Starship Troopers

Post Reply New Topic

Is it just me or is American society a lot like Starship Troopers in that any and all benefits are reserved only for the military with regards to healthcare and education opportunities? A kind of thing where one has to pay direct tribute to the nation before they can actually start to have any benefits.

A profession that asks for your death should at least grant you a life. Also, who has more invested in a country than its soldiers?

That is not the question nor the direction of this.

in my view "a profession that asks for your death" attracts the irrational.
I don't think we should encourage them.

-Jake

I wouldn't say that. For many people, it's a pragmatic way to get healthcare and an education as well as a decent salary. It's a means of escaping poverty. That said, there are some who are irrational and are attracted to the more perverse aspects of it.

Hah, any talk of Starship Troopers instantly makes me picture this song from the 2nd or 3rd movie (don't know or care )
Enjoy the utter cheese
Starship Troopers song (<-- Link)

thank you for reeling me in from too strong a statement.
my view has been modified to
people who join "a profession that asks for your death" for that fact are irrational
death cultists.I don't think we should encourage them.
people who join for other reasons are poor folks who are getting screwed.
-Jake

I personally think it is fair that soldiers who in many cases are returning from near continuous overseas deployments should be given extra opportunities since they have given up a great deal of time. One cannot get a formal education much other than ballistics crouching behind a koala wall.

The society of Starship Troopers was a low tax very libertarian society. In order to vote, one had to serve a hitch in the armed forces. However there was no draft and those who chose not to be citizens (ones with the right to vote) retained all their rights. Rights were respected whether or not a person served in the armed forces.

To put a point on it, it was nothing like the U.S. of today which is a high tax society and only semi-free.

ruveyn

"Starship Troopers" was a very stupid book.

However Heinlein's point that people should EARN the right to vote has some merit.

In the early days only people who owned property were allowed to vote.

Why?

ruveyn

Well, you had these bugs from another solar system light years away. Somehow they could spit or fart big rocks that could not only achieve escape velocity but hit individual cities on earth even though it would take thousands of years to get here.

So we send men with machine guns to fight them on the ground instead of just nuking the whole freaking planet.

Or, in other words, a work of pure fiction.

The problem with this is that those with a vote then arrange things so that those without property cannot acquire land of their own. Were it not for the tenacity and organization of early American squatters, the USA would consist of vast baronies and corporate holdings run by old money European families. I'm presuming here that you are an American.

Originally the colonies were parcelled out to nobles and they were going to exploit it with tenant farmers, ie: no-vote serfs. Instead the tired and hungry masses plunked their asses when and where they pleased, and by the time the absentee landlords showed up, the land had been surveyed in a matter favourable to average folk. I am sure this is rarely mentioned in American History class but its one of the times the privileged got their comeuppance.

Still, that was a time when only the landed could vote, but you see the effects: suddenly working class people were influencing government, and soon enough, the vote was extended to everybody.

This was certainly an improvement to a democratic society. Your preference, not so much.

I think a more interesting speculative government is Fedgov in The World Jones Made by dick.
people are allowed to believe whatever they want but unless thay can prove it scientifical they can't make other people.

-Jake

My take on the movie, and the point the OP might have been trying to make, is that Starship Troopers paints a scary future.

America (and let's stick with America for this illustration), holds that ALL citizens are born into citizenship. You have it by right of being born here. If you were born elsewhere, you can chose to become a citizen and prove you are worthy, but that's about immigration more than anything else.

All citizens are equal before the law in every respect.

Starship Troopers paints a world where you have CIVILIANS (everyone is born a civilian) and CITIZENS. You had to earn citizenship (military service was the easiest way to gain it)...I suppose to get it without serving you had to do something to prove your value and contribution to society.

This created a two-tier system of rights. Citizens (often veterans) got preferred treatment for everything. Civilians had to take a number and hope to get what they wanted. This stratification of society encouraged people to join the military in large numbers because they'd get the benefits without having to work hard and hope what they did met with the approval of the powers that be.

In current society, I know we treat veterans like trash (as a government), but if you watch how society (ordinary folk) regard those who have served, it can be eerie. The preference a military veteran is shown in many situations can be scary because the opportunity should be a question of character or ability and having served IS NOT a blanket proof of being hard working, trustworthy or of good character. It's disheartening to see someone who did time in the military be granted things based on this social affinity many hold for those who have served while those of us who did not (or could not) serve are passed over even though we worked very hard and have proven ourselves capable of doing that that opportunity would ask of us.

If they ever came about and said that rights had to be earned, it would be a dark day. I agree that it sounds like a good idea...many do not appreciate the rights they enjoy and what it takes to preserve those rights, but when you make a right something that must be earned, it is no longer a right.