymore in a year so why bother?

That simply says individuals are allowed to own VCRs, CD/DVD burners, CD/DVD-R discs, etc. They're saying you can't accuse someone of copyright infringement simply because they own a DVD burner. They aren't saying individuals can't be accused of copyright infringement.


You can't do that, either- it would be unauthorized reproduction. You're allowed to have the CD burner to use to burn stuff legally, but it's still possible to use it for illegal purposes, such as duplicating copyrighted material.

Though it is a little off topic, there was a book written by Daniel Defoe called Robinson Crusoe ...

Great book! One of my favourites.

Basically it's plausible deniability?

Sounds like the situation with BitTorrent legality, except it's easy to prove that illegal use is ocurring.

*double post*

Last edited by CowboyFromHell on 16 Jan 2010, 12:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

As you're well aware, "piracy" does not refer only to swashbuckling desperadoes on the high seas, but is a generally used term whose meaning, in this context, is obtaining creative works without paying.

I say that if a work is long out of print / pressing / whatever, and there's no way to compensate the artist, then download away, but if you subsequently get the chance to compensate the artist and generally promote them, do so.

Then why are there so many copyrighted books and music and movies at the
LIBRARY and why are there COPYING MACHINES and RECORDING DEVICES there?
And why doesn't the Librarian call the Police if someone puts a book or disc
in one?